Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

UFC 74

Gabriel Gonzaga -125
Randy Couture -105

Georges St. Pierre -260
Josh Koscheck +200

UFC 75

Quinton Jackson -155
Dan Henderson +125

Mirko Cro Cop -365
Cheick Kongo +285

Michael Bisping -215
Matt Hamill +175

Seems like Kos might have value. The Couture/Gonzaga line is interesting.

EDIT: These are from Bodog.

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

I'd say Henderson and Bisping have a lot of value.

EDIT: Also Couture.

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

very interesting lines, gonna have to think about these.

Bisping does look juicy.

and the Randy vs Gonz line is very interesting.

thx for post.

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

I think Henderson is the juiciest line here.

How is bisping's takedown defense? I've never seen him against a good wrestler, which hamill is. Bisping will be the clear favorite, but i guess i don't really know enough at this point to say -215 is value.

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

I think Bisping is more vonurable to a submission artist rather then a wrestler. I'm going to wait and see if the line moves any but I really think this is a set up for him to win fight that I don't see him losing.

Henderson is a goot one too. Stylistically though, Jackson is a good boxing practitioner rather then Wandy who is wild so don't let that performance influence it just as don't let Jackson vs Liddell influence you to him.

Jackson has a great sprawl, and I think technically has the better stand up if he sticks to his boxing aspect of it.

Both have great GNP. Both have GREAT chins.

Jackson naturally bigger.

I think Henderson will want to get on top of Jackson. And I think Jackson wouldnt mind it standing or being on top of Hendo.

Can't make a solid predict now, gotta think about it,

I think the line for Jackson might get better too.

Interested to hear others thoughts cause if you can convince this fight really is truly even, Id love to make a bet on Hendo, just hesitate to pull that trigger now without really having that strong feeling for it.

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

Take the Hendo and run. Two of my favorite fighters, but Hendo should take this fight the majority of the time. I don't care how good your sprawl is when you're fighting Hendo who is a top 3 wrestler in mma. Jackson has the strength advantage and maybe a slight standup advantage. Hendo by GnP TKO in round 4.

Bisping-Hamill. I got Hamill in this fight. Bisping has been fed cans and is extremely overrated. Hamill is one hell of a wrestler. 3 time college champ in 3 different weight classes. Plus during TUF, Bisping tried to take him down and couldn't...Hamill wasn't using his hands. Hamill trained under Tito who love him or hate him was a GnP master during his prime. I see Hamill winning by a lay and pray boring fight.

Cro Cop easy round 1 TKO

GSP by however he wants it to end.

Havn't decided the HW fight as I havn't seen much of Gonzaga. Should be a coinflip situation.

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

i saw stevenson -245/ pellegrino +175

aside from the horrid juice, this is an intriguing matchup.. stevenson has an edge in size/experience while kurt has speed/endurance; neither offers much on the feet, this bout has adcc written all over it..

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

[ QUOTE ]
UFC 74

Gabriel Gonzaga -125
Randy Couture -105

Georges St. Pierre -260
Josh Koscheck +200

UFC 75

Quinton Jackson -155
Dan Henderson +125

Mirko Cro Cop -365
Cheick Kongo +285

Michael Bisping -215
Matt Hamill +175

Seems like Kos might have value. The Couture/Gonzaga line is interesting.

EDIT: These are from Bodog.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ick... can lines better than 30 cents be found?

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

i def think GSP is the favorite but i wouldnt be surprised if the line gets pushed so far in his favor that i end up on Kos on this one. I think the right line is somewhere around +250 so we will see where it ends up. i think it is an interesting style match up and Kos is such a strong wrestler that aside from the very very best he will be able to LnP his way to decisions fairly regularly. he is so good that he may even be able to put GSP on his back and win a decision. few people have the take down defense that GSP has but noone ive seen has a shot comparable to Kos's. it Kos cant take him down it is gonna be a very tough night for him for sure. Even if he can take him down i think he will still be a significant underdog but depending on where the line ends up there may be value in Kos, imo.

the rampage fight is also interesting to me. should be competitive and essentially a coinflip imo. may not be a great syle matchup for dan but he is so good that i think it is anybodys game. i would love to see him win and then take on sylvia to try to get ahold of all 4 belts.

the couture/gonzaga fight is hard to pick for me. i dont know that much about gonzaga but from what ive seen he looks good. couture may find himself having a tough time with him. he said himself that he would rather face cro cop and this could be telling (although he may have picked cro cop to win and have been playing a mind game). id have to think this is close to a coinflip as well although i may be leaning a little towards gonzaga.

the bisping/hamill fight is pretty line dependant imo. hamill may be a great wrestler but he obv does not like to get hit and regardless of whether or not bisping is over rated he is explosive and i just think there is too good a chance of him catching him at some point and knocking him out. id have to think he is a significant favorite in this one.

all in all i havent seen anything im too excited to bet on yet (that generally doesnt stop me though)

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

I just can't see myself betting and routing for Koscheck and routing against GSP. I HATE Kos and love GSP. I also already bet on Gonzaga, BUT if Fedor does fight the winner of this fight just imagine if Randy does win this fight. I think the odds on the Fedor/Randy fight would be so juicy in Fedors favor that it would be very +ev. All the people betting on Randy because he beat Tim and Gonzaga who really have no clue what Fedor is about swaying the line in favor of him. Should be interesting what happens in the future with these 3 fighters ..

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

[ QUOTE ]
I just can't see myself betting and routing for Koscheck and routing against GSP. I HATE Kos and love GSP. I also already bet on Gonzaga, BUT if Fedor does fight the winner of this fight just imagine if Randy does win this fight. I think the odds on the Fedor/Randy fight would be so juicy in Fedors favor that it would be very +ev. All the people betting on Randy because he beat Tim and Gonzaga who really have no clue what Fedor is about swaying the line in favor of him. Should be interesting what happens in the future with these 3 fighters ..

[/ QUOTE ]

Meh, the randy/fedor line wont get very out of hand, because it will start reasonalbe (maybe +Ev, but nothing to jump for joy at), and every time it inches towards randy guys like us will pound it back to the true line. There are a lot of people who will bet fedor really heavy here when they see any line improvement.

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

I am all over GOnzaga i think this dude wins this fight 70% of the time good on the ground and standing

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

[ QUOTE ]
I am all over GOnzaga i think this dude wins this fight 70% of the time good on the ground and standing

[/ QUOTE ]

Based on this, I'm going to bet the farm on Napao.

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

i cant see the sportsbooks letting the fedor line get too out of whack either. to me i hope randy loses before he would have to face fedor because i think it would be ugly. i mean its anyone vs fedor can be ugly but randy is just too small imo.

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

Dana White should be doing everything humanly possible to get Fedor the next title shot. If he blows the Wanderlei deal and the Fedor deal, then he is going to be hated by all.

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

The Bodog lines have shifted a little

Gabriel Gonzaga -130
Randy Couture EVEN

Georges St. Pierre -260
Josh Koscheck +195

Quinton Jackson -150
Dan Henderson +120

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

[ QUOTE ]
Dana White should be doing everything humanly possible to get Fedor the next title shot. If he blows the Wanderlei deal and the Fedor deal, then he is going to be hated by all.

[/ QUOTE ]

Give him time, it's not all going to happen in a couple months. He's already gotten cro cop, rampage, big nog, hendo, shogun, etc. I believe that within a year from now, almost everyone will be in the ufc. patience my friend, just let it unfold. Wandy and Fedor will both be in the ufc with a high probability.

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

If the line on Rampage can get down to the -125 or lower range, I'll def be making a big bet. Also hoping the Gonzaga line gets better, looking to get at least even money....

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

The problem is if he is going to continue to spread rumors about fighters that don't sign with him immediately. Look at all the [censored] regarding Wanderlei currently.

Look at what he offered Sokoudjou...20k a fight after he destroys Arona and Lil Nog. I know he isn't worth the 200k per fight he's going to get, but that offer is insulting. Who know how many others he has done or is doing it too.

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

enjoy..

MIXED MARTIAL ARTS - Aug 25
UFC 74: RESPECT - MANDALAY BAY, LAS VEGAS, NV -
- $250 LIMIT -
8:30 PM
GABRIEL GONZAGA -130
RANDY COUTURE EV

8:30 PM
JOSH KOSCHECK +190
GEORGES ST PIERRE -230

8:30 PM
KURT PELLEGRINO +190
JOE STEVENSON -240

MIXED MARTIAL ARTS - Sep 08
UFC 75: LONDON - O2 ARENA, UK -$250 LIMIT
1:00 PM
DAN HENDERSON +120
QUINTON JACKSON -150

1:00 PM
CHEICK KONGO +280
MIRKO "CRO COP" FILIPOVIC -340

1:00 PM
MATT HAMILL +190
MICHAEL BISPING -240

MIXED MARTIAL ARTS - Sep 19
UFC FIGHT NIGHT 11:
- THE PALMS LAS VEGAS - $250 LIMIT -
7:00 PM
CHRIS LEBEN +140
MIKE SWICK -170

7:00 PM
SPENCER FISHER -115
DIN THOMAS -115

7:00 PM
KUNIYOSHI HIRONAKA +160
THIAGO ALVES -200

MIXED MARTIAL ARTS - Sep 22
UFC 76:
- ANAHEIM CALIFORNIA - $250 LIMIT -
8:00 PM
KEITH JARDINE +225
CHUCK LIDDELL -285

8:00 PM
DIEGO SANCHEZ EV
JON FITCH -130

8:00 PM
LYOTO MACHIDA +170
MAURICIO RUA -210

MIXED MARTIAL ARTS - Sep 28
CFFC 6 - HEAVY HANDS -
ATLANTIC CITY, NJ - $250 LIMIT -
8:00 PM
TANK ABBOT +240
KIMBO SLICE -300

MIXED MARTIAL ARTS - Oct 28
UFC 77:
- CINCINNATI, OHIO - $250 -
8:00 PM
RICH FRANKLIN +165
ANDERSON SILVA -205

8:00 PM
RASHAD EVANS EV
TITO ORTIZ -130

MIXED MARTIAL ARTS - Nov 24
UFC 78:
- NEWARK, NEW JERSEY -$250 LIMIT -
8:00 PM
SEAN SHERK +145
BJ PENN -175

MIXED MARTIAL ARTS - Dec 29
UFC 79:
- LAS VEGAS - $250 LIMIT -
8:00 PM
MATT SERRA +275
MATT HUGHES -345

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

I AM SO ANGRY ABOUT LIDDELL/JARDINE OANDSKLFAKSDJGHKASDJNFKMASDNFIOUHE FU DANA FU FU FU FU

AND I DEFEND YOU ALL THE TIME FROM PRIDENUTHUGGERS SADFLHSDFASDFKH

Without the hyperbole, this is soooooo bad it's comical. I might not watch the whole thing just out of principle, except that shogun is fighting so i think i have to [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img].

Why not Houston? Why not Forrest? Or Bisping? Somebody who is coming off a WIN, not somebody who got vicously KTFO by an utter unknown?

Chuck = 6 title fights in a row.
Jardine = Once beat Forrest???

OMG

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

[ QUOTE ]
I AM SO ANGRY ABOUT LIDDELL/JARDINE OANDSKLFAKSDJGHKASDJNFKMASDNFIOUHE FU DANA FU FU FU FU

AND I DEFEND YOU ALL THE TIME FROM PRIDENUTHUGGERS SADFLHSDFASDFKH

Without the hyperbole, this is soooooo bad it's comical. I might not watch the whole thing just out of principle, except that shogun is fighting so i think i have to [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img].

Why not Houston? Why not Forrest? Or Bisping? Somebody who is coming off a WIN, not somebody who got vicously KTFO by an utter unknown?

Chuck = 6 title fights in a row.
Jardine = Once beat Forrest???

OMG

[/ QUOTE ]

Isn't there drama about the Shogun fight too? I thought I heard neither he nor his management have heard anything personally from Dana bout him fighting Machida.

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

i have only very recently got into UFC, but the jardine-liddell matchup struck me as really stupid too. it's almost more a match where the person who loses will have to fall way, way down the totem pole, than a match where the winner gets a big bump.

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

Why not....
Houston: He'd KO Liddell and Dana does not want Chuck to lose 2 in a row.
Forrest: Needs to win 1 more for a big fight. Plus, he wants Shogun.
Bisping: Fighting Hamill already. Plus, he is very overrated and Dana doesn't want to expose the TUF winner to a KO.

He should have put Forrest vs Shogun and Chuck vs Machida, but once again Dana doesn't want Chuck to lose again.

I'm just pissed that it's the main event. 2 fighters that just got KTFO easily should not be a main event. If he gets a title shot after the win I'd also be really pissed.

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

Houston is too much of an unknown. He's probably a big underdog, but Dana wouldn't want to take a chance with an unestablished fighter. Also, he already has a fight lined up.

Griffin would make perfect sense. He's a bigger draw than Jardine, but it's more of a sacrifice when he loses.

As biggums said, there's no way he's going to sacrifice Bisping, and Bisping has a fight lined up anyway.

The ufc needed someone with decent exposure, who has a long enough record to conclude that they're a big underdog to Liddell. Given that they aren't doing the big Silva fight, he can wait until after his September fight to face a top contender again. Lambert, Griffin, and Jardine seem like the only reasonable options, and Lambert already has a fight coming up. While I think Griffin would be a better choice, either he didn't want the fight, or the ufc doesn't want to sacrifice him.

Machida/Shogun will be a tough fight, and the winner definitely deserves a title shot. While I don't want to see Shogun lose, it's the only way for him to earn an instant shot. I hope the fight goes through.

[ QUOTE ]
I'm just pissed that it's the main event. 2 fighters that just got KTFO easily should not be a main event. If he gets a title shot after the win I'd also be really pissed.

[/ QUOTE ]

Liddell's a huge draw. Not using him as a main event would be a waste of resources. You'd end up with overlapping draws. Liddell most likely isn't getting an instant title shot after his next fight, especially if Rampage beats Henderson, so there's no reason to give Jardine a shot if he beats Liddell. Shogun is supposedly getting a shot if he wins his first fight, so most likely the next shot goes to the winner of Shogun/Machida.

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

[ QUOTE ]

Machida/Shogun will be a tough fight, and the winner definitely deserves a title shot. While I don't want to see Shogun lose, it's the only way for him to earn an instant shot. I hope the fight goes through.


[/ QUOTE ]

They could have just given him a title shot vs the winner of Hendo-Rampage. He is the #1 LHW in the world after all...

Hendo got instant title shot and Fedor will as well. Why not Shogun?

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

[ QUOTE ]
Why not....
Houston: He'd KO Liddell and Dana does not want Chuck to lose 2 in a row.

2 fighters that just got KTFO easily should not be a main event. If he gets a title shot after the win I'd also be really pissed.

[/ QUOTE ]

can you pls count to 10 first, the next time you feel like piping in? the more you talk, the sillier you look

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

ooo a Chuck fanboy has arrived. Chuck's weakness is strikers which is why he has been fed grappler after grappler. I'm not saying that Houston's a lock...but I'd pick him over Liddell.

I understand the position from a business point of view as Chuck is a fan favorite because of the UFC hype machine. They can still put it on the main card and hype it to fans like they did to the Tito/Rashad match. No reason to hype that match other than the fact that it's Tito.

I wouldn't put it past Dana to give him a title shot if Hendo wins. He likes Chuck...the fans like Chuck.. and he's more marketable than Hendo. He is also known for giving former champions very quick paths to a title shot.

Maybe I'm wrong and maybe I'm right. My past performance has told me that I'm right more often than I'm wrong. Nothing is a 100% lock in MMA which is one reason I like it so much.

Maybe you'd like to say why you think I'm wrong in everything I've said in this thread instead of what you just did.

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

Split Decision Dan is going down now that he doesn't have the Japanese judges helping him out.

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

[ QUOTE ]
Maybe you'd like to say why you think I'm wrong in everything I've said in this thread instead of what you just did.

[/ QUOTE ]

no, not maybe, you're wrong

[ QUOTE ]
ooo a Chuck fanboy has arrived.

[/ QUOTE ]

where?

[ QUOTE ]
Chuck's weakness is strikers which is why he has been fed grappler after grappler.

[/ QUOTE ]

what exactly is overeem, metzger, belfort, suloev etc.. genius?

[ QUOTE ]
Maybe you'd like to say why you think I'm wrong in everything I've said in this thread instead of what you just did.

[/ QUOTE ]

i didn't think i need stress something plainly self-evident to you, but apparently i do.. so fine


[ QUOTE ]
Houston: He'd KO Liddell and Dana does not want Chuck to lose 2 in a row.

[/ QUOTE ]

uh yea okay, houston is gonna ko chuck via what? your imagination? the same guy who charged in and got dropped to a knee by one of jardine's slapping wrist punches? what do you think one of liddell's overhand right which ko'd iron-chined fighters like randy/horn/tito etc is going to do to him?

houston also did most of his damage after jardine got lazy w/ him in the clinch and got uppercuted to death.. do you really think w/ chuck's footwork which eluded good greco-roman wrestlers such as randy and babalu who lived off the clinch that houston is actually going to get that close?

houston isn't fighting chuck at this stage b/c he doesn't deserve it. this is the same houston who lost to medina, a 16-10 fighter who got ko'd by trigg/gideon ray/derrick noble. in fact, aside from the jardine fight, the opponents he has beaten has a combined record of (34-78), but somehow in all of a one fight which he was almost ko'd initially you're convinced he'd fu-k chuck? okay..

so explain if jardine doesn't DESERVE a fight w/ chuck w/ a much better record, then why does houston deserve one again?

[ QUOTE ]
2 fighters that just got KTFO easily should not be a main event.

[/ QUOTE ]

so by your brilliant logic, the likes of gsp/hughes/crocop/franklin etc doesn't deserve to be the main event ever either b/c they were ko'd in one of their fights?

way to go hoss, so who is left that DO deserve to be in the main event then? matt serra and chris lytle?

ktfo so easily?? you do realize chuck was simply unlucky/underprepared that day right? you make it sound like chuck has a fragile chin and gets routinely put lights-out. aside from his previous fight, can you show me another instance of him being put down by a one-shot ko? go ahead.. i'm waiting.


[ QUOTE ]
If he gets a title shot after the win I'd also be really pissed.


[/ QUOTE ]

really? okay mmaster, who do YOU think deserves a title shot if not the guy who successfully defended the championship belt 5 straight times after he wins a fight against a top 5 division contender?

shogun? wandy? what exactly have they done in the ufc to justify the title-shot if chuck doesn't "deserve" it? combined they have ZERO fights in ufc but apparently they deserve it more than the 6 time lhw titleholder who also have 2 wins over the current hw champ? outrageously humourous..

who else is left then? lambert can't beat rashad. rashad can't beat tito and don't deserve a shot until he does.. tito can't beat stamina. forest and gouveia can't beat jardine.. bisping and machida you can barely make a case for, but i don't see why they deserve it anymore than chuck after winning 2 straight against semi-mediocre competition (in bisping's case) and unimpressively (machida's case). so you tell me hoss: WHO "DESERVES" a title-shot if chuck doesn't if he wins against jardine?

[ QUOTE ]
Maybe I'm wrong and maybe I'm right. My past performance has told me that I'm right more often than I'm wrong.

[/ QUOTE ]

no, your past posting performance indicated that you're wrong.. period

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

They're very unlikely to give Liddell an instant title shot after beating Jardine. There are two main reasons for this. Rampage might beat Henderson, in which case he will still be champ when Liddell beats Jardine. They aren't going to give him an easy shot against someone he's 0-2 against, even if he's Chuck Liddell. The other reason is that White has stated he wants to give Shogun a title shot if he wins his first fight. Since his first fight is supposed to be in September, that means he gets the next title shot after Rampage/Henderson. Which means they can't give Liddell a shot after Jardine, unless they want him to sit on his ass for 6 months, which is a big waste of a draw.

Obviously Jardine wouldn't get it if he won, with his recent loss to Alexander. The winner of the Tito/Rashad Rematch, and the possible coming of Wanderlei Silva puts other people high up in the contender picture. There are plenty of people he can fight for a title shot if he manages to beat Liddell.

[ QUOTE ]
shogun? wandy? what exactly have they done in the ufc to justify the title-shot if chuck doesn't "deserve" it? combined they have ZERO fights in ufc but apparently they deserve it more than the 6 time lhw titleholder who also have 2 wins over the current hw champ? outrageously humourous..

[/ QUOTE ]

You're ignoring the fact that UFC brass respects accomplishments in Pride as much as the UFC, as should you. They fast tracked CroCop to a title shot, even though he blew it, and Nog looks like he's speeding along too. The only reason CroCop didn't get an instant shot is his lack of recognition to UFC fans. They seem prepared to give Fedor an instant shot, and they gave Henderson an instant shot. Number of fights in the UFC only matters from a marketing standpoint, from a skill/accomplishment standpoint, Pride fights are just as good, if not better.

The Shogun situation is similar to the CroCop situation. He doesn't hold the primary belt, nor has he ever held it, and he doesn't have recognition. It's hard to market someone as the #1 LHW in the world when UFC fans haven't heard of him.

Even if they give Liddell a shot after beating Jardine, it's no sillier than giving Hughes a shot after beating Lytle.

[ QUOTE ]
who else is left then? lambert can't beat rashad. rashad can't beat tito and don't deserve a shot until he does.. tito can't beat stamina. forest and gouveia can't beat jardine.. bisping and machida you can barely make a case for, but i don't see why they deserve it anymore than chuck after winning 2 straight against semi-mediocre competition (in bisping's case) and unimpressively (machida's case). so you tell me hoss: WHO "DESERVES" a title-shot if chuck doesn't if he wins against jardine?

[/ QUOTE ]

You still seem to be missing a critical point. By the time Liddell finishes off Jardine, Machida will have another fight under his belt. If he wins he'll have beaten the #1 ranked LHW in the world. Along with a 3-0 UFC record, and wins over some big names. Also, his wins were impressive. They just weren't exciting. It's often harder to dominate someone for 3 rounds like he does than it is to knock someone out in a couple of minues.

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

[ QUOTE ]
They're very unlikely to give Liddell an instant title shot after beating Jardine.

[/ QUOTE ]

but that doesn't mean he does not "deserve" it, which is my only contention w/ the other posting..

[ QUOTE ]
Even if they give Liddell a shot after beating Jardine, it's no sillier than giving Hughes a shot after beating Lytle.

[/ QUOTE ]

exactly, so what does anyone have to be upset about?

[ QUOTE ]

You still seem to be missing a critical point.

[/ QUOTE ]

i'm not, my only point is that just b/c others are likely to get a title-shot before chuck due to circumstance does NOT mean they "deserve" it.

i understand the lhw situation completely. i also love machida, however to that at the current pt in time he deserves a title-shot more so than chuck is ridiculous. fwiw i think he makes a better main event opp for chuck than jardine, infintely more than houston.. but that was beyond the original pt i was making..

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

Re: Nog

He's supposed to fight Cro Cop if Cro Cop gets by Kongo.

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

Who exactly has Metzger and Belfort beat that make them world class strikers? Getting beat by top competition over and over again doesn't make you a good fighter. Chuck gets a fight against a world class striker in Rampage and gets dominated twice.

2 fighters that in their previous fight were completely dominated shouldn't be a main event. Stop being rediculous. Chuck got unlucky? Put Chuck against a top 5 and he will be knocked out over and over.

How does Jardine deserve it more than Houston? He got KTFO in a minute by Houston.

Who deserves a title shot if chuck beats Jardine? Definitely not Chuck. Jardine isn't even top 20 in the division. How about Shogun? Or is he not good enough for you.

Who cares if he has held the belt in the UFC for a while or not. Simple fact is if he and Coutoure were in Pride they wouldn't have been close to holding a title ever. Why aree you hating on Prid so much? A year ago they had 100x more talent than the UFC. The only division that the UFC was better in was WW.

Why bring up Matt Hughes? My point was that Dana likes to give quick title shots to people who don't deserve them...thanks?
Maybe you'd like to post your record if you don't think mine is good enough....cmon I'm waiting...

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

[ QUOTE ]
*blah blah blah* pride rulez!!!11 >> ufc

[/ QUOTE ]

100X more talent than ufc? wow big talker.. slow down there. are you referring to the pride that has their lw champ dominated by nick diaz and 2nd top hw contender rhk into oblivion by gonzaga? or are you referring to the pride in which their 3rd hw was almost ko'd by herring of all people and their 4th gotten outpointed by arlovski?

how exactly does that make pride "100x better" again?

who has vitor belfort beat that was any good? how about your hero wandy silva for one in 22secs of blitzkrieg? or maybe silva isn't any good.. after all he was also dominated by tito of all people.. but he's the ex-pride champ; and pride >> ufc!1.. LOGIC OVERLOAD..

[ QUOTE ]

Maybe you'd like to post your record if you don't think mine is good enough....cmon I'm waiting...

[/ QUOTE ]

wait.. i'm confused, when did you post your record again? we are talking about betting record correct?

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

1 fight does not make a career. Lets take a look at who belfort has lost against... Hendo, Overeem, Tito, Randy, Sakuraba. but omg he beat Wandy 9 years ago.

Anyone can see that Gomi didn't take the fight seriously...it wasn't a title fight. Add to the fact that Diaz is a huge mismatch for LWs because of his size and you get the domination. It would be tough for Diaz to make 155. Diaz is a WW not a LW. Good try though.

So Crop Cop loses his first fight in a cage and that's all you base it off of. Name the UFC HW's that are better than Cro Cop please (not the ones that come from pride). Crop Cop fights Gonzaga 10 times he wins 8 of them.

Who do you think the 4th HW is? Werdum? Wow shows how much you know. Try Barnett dude.

Nice try with the Big Nog but your limited knowledge comes into play once again. Herring is a Pride fighter that just moved to UFC. Very nice attempt though. Big Nog still won too.

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

do you know what a credible meaningful debate is? it's when both sides backup their arguments w/ credible evidence.

let me sum up our current interactions so far:

do
{
me: present argument, *presents evidence to backup argument*
you: "your evidence suck b/c i said so! so shut up b/c i'm SO GREAT!" *presents NO evidence to backup ANYTHING*
}
while (thread IS Alive)

i'm still waiting for any piece of evidence so far that pride is 100X >> ufc, or how chuck is so chinny-chin-chin.. all you been doing so far is covering your ears and stomping your feet in the face of anything i present.. just b/c YOU don't think liddell is within top 5 or jardine is within top 20 lhw DOES NOT make it so. the fact that you cant present any evidence to support your contention is why you arguments look so silly to anyone knowledgeable or logical..

here's a simple example of what i'm talking about:

you can't refute the fact that pride elite contenders currently is under-performing against their expectations in ufc. so you chose to blindly ignore the obvious evidence by proclaiming nonsensically that barnett >> werdum, so werdum's loss to aa is meaningless. and nog almost being ko'd is somehow justified b/c herring is a "pride" fighter.

so then by your "logic": sakuraba is then an ufc fighter, wandy is an "ufc" fighter, and barnett is an "ufc" fighter (you oh so proud number 3 hw).. see how that works?

ps: i hope it was a joke that you sent me a link to your fantasy mmaplayground record as proof of your "greatness". only thing that proves is you have no credibility in term real mma betting, why would anyone even remotely confident in their own capping ability NOT be betting REAL money?

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

What does betting real money have anything to do with my ability to pick who wins fights? Whether it's 0$ or 100$ it doesn't matter if I pick correctly. You asked to see my record and I showed you. I'm not trying to prove my so called 'greatness', but I'd like to see your picking history.

Look at Anderson and Rampage. They couldn't come close to the belt in Pride and now they are holding belts in the UFC. Can you explain this or do you still believe that UFC>Pride? Look at MMA rankings that show that former Pride fighters are ranked higher than UFC fighters. The level of competition in Pride was much higher and they didn't protect their fighters like Dana did to Liddell.

Barnett, Wandy, Sakuraba all have more Pride fights than UFC. Combined they have 63 Pride fights and 12 UFC fights. Keep making yourself look stupid.

Did you ever think they are underperforming because the rules are different between the two organizations? It takes time to adjust to the new rules and the cage.

The fact that you beliebe Werdum is better than Barnett instantly ruinds any credibility that you have. I never said it was meaningless, but you stated that Werdum was the #4 HW in Pride which was a flat out lie. Your whole point was that UFC fighters was wooping up on Pride fighters so what does Herring v Nog prove? Nog still won the fight anyways

Chuck can't take world class strikers...virtually nobody but you denies this. He absolutely destroys grapplers and B level strikers. He's still in my top 10 but top 5 is a stretch with his lack of competition.

Any real fan of MMA knows that Pride was leagues ahead than the UFC until the takeover. It's not really up for debate as there is such a large gap.

HW: 4 out of top 5 are Pride-1 UFC
LHW: 4 out of top 5 are Pride-1 UFC
MW: 3 out of top 5 are Pride-2 UFC
WW: 0 out of the top 5 are Pride-5 UFC
LW: 3 out of the top 5 are Pride-2 UFC

http://www.mmaplayground.com/top-10-...spx?Display=LW

http://www.mmaweekly.com/absolutenm/...&zoneid=15

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

biggums,

This is a sports betting board. We typically bet money. You are in the wrong forum. Please remove yourself to "Sporting Events". Aceshigh7 and gregatron need some competition.

Re: Early UFC 74/75 Lines
 

I gave my opinion on who would win on the fights. Yes the thread has been derailed but I'm not the only person making off topic posts here.