aggresion
 

tight table 2-3 players average per flop..should i be more aggresive? or am i worring abot pocket queens too much?

Party Poker 0.05/0.10 Hold'em (7 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Preflop: Hero is CO with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
UTG calls, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">BB 3-bets</font>, UTG folds, <font color="#CC3333">Hero caps</font>, BB calls.

Flop: (9.40 SB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">BB bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, BB calls.

Turn: (6.70 BB) J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">BB bets</font>, Hero calls.

River: (8.70 BB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">BB bets</font>, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 10.70 BB

Re: aggresion
 

I'd raise again on the turn and call down if 3 bet. if he just calls your turn raise and donks the river then I would just call. If he checks the river then I'd bet.

Re: aggresion
 

I'm assuming you have no reads here since you posted none. The donk on the turn definitely smells QQ or JJ to me. Without any reads, I'm playing this the exact same way.

Re: aggresion
 

[ QUOTE ]
The donk on the turn definitely smells QQ or JJ to me.

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He's ahead if he has QQ or JJ

Re: aggresion
 

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I'd raise again on the turn and call down if 3 bet. if he just calls your turn raise and donks the river then I would just call. If he checks the river then I'd bet.

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Re: aggresion
 

[ QUOTE ]
I'd raise again on the turn and call down if 3 bet. if he just calls your turn raise and donks the river then I would just call. If he checks the river then I'd bet.

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I think we can consider ourselves WA/WB here. If he has the other AA we chop, if he has KK or AQ he has two outs, but if he has QQ or JJ we have two outs.

I'd rather let him keep betting with KK/AQ then open ourselves up to getting owned by a set.

Re: aggresion
 

You have to raise here somewhere. Realling no, absolutely no WA/WB here. You are only crushed by one hand: QQ which is in the same time the most improbable.
Raise somewhere on the way. The conservative strategy is "Raise the flop", the "aggressive" strategy is "raise the turn", the (retarded) HPFAP strategy is "raise the river".

But, please, raise somewhere!

Re: aggresion
 

Look at what stakes you are playing! Your villain can easily have AQ or some silly hand that he can't let go of. I think that at the lower stakes you definitely have to pound on your opponents. Always take the aggressive line because it makes you more money than you save by playing conservative, and giving opponents too much respect.

Raise the TURN

make a decision on the RIVER

I'm almost always pounding this hand on every street.

Do you have a read on your opponent?

Re: aggresion
 

Hi guys,

Can't we add QJs on his range ?

It's so strange to donk the flop, call a raise and donk the turn.
Each time I saw that, the guy improved on the turn.
Thats seems like a QQ to me or a QJ.
Moreover, if he had KK why not 3bet on the flop (as he donked the turn) ?

Really seems like QQ or QJ to me.

But is 3bet PF with QJs possible ?
Maybe if he saw CO-raise as a steal or if he considered CO too agressive.

What do u think ?

Re: aggresion
 

[ QUOTE ]
Hi guys,

Can't we add QJs on his range ?

It's so strange to donk the flop, call a raise and donk the turn.
Each time I saw that, the guy improved on the turn.
Thats seems like a QQ to me or a QJ.
Moreover, if he had KK why not 3bet on the flop (as he donked the turn) ?

Really seems like QQ or QJ to me.

But is 3bet PF with QJs possible ?
Maybe if he saw CO-raise as a steal or if he considered CO too agressive.

What do u think ?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, I think that you can add QJ to an unknown villains range.

By the way, dont forget that if villain did have QJ, that you would have 8 outs to improve to a better 2 pair or trips on the river.

Re: aggresion
 

I think we get c/r by better hands. raise the turn.

Re: aggresion
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think we get c/r by better hands. raise the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

So, what do you put him on here that works out well for us? AQ and KK? KQ, maybe KQs? For all those, we probably garner an extra bet by raising, but for the QQ and JJ combos, we lose two bets by raising, assuming we're showing down.

Add to that he could be going bet-fold with a lower PP and we let him off the hook, and I like the turn call. I don't think the river changes anything, so I just call behind (I would have bet if he checked).

Your point about getting c/r by better hands here is true against some players, but until proven otherwise, I'm more inclined to think that he's betting his strong cards. Anyway, if you give him credit for checkraising his better hands, you have to give him credit for possibly wanting to bet/3-bet us on the turn (which would be a good line for QQ, IMO from the flop, but that's a different topic...)

Finally, for those saying QJ is part of his range, again until proven otherwise, preflop action says no to me. Maybe if OP was in a steal position in a tough game, you would see someone getting frisky defending QJs, but I don't buy it here.

Re: aggresion
 

Raise turn, if he 3bet then call it down and call if he bet on river, if check then raise it.
I would say that he might have QJ/JJ here, pay him off if so, but i think you will win this hand more often than you loose against the avg. villain at this level.

Re: aggresion
 

If one considers QJ as part of his range, then we would have to balance that with retarded post-flop plays with lesser hands. zero sum game. A turned flush draw fits this turn donk as well.

Re: aggresion
 

But would it be such a suprise if villain has the QJ, I mean, at this level you can see pretty much everything, 3bet with lets say QJs might happen now and then from the avg. player at 0.05/0.10. I think he can have a wide range of hands, QQ,JJ,QJ,AQ,KQ judging by his play. KQ spades might explain the donk bet at turn.
I dont know, but I would have raised the turn and called down 3bet and then called the river.