NBC Heads-Up ratings data (as of April 29)
 

The ratings for the first 4 weeks of NBC Heads-Up have been released by Nielsen Media Research for publication by Medialifemagazine.com and zap2it.com.

2007 average (for 4 episodes in April): 1.05% rating, 3 share, 1.172 million households, 1.418 million viewers (ages 2 and over)

Compare those numbers to:

2006 average (6 episodes): 1.35% rating, 4 share, 1.464 million households, 1.742 million viewers (ages 2 and over)

2005 average (6 episodes): 1.40% rating, 4 share, 1.517 million households, 1.787 million viewers (ages 2 and over)

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2007 vs 2006: down 20% in average households, down 19% in average viewers (ages 2 and over)

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Also, considering that online poker "school" advertising on TV poker in the U.S. has all but dried up with FullTiltPoker.net being the only one left which is buying advertising, and one can sense that NBC might be hesitant to pick up the contract option with HSOR to hold the 4th edition of NBC Heads-Up in 2008.

Re: NBC Heads-Up ratings data (as of April 29)
 

How do these ratings compare to the hockey games that follow the HUPC broadcasts?

Re: NBC Heads-Up ratings data (as of April 29)
 

I was so disappointed with NBC HU, very very disappointed. I think they showed more of the Costa Rican idiot and Mr Tilly then real juicy poker play, very poor indeed.

Re: NBC Heads-Up ratings data (as of April 29)
 

[ QUOTE ]

How do these ratings compare to the hockey games that follow the HUPC broadcasts?

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The ratings are similar.

NHL on NBC sells plenty of targeted advertising, as the Stanley Cup final in June airs during prime time with minimal opposition from the other broadcast networks (which air re-runs).

Heads-up poker, on the other hand, is not able to sell the amount of targeted advertising it did 2 years ago. Gone are PartyPoker, PokerStars, UB/AbsolutePoker, ParadisePoker, Bodog, etc. The only one left is FullTiltPoker.net.

Re: NBC Heads-Up ratings data (as of April 29)
 

I thought Laak antics were the most embarrassing that I've seen. Brenes tops it in spades. It's partly Phil's fault though. Humberto saw how people tolerate/enjoy Phil's act and now he thinks he can do better.

In fact, I remember Humberto grimacing in a earlier WPT final table when Phil went into his routine. How times have changed.

[ QUOTE ]
I was so disappointed with NBC HU, very very disappointed. I think they showed more of the Costa Rican idiot and Mr Tilly then real juicy poker play, very poor indeed.

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: NBC Heads-Up ratings data (as of April 29)
 

[ QUOTE ]

I thought Laak antics were the most embarrassing that I've seen. Brenes tops it in spades. It's partly Phil's fault though. Humberto saw how people tolerate/enjoy Phil's act and now he thinks he can do better.

[/ QUOTE ]

pretty sure its pokerstars fault for throwing money at him for acting like a giant douche.

Re: NBC Heads-Up ratings data (as of April 29)
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

How do these ratings compare to the hockey games that follow the HUPC broadcasts?

[/ QUOTE ]

The ratings are similar.

NHL on NBC sells plenty of targeted advertising, as the Stanley Cup final in June airs during prime time with minimal opposition from the other broadcast networks (which air re-runs).

Heads-up poker, on the other hand, is not able to sell the amount of targeted advertising it did 2 years ago. Gone are PartyPoker, PokerStars, UB/AbsolutePoker, ParadisePoker, Bodog, etc. The only one left is FullTiltPoker.net.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't understand what this means. What is "targetted advertising" for a hockey game? It's not like I see a lot of ads for hockey equipment. The advertising for the hockey playoffs seems pretty typical for a sporting event, as do the ads for the HUPC, with more online poker ads sprinkled in. But it seems like the demographics for the two (from the perspective of a beer company, for instance) would be quite similar.

Re: NBC Heads-Up ratings data (as of April 29)
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

How do these ratings compare to the hockey games that follow the HUPC broadcasts?

[/ QUOTE ]

The ratings are similar.

NHL on NBC sells plenty of targeted advertising, as the Stanley Cup final in June airs during prime time with minimal opposition from the other broadcast networks (which air re-runs).

Heads-up poker, on the other hand, is not able to sell the amount of targeted advertising it did 2 years ago. Gone are PartyPoker, PokerStars, UB/AbsolutePoker, ParadisePoker, Bodog, etc. The only one left is FullTiltPoker.net.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't understand what this means. What is "targetted advertising" for a hockey game? It's not like I see a lot of ads for hockey equipment. The advertising for the hockey playoffs seems pretty typical for a sporting event, as do the ads for the HUPC, with more online poker ads sprinkled in. But it seems like the demographics for the two (from the perspective of a beer company, for instance) would be quite similar.

[/ QUOTE ]

The demographics are different.

The NHL targets high-income urban male professionals between the ages of 25 and 54. Automobiles/Trucks and Financial Services (stock brokerages, insurance companies) are two categories which advertise during NHL telecasts.

Other than Outback Steakhouse, NBC Heads-Up has survived mostly from poker-related advertising, which target young males, particularly in the ages 18 to 34 demographic. The amount of poker-related ads have dropped off dramatically since the passage of the UIGEA and the subsequent NETELLER fiasco.

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Recall that NBC Sports was gung-ho about the Arena Football League during the first year of the AFL's 3-year run on NBC.

By the 3rd year, the ratings dropped off. Even though NBC Sports paid ZERO rights fees for the AFL, NBC Sports dropped the AFL anyway because the lower ratings meant lower ad revenue, which meant little or no profit (NBC Sports is required to use union production labor on many projects.)

The AFL is now on ESPN2 with 2 games each year on ABC. ESPN, Inc. only has to use union production labor for the 2 games on ABC. The games on ESPN2 are produced with non-union (read: cheap) production labor.

Heads-Up Poker might have to find a new TV home, i.e. a cable TV channel, and possibly on a time-buy basis, instead of being able to stay on NBC in 2008, if history were any indication.

Re: NBC Heads-Up ratings data (as of April 29)
 

[ QUOTE ]
The ratings for the first 4 weeks of NBC Heads-Up have been released by Nielsen Media Research for publication by Medialifemagazine.com and zap2it.com.

2007 average (for 4 episodes in April): 1.05% rating, 3 share, 1.172 million households, 1.418 million viewers (ages 2 and over)

Compare those numbers to:

2006 average (6 episodes): 1.35% rating, 4 share, 1.464 million households, 1.742 million viewers (ages 2 and over)

2005 average (6 episodes): 1.40% rating, 4 share, 1.517 million households, 1.787 million viewers (ages 2 and over)

--

2007 vs 2006: down 20% in average households, down 19% in average viewers (ages 2 and over)

--

Also, considering that online poker "school" advertising on TV poker in the U.S. has all but dried up with FullTiltPoker.net being the only one left which is buying advertising, and one can sense that NBC might be hesitant to pick up the contract option with HSOR to hold the 4th edition of NBC Heads-Up in 2008.

[/ QUOTE ]

Please stick to quoting ratings from other news sources.

Your information in the rest of the post, particularly what comes at the end, is factually inaccurate.

Given your former status as a member of the press and someone with an interest in representing poker players, it would serve you wise not to post on topcis about which you have no knowledge.

Re: NBC Heads-Up ratings data (as of April 29)
 

We recently did a full capital raising business plan for a new tour to take on WPT etc, raised a big chunk of seed capital but when we went to the media we could only do a time-buy mainly because of the wide variety of poor/average tv poker nowadays. Note we were planning very high free rolls for pros and a performance free roll for others and had sponsors lined up etc.

NBC HU was so badly done that the response I had yesterday from a potential partner station for poker WAS DO NOT BOTHER us again

Re: NBC Heads-Up ratings data (as of April 29)
 

[ QUOTE ]

Please stick to quoting ratings from other news sources.

Your information in the rest of the post, particularly what comes at the end, is factually inaccurate.

Given your former status as a member of the press and someone with an interest in representing poker players, it would serve you wise not to post on topcis about which you have no knowledge.

[/ QUOTE ]

There is no need to be hostile, Dennis O., er. "freekobe".

If NBC has already picked up the 2008 option for Heads-Up, then that would certainly be great news for HSOR and Poker PROductions.

The ratings and the business environment are exactly as I described: ratings on NBC Heads-Up are down 20% year to year and online poker "school" advertising has all but disappeared on U.S. television with the exception of FullTiltPoker.net.

If those are not reasons for concern with the 2008 option pending, then I don't know what other reasons you will need to be cautious.

As for me, I have turned over my client base completely in order to focus on players with European Union passports in the short term (next 12 months).

I am personally more concerned about poker TV ratings on DSF and EuroSport than NBC and ESPN at this point.

Re: NBC Heads-Up ratings data (as of April 29)
 

[ QUOTE ]
We recently did a full capital raising business plan for a new tour to take on WPT etc, raised a big chunk of seed capital but when we went to the media we could only do a time-buy mainly because of the wide variety of poor/average tv poker nowadays. Note we were planning very high free rolls for pros and a performance free roll for others and had sponsors lined up etc.

NBC HU was so badly done that the response I had yesterday from a potential partner station for poker WAS DO NOT BOTHER us again

[/ QUOTE ]

The U.S. is clearly NOT the TV market to launch a new TV poker venture in 2007.

The hot market for TV poker in 2007 is Germany.

In 2008, Spain, Russia, Poland, and/or Italy might be the next hot spot.

There is an established 5 year cycle for TV poker in each market, with history repeating itself whenever TV poker hits a new market:

Year 1: Introduction of poker to the TV audience
Year 2: TV ratings for poker reach their peak at the height of the poker fad
Year 3: Saturation of TV poker products, with 2nd tier and 3rd tier products airing daily on multiple channels
Year 4: Shakeout, with 2nd tier and 3rd tier products falling by the wayside
Year 5: Maturity, with only the top tier products and the time buys surviving the shakeout

The U.S. has hit Year 5 of the cycle.

Germany is in Year 2 of the cycle.

Let's see which TV producer is able to get "Heads-Up Poker Deutschland" on the air in Germany in 2008.

Re: NBC Heads-Up ratings data (as of April 29)
 

[ QUOTE ]
Please stick to quoting ratings from other news sources.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you disagree with something Olivert posts, point it out, but don't try to silence him. He posts a lot of valuable stuff here.

Re: NBC Heads-Up ratings data (as of April 29)
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Please stick to quoting ratings from other news sources.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you disagree with something Olivert posts, point it out, but don't try to silence him. He posts a lot of valuable stuff here.

[/ QUOTE ]

To be fair, "Freekobe" has the right to be upset with me, as he works with Poker PROductions (Mori Eskandani's company) and he is much closer to the NBC situation than I am and he has much more information than I do.

Also, I personally WANT to see NBC pick up the option for Heads-Up in 2008, as that would mean more poker on TV in the U.S. and more work for Mori, "freekobe", and co.

However, looking at both ratings performance (down about 20% year-to-year) and the business environment of TV poker in the U.S. (no more online poker "school" TV ads from anyone else besides FullTiltPoker.net), I notice 2 reasons for concern.

If my analysis and my subsequent concert were completely off base, then I will need to apologize to Mori and "freekobe" directly.

Re: NBC Heads-Up ratings data (as of April 29)
 

What do you think of a best of breed tournament with "bought airtime" and freerolling say the top 300 pros and letting others buy in. Run it like a deep stack main event with a normal final table and split the tourny for tv into 10-16 1 hour spots

Re: NBC Heads-Up ratings data (as of April 29)
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Please stick to quoting ratings from other news sources.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you disagree with something Olivert posts, point it out, but don't try to silence him. He posts a lot of valuable stuff here.

[/ QUOTE ]

To be fair, "Freekobe" has the right to be upset with me, as he works with Poker PROductions (Mori Eskandani's company) and he is much closer to the NBC situation than I am and he has much more information than I do.

Also, I personally WANT to see NBC pick up the option for Heads-Up in 2008, as that would mean more poker on TV in the U.S. and more work for Mori, "freekobe", and co.

However, looking at both ratings performance (down about 20% year-to-year) and the business environment of TV poker in the U.S. (no more online poker "school" TV ads from anyone else besides FullTiltPoker.net), I notice 2 reasons for concern.

If my analysis and my subsequent concert were completely off base, then I will need to apologize to Mori and "freekobe" directly.



[/ QUOTE ]

I still don't understand why a poker programs should have to rely on advertising from online poker sites, as opposed to the companies that normally advertise on typical sports programming. Are these companies unwilling to advertise on gambling shows for some moral reason? It seems like relying on poker specific-ads would be a crutch to mainstream acceptance that televised poker would be glad to get rid of.

Re: NBC Heads-Up ratings data (as of April 29)
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Please stick to quoting ratings from other news sources.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you disagree with something Olivert posts, point it out, but don't try to silence him. He posts a lot of valuable stuff here.

[/ QUOTE ]

To be fair, "Freekobe" has the right to be upset with me, as he works with Poker PROductions (Mori Eskandani's company) and he is much closer to the NBC situation than I am and he has much more information than I do.

[/ QUOTE ]

You are being generous. To be fair, freekobe is an idiot. Rather than disclose to us his own vested interest in HU, he would rather attempt to tarnish your image. Pretty spineless.

As usual, your analysis of ratings and demographics is on-target. HU is simply less appealing. We've seen this dog and pony show several times and it has run its course on network television. Maybe GSN will pick it up since it appears to be picking off all the tired poker shows.

Re: NBC Heads-Up ratings data (as of April 29)
 

Heads-Up poker still has its place on a widely-distributed TV network in the U.S. (i.e. a network that is looking for at least 1 million households and 1.2 million viewers per poker TV episode)

ESPN is scheduled to devote 2 hours to the first ever WSOP Heads-Up bracelet event in 2007: $5000 buy-in, with either 256 players or 512 players participating.

With Harrah's now running its own televised WSOP-branded Heads-Up bracelet event, does Harrah's still need to offer NBC Sports/HSOR/Poker PROductions the use of Caesar's Palace for NBC Heads-Up in 2008?

Also, with most of the online poker "school" ads gone, will NBC Sports be able to sell the rest of the ad inventory to "mainstream" advertisers, and at a reduced rate (because the ratings in 2007 are down 20% from 2006), to make holding the 2008 edition of the NBC Heads-Up event profitable enough to proceed?

These are serious questions.

We will get an answer soon enough from NBC Sports and Poker PROductions.

Until we get an answer, we can only speculate.

Re: NBC Heads-Up ratings data (as of April 29)
 

I'm not surprised the ratings are down. The show's virtually unwatchable without Gabe. All you're left with is a luckfest due to the structure, instead of the really great heads-up poker you're hoping for when you tune in. It might as well be poker celebrities playing Keno or something.

Re: NBC Heads-Up ratings data (as of April 29)
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Please stick to quoting ratings from other news sources.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you disagree with something Olivert posts, point it out, but don't try to silence him. He posts a lot of valuable stuff here.

[/ QUOTE ]

To be fair, "Freekobe" has the right to be upset with me, as he works with Poker PROductions (Mori Eskandani's company) and he is much closer to the NBC situation than I am and he has much more information than I do.

[/ QUOTE ]

You are being generous. To be fair, freekobe is an idiot. Rather than disclose to us his own vested interest in HU, he would rather attempt to tarnish your image. Pretty spineless.

As usual, your analysis of ratings and demographics is on-target. HU is simply less appealing. We've seen this dog and pony show several times and it has run its course on network television. Maybe GSN will pick it up since it appears to be picking off all the tired poker shows.

[/ QUOTE ]

"Idiot" and "Spineless" seem harsh.

There is information in Oliver's original post that is factually inaccurate, specifically the facts surrounding the future of the show.

I don't know whether he had a bad source or he is out to spread misinformation. In either case, rushing to Oliver's defense seems odd. He posted a lot of facts and then included his own speculation as fact at the end of the post. That is disingenuous and can be damaging.

I noted that I couldn't disagree with his ratings "analysis." The rest of his post is based on misinformation.

And to grdred, it's pretty clear I have a vested interest in HU. That's why I bothered to post about Oliver's misinformation.

Re: NBC Heads-Up ratings data (as of April 29)
 

[ QUOTE ]
Heads-Up poker still has its place on a widely-distributed TV network in the U.S. (i.e. a network that is looking for at least 1 million households and 1.2 million viewers per poker TV episode)

ESPN is scheduled to devote 2 hours to the first ever WSOP Heads-Up bracelet event in 2007: $5000 buy-in, with either 256 players or 512 players participating.

With Harrah's now running its own televised WSOP-branded Heads-Up bracelet event, does Harrah's still need to offer NBC Sports/HSOR/Poker PROductions the use of Caesar's Palace for NBC Heads-Up in 2008?

Also, with most of the online poker "school" ads gone, will NBC Sports be able to sell the rest of the ad inventory to "mainstream" advertisers, and at a reduced rate (because the ratings in 2007 are down 20% from 2006), to make holding the 2008 edition of the NBC Heads-Up event profitable enough to proceed?

These are serious questions.

We will get an answer soon enough from NBC Sports and Poker PROductions.

Until we get an answer, we can only speculate.

[/ QUOTE ]

Relative to other Televised sports productions poker is pretty low cost, the players provide the prize pool, the casino the venue, so the potential for profitability is fairly high.

The problem with heads up as its currently done is there is no Horatio Alger angle to the competition so you can't tell a story of rags to riches that the WSOP (and to a lesser extent) the WPT use in the course of their products. The field contains to many Nobodies/nobody cares names and they don't cover enough poker. Take last year, Ted Forrest/Sam Farha played for 3 hours (thats right 3 hours) how much of that epic battle made the air ? about 4 minutes/2 hands...
But thank god we got to see 15 minutes of Daniel and Evey watching evey donk off chips.

In a format like this you have to go technical and deep explain complex strategy. Explain different players styles, and approaches to heads up, and select a field of top On-line and B&M players as rated by one of the Poker sites (image the top B&M versus Top online players). TV poker spends too much time catering to the ignorant, rather that giving people credit for being smarter than they are. (In otherwords people know crap when they see it, and the ratings show) Maybe NBC could have the Detroit Redwings come to vegas and play heads up poker versus the Dallas Cowboys (I hear both those teams have a large following UGH) Less schtick/formula more real poker...

Olivert it would be interesting to see the web views of heads up versus web views of new Poker After Dark on NBC site to see how they compare.

Re: NBC Heads-Up ratings data (as of April 29)
 

This whole yr has been let down. NBC is spending to much time on the morons and not on the poker. I know they are showing entertainment, but no one wants to see brenes jumping around like a idiot.

Re: NBC Heads-Up ratings data (as of April 29)
 

yea to be honest i get bored watching them, the first few matches there M's arent too high and the matches are played so fast and there is not enough skill involved

Re: NBC Heads-Up ratings data (as of April 29)
 

I think the timeslot is horrible and hurts the ratings, but poker can't supplant standard PT programming. It would never work. BC of the time slot, and I am using the DVR for sporting events, I am watching headsup on the NBC web site.

Re: NBC Heads-Up ratings data (as of April 29)
 

Even tho LATB flopped, I might think that poker might best be viewed on the internet. Could this be the future.?

Re: NBC Heads-Up ratings data (as of April 29)
 

i really liked this show 2 years ago. the whole "poker star" thing has worn off on me. the show seems to focus too much on the players rather than the poker - or maybe just too much for me.

30bb poker is pretty boring.