Bankroll and you.....?
 

I am curious to learn more opinions on bankroll management. I read the interview with Green Plastic on Pocketfives. He said that a good bankroll that he sticks to is keeping 20-25 max NL buy-ins for a particular limit.

That would mean when your playing .05/.1 you would need $200-$250 just to play those limits. That seems like a lot of money for such a small limit.


edit -- Link to Pocket 5's removed because this isn't Pocket 5's.

OP, the uNL and SSNL stickies have threads on BR management. I think a thread on BR management started by AJ is still hanging around the 1st page of SSNL. -- 4_2_it

Re: Bankroll and you.....?
 

His advice sounds pretty good, and is in general a good idea.

It may sound like alot, and i wold say that for playing .5 .10 you can problay take it a bit easy with the 20-25 and go for about 10-15 buyins.

The problem is that if you take a really bad period of variance, your bankroll could easily be stripped. And since you play .5 .10 i assume that you are a beginner player, and thus some mistakes are unavoidable.

I´ve been playing NL25 with about 12 buyins for a little period, and i haven´t seen a REALLY bad variance period, but i compensate by winning a buyin here and there.

Good Luck on the tables!

Re: Bankroll and you.....?
 

From the When To Move Up From NL25 sticky (in the master list of stickies above).

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...Number=5911181

Re: Bankroll and you.....?
 

If you dont have 20 max buy ins your risk of ruin is high. Lets say you have a bankroll of 100$ and you play 10 nl. You are all in preflop and somebody cracks your aces. One buy in gone. You might get into a couple of other bad spots kk vs aa , flush vs higher flush. You can loose easily 5 buy ins running bad. Now you got 50 $ left and you think i am running so bad thats sick. You start tilting and you start playing badly. Banroll gone.
You can play 10 nl with 100$ but better be aware that the chance of going broke is pretty high.
If you can loose half of your bankroll without tilting and you can take the risk of ruin go for it.

Re: Bankroll and you.....?
 

I guess I see more of the importance now but 40 buy ins seems a little high still. I am going to consider moving down a limit and building a bigger roll. If anyone could post anymore articles on bankroll or interviews with pros about bankroll management I would be very appreciative.

Re: Bankroll and you.....?
 

I started playing $50NL recently, and I wouldn't be comfortable at all playing with 20 buy-ins. My biggest loss in session has been 7 buy-ins. I can't afford to replace that money, so I prefer to have more like 30-40 buy-ins. I also think that bankroll has a lot to do with skill level. If you are crushing a level, and can afford to replace the money if you lose it, I wouldn't move down a level.

Re: Bankroll and you.....?
 

You lost 7 buyins in one session? Man I don't think I even would play long enough for that to happen. If I lose 1 or maybe even 2 I am done for the day. I basically stop myself so I try never to tilt.

Re: Bankroll and you.....?
 

Please never link to pocketfives again

Re: Bankroll and you.....?
 

I play 25 NL with 10-12 BI now that i went semi-busto. If you know you're good enough for the level, go for it Usually 25 BI is standard enough for me.

Re: Bankroll and you.....?
 

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Please never link to pocketfives again

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Re: Bankroll and you.....?
 

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Please never link to pocketfives again

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......hahaha very funny

Re: Bankroll and you.....?
 

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Please never link to pocketfives again

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LOL best advice in uNL

In response to the person who said they stop at 1 or 2 buyins, this is good if you generally go on tilt after dropping that amount. But often times a game can be so good that you're hurting your expectation to leave.

Re: Bankroll and you.....?
 

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Please never link to pocketfives again

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LOL best advice in uNL

In response to the person who said they stop at 1 or 2 buyins, this is good if you generally go on tilt after dropping that amount. But often times a game can be so good that you're hurting your expectation to leave.

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Let me explain how I would decide to leave a game. If lets say I have AA vs. KK (I have the AA) and I get beat I rebuy and write it off as a bad beat nothing I can do about it. Then next time I get AA again and opponent has 23o and wins its another bad beat. But if I recognize I am screwing up and just playing bad I quit.

If I suffer another bad beat after that I just quit though and say today is not my day to play. I will wait like a day to play again. I just don't like to play when I am not playing my best and sometimes a bad beat gives you a bad mindset.

Re: Bankroll and you.....?
 

Im bankroll nit, atm i play 50nl with ~4k roll

Re: Bankroll and you.....?
 

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Im bankroll nit, atm i play 50nl with ~4k roll

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Wow thats a lot for 50NL!

As for the bankroll management it depends on how comfortable you feel at the limit you are playing (or hoping to play). If you feel like you are completely outplaying your current limit and you will most likely do so the next limit (eg. 25NL-50NL) then 20 buy-ins is fine. As you move up more though its better to increase the number of buy-ins for each limit, so for 100NL you might want 30-40. I would say 20 minimum. Then just take a 5 BI shot at the next limit and if it doesnt work just move back down.

Re: Bankroll and you.....?
 

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Im bankroll nit, atm i play 50nl with ~4k roll

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Amen. 25NL here with 5k+ roll. Well over 80% of the roll is from bonuses and LHE though - I'm a recent convert to NL, so moving up slowly.

Re: Bankroll and you.....?
 

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Im bankroll nit, atm i play 50nl with ~4k roll

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Your not a nit, you're a coward

Re: Bankroll and you.....?
 

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Let me explain how I would decide to leave a game. If lets say I have AA vs. KK (I have the AA) and I get beat I rebuy and write it off as a bad beat nothing I can do about it. Then next time I get AA again and opponent has 23o and wins its another bad beat. But if I recognize I am screwing up and just playing bad I quit.

If I suffer another bad beat after that I just quit though and say today is not my day to play. I will wait like a day to play again. I just don't like to play when I am not playing my best and sometimes a bad beat gives you a bad mindset.

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Oh yeah I totally agree.

Usually when I run bad I just fire up a 6-table session of turbo sngs for the sole purpose of realizing how often my hands don't hold up. I tend to take beats at the cash table a lot better after I do this.

Re: Bankroll and you.....?
 

I ran with 10-15 buy ins from $10NL-$50NL and it worked fine, this includes a couple of downswings and a large sample size. I currently have 20 buy ins at $50NL, but I'm not going to move up to $100NL without at least 15-20 buy ins. Honestly, I believe uNL can be played with a smaller bankroll if you are willing to move down.

Re: Bankroll and you.....?
 

Hm, it depends on what you need the money for. If you have a job and outside money and don't depend on your bankroll for anything, you can play just about anything you want.

I, as well as a lot of people on 2+2, cash out my bankroll to pay for my small bills and stuff (Only totalled around $300 every month). [Recently, I sat down and looked - Along with the tuition I paid at my community college last fall, cashing out for leisure, and the sum of my bills, I've probably cashed out $7k.] If you do this, you want a LOT of buyins so that you're never at risk to lose your bankroll. I played 50nl with $3k, but now that I have a job to pay for all my bills, I'm considering a shot at 200nl with around 12 buyins.

It's all about comfort/fearlessness/dumbness I guess. Play where you feel comfortable, not by how many buyins you have.

Re: Bankroll and you.....?
 

I used to play 25nl on a 4 buyin bankroll. If you are confident enough to limit your variance by avoiding marginal situations I cant see why BR should be an issue. However obviously you need at least 20 if you play long term. I usually play with more, I like at least 30.

Re: Bankroll and you.....?
 

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Im bankroll nit, atm i play 50nl with ~4k roll

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I am a fellow 50nl player with ~4k roll. I started playing .05/.1 with an initial deposit of 50 dollars and occasionally took shots short stacking at NL50 [img]/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img] with that roll so my bankroll managements hasn't always been great. I started playing .10/.25 when I hit about 400 and planned on following the 20 buyin rule and playing nl50 at 1000. By the time I got up to 1000 I learned much more about poker and my own tolerances and decided to play it safe and start following a 40 buyin rule. I'm almost up to 4k at which point I will move up to .5/1.

When you think about it 20 buyins sounds like its more then enough but when you think more about it you realize how it should actually be the bare minimum. If you lose 2 buyins which can happen incredibly fast 10% of your roll is gone. A 5 buyin loss which is perfectly possible in a couple hour session and 25% of your roll is gone. I don't have the psyche to be able to lose 25% of my roll in one session. It would eat at me for the entire night. When I played .05/.1 with a 100 dollar roll every bad beat hurt real bad. Now I can lose 50 dollars to a two outer and keep playing to my full ability because it is only a small fraction of my roll.

You can take what ever recommendations you want but if you are serious about poker I would suggest at least 30 buyins for your main level. Taking an occasional shot at a higher limit is fine but I wouldn't recommend doing it with more then 10% of your bankroll. I personally don't do that because I am a proud bankroll nit.

Re: Bankroll and you.....?
 

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Your not a nit, you're a coward

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I moved from limit to no-limit 2 months ago, in the middle of the march i took some shots on 100nl and was up 4-5bi in 4-5k hands, but meanwhile i was going through some huge TILTswing in 50nl (15bi i think), so i rather stay at 50nl for 20k more hands to reavaluate my play + im a huge tiltmonkey.
Hopefully ill move to 100nl next week.

Re: Bankroll and you.....?
 

15-20 BI, any more than that seems extremely excessive for uNL. If you drop some just move down a level for a few days. If you have more than 30 for a level in my opinion you are just wasting money because you could be making more at higher limits.

Re: Bankroll and you.....?
 

It also depends on your attitude towards you roll. A seasoned player, who for some reason had to cash out everything, may have the mental stability to play on an extremely tight bankroll. If you need a big bankroll buffer to play with a winning attitude then this is the best strategy to go with.

A winning attitude is a huge part of one's success and whatever roll makes one comfortable to have such an attitude is the right one.

Re: Bankroll and you.....?
 

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You lost 7 buyins in one session? Man I don't think I even would play long enough for that to happen. If I lose 1 or maybe even 2 I am done for the day. I basically stop myself so I try never to tilt.

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On the weekends I will play long sessions whether I'm winning or losing, tilting against better players or playing my "A" game against drunken retards. Worst loss at 50NL is 7 buy-ins. Also have had a few 6 buy-in wins in a session. The whole idea for me and my bankroll is to be able to play, and not worry about having to stop playing because I'm hurting my bankroll. With 35-40 buy-ins, I can play all day long even if I'm slightly losing, or stay in games where the players are good.

Re: Bankroll and you.....?
 

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You lost 7 buyins in one session? Man I don't think I even would play long enough for that to happen. If I lose 1 or maybe even 2 I am done for the day. I basically stop myself so I try never to tilt.

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On the weekends I will play long sessions whether I'm winning or losing, tilting against better players or playing my "A" game against drunken retards. Worst loss at 50NL is 7 buy-ins. Also have had a few 6 buy-in wins in a session. The whole idea for me and my bankroll is to be able to play, and not worry about having to stop playing because I'm hurting my bankroll. With 35-40 buy-ins, I can play all day long even if I'm slightly losing, or stay in games where the players are good.

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I see your point, I guess I just play different. I do not like playing poker if I am losing online. I play online to gain money and better my game. Live games I have way more control of tilting. It is so easy just to click and bluff.
If I am not playing my best poker I simply log off or play some PLO.

Re: Bankroll and you.....?
 

if your goal is to move up then you should be aggressive with shot taking and at least try out the next level when you are rolled/comfortable. Theres no need to be playing 50nl with 4k.

Re: Bankroll and you.....?
 

I found it comfortable to play NL25 until my roll was over $1000. Then I took shots at NL50 with everything above that. When I got below $1000 I'd play NL25 again until I 'got it'. Now I'm doing the same with NL100 as my roll is at about $2100. So basically I'm moving up when I have over 20 buyins for the next level. I could do this with a smaller margin like 15 buyins but I'd tilt way easier as the potential losses would be a much bigger percentage of my roll. Whatever works for you... I started out with a 10 buy-in strategy at NL4-NL10 which worked fine but I've had to increase that ratio as I've moved up.

BTW I just realized the other day that I've been doubling my bankroll every month since I started playing. That's pretty amazing.. I hope it continues that way! [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]