OT: Confidence Boost
 

I believe I need a confidence boost.

I built my roll from 2400 up to 6k, 5-tabling the 27s during a two month time frame (and from 600 to 2400 playing lower stakes over a 5 month period).

I moved up to the 60s last week and have been on a 20 bi down slide over 200 gms. What a cooler.

I hate being one of those players who attribute their downswings to nothing but "bad luck". Whenever I am losing, the last thing I want to say is, "I am just getting unlucky". It sounds like such BS.

Therefore I over analyze every aspect of my game imaginable. I feel unsure of SNGPT questions, that I would have laughed at a week ago. It only gets worse when I consider the "moving up" factor. I don't have any past experience that proves I am a winner at this level, so I lose a lot of confidence in myself when I am losing. Which seems very natural, and dangerous.

Maybe I need to move down and build my roll up to 6k again, work on my game, etc. Then take another shot at the 60s.

Maybe I should just take a day or two off and then come back refreshed.

However I feel like I am over it, and am ready to only focus on the decisions that take place during each hand, and ignore results.

The problem is my bankroll. I have 4800, and don't feel comfortable losing another 2k, before moving down to the 27s again. At the 27s, I was able to still enjoy myself when the cards didn't go my way. I was anxious to load up another table after my AA got cracked by KQs, because I know my opponents are playing so badly, and their mistakes are my profit.

Now I feel angry and frustrated, when a bad beat hits, I lose a race for the 3rd time in a session, and I lose 8 bi over 10 games. I doubt myself, at every given opportunity. Worst of all, I stop having fun, which is the reason why I started playing this game in the first place.

Does anyone have any similar experiences? Advice?

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

I know how you feel. Last 3 sessions I lost were with my 99 vs someone 77, my Ak vs someones QJ, etc, etc. I just stop whenever I feel like I am just getting unlucky and restart in a few hours. I try to go ride a bike, play with my kids, have a glass of red wine, etc to distract myself.

Poker is a lot of ups and downs. But I still prefer to the life of investing in real estate or having a BS office job (like I do [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img])

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

I never played the 60s but now every time I'm moving up, I reduce my number of tables to help me being really focuced.

Example : from 4 to 2 tables. If it works well at the new limit, then only I add tables to the next set.

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

I would suggest playing less tables than the 5 as rex has done. I havent played full tilt, but dont they have 39s now?? Maybe give them a go. If they dont apologies.

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

[ QUOTE ]
I would suggest playing less tables than the 5 as rex has done. I havent played full tilt, but dont they have 39s now?? Maybe give them a go. If they dont apologies.

[/ QUOTE ]

I play on stars...

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

hi mike,
i don`t know how many 27s you played until you earned ~4k.
But don`t forgett that you maybe just ran hot. You are obv. beating the 27s, but maybe you beat them for more than you "should have". This means you beat the 27s lets say with a 20% ROI, where your "normal skill ROI" should be like 10% or something like that.
The other thing are just normal downswings and coolers. Ok, you know that...but maybe you didn`t have a horrible day/horrible swing before. To loose 2k over 200 games is definitely not impossible. Maybe there are some leaks, but I really think its just a psycho thing. Correct me, if I`m wrong, but it sounds like you never had a huge downswing and lost like half your roll in one day.
When stuff like that happened to me, I just took a few days off. Then I´d study a few days and if I´m ready, i`ll play again. Play where you`re comfortable and enjoy it.
Thats actually all i can say. Don`t let swings affect you, although you might feel like a moron from one day to the next day. Gl and do not ever let that stuff effect your self-awareness...

Btw, just saw that you only play 5 tables. Maybe you should watch if you`re playing to many hands before pushbotting. Just came into my mind.

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

I didn't think the play was all that much better but perhaps the $60s are a bigger leap than we all expected. I thought I was just running bad too but it seems to be happening to a lot of us.

Try and guess at what point I tried moving up to $60s?

Now guess when I went back to the $27s?

http://www.UploadYourImages.com/thum...splaygraph.jpg

So what I'm trying to say is don't get discouraged. I know some people are able to move up, get hot, and never have to move down. But for most of us it's a grind and hard work. Move down, get your confidence back, look for some leaks and then give it a try a little later.

If you're looking for immediate satisfaction, buy something for yourself with your winnings! This helps me every time.

Good luck and keep your head up.

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

Mike,

Here's a post I made a while back in response to another poster who went on a downswing. Maybe it'll help, maybe not, but fwiw...

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...age=0&vc=1

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

play fewer tables at the 60 until you're comfortable again, maybe 2 60, 3 27... or just move back to 27's and build your roll again... you must have fun though...

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

[ QUOTE ]
hi mike,
i don`t know how many 27s you played until you earned ~4k.
But don`t forgett that you maybe just ran hot. You are obv. beating the 27s, but maybe you beat them for more than you "should have". This means you beat the 27s lets say with a 20% ROI, where your "normal skill ROI" should be like 10% or something like that.
The other thing are just normal downswings and coolers. Ok, you know that...but maybe you didn`t have a horrible day/horrible swing before. To loose 2k over 200 games is definitely not impossible. Maybe there are some leaks, but I really think its just a psycho thing. Correct me, if I`m wrong, but it sounds like you never had a huge downswing and lost like half your roll in one day.
When stuff like that happened to me, I just took a few days off. Then I´d study a few days and if I´m ready, i`ll play again. Play where you`re comfortable and enjoy it.
Thats actually all i can say. Don`t let swings affect you, although you might feel like a moron from one day to the next day. Gl and do not ever let that stuff effect your self-awareness...

Btw, just saw that you only play 5 tables. Maybe you should watch if you`re playing to many hands before pushbotting. Just came into my mind.

[/ QUOTE ]

Hercules,

I played about 1,500 27s to build my roll. I went on a 500 buy-in break even stretch during this sample.

I am down 20 BI over 200 gms in the last week since moving up (not 2k). Maybe my OP was difficult to understand. I stated that I did not want to lose 2k at the 60s before moving back down.

My early game is solid, it is my pushing game that I come to second guess. I have been told by some that I play too tight early, and too crazy in the late game.

I do agree that most of this is in my head, and in the cards.

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

Mike,
20 bi drop really is not that bad, I have only played the 60s for only about 700 games and I had 3 20 bi drop already. In my experience, 60s seemed a lot harder than 27s and therefore your ROI will likely drop at least 5% (part of it is because the increased rake, makes no sense that you should pay higher rake at 60s than 27s, but that's just the way it is). The lower your ROI, the higher your variance.

I have review HHs of yours, seems to me that you should be able to win at the 60s for at least 5% ROI. In addition to reviewing your own HHs, I would suggest you rail some of the top players at the 60s (check the sharkscope leaderboard for names), watch how they play and maybe learn a little bit on how you can improve.

Jason

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

Mike

If you are not comfortable losing more Buyins at 60's or you are not enjoying them and I would suggest move down get comfortable with your game again and rebuild your confidence so that you can take another shot. You definetly have the game to beat them long term.

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

[ QUOTE ]
I hate being one of those players who attribute their downswings to nothing but "bad luck". Whenever I am losing, the last thing I want to say is, "I am just getting unlucky". It sounds like such BS.

[/ QUOTE ]
I don't know why you think it's BS. Of course it's always good to be analyzing your game but accepting that luck will cause inevitable swings is pretty important.

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

[ QUOTE ]
I didn't think the play was all that much better but perhaps the $60s are a bigger leap than we all expected. I thought I was just running bad too but it seems to be happening to a lot of us.

Try and guess at what point I tried moving up to $60s?

Now guess when I went back to the $27s?

http://www.UploadYourImages.com/thum...splaygraph.jpg

So what I'm trying to say is don't get discouraged. I know some people are able to move up, get hot, and never have to move down. But for most of us it's a grind and hard work. Move down, get your confidence back, look for some leaks and then give it a try a little later.

If you're looking for immediate satisfaction, buy something for yourself with your winnings! This helps me every time.

Good luck and keep your head up.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks for sharing Kevin.

How are the 27s treating you lately?

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

YOU'RE THE GREATEST OMG EVERYONE ON THIS FORUM WANTS TO HAVE SWEATY MAN SEX WITH YOU!!!

If that doesn't work I dno what will [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img].

Yugoslav

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

[ QUOTE ]
YOU'RE THE GREATEST OMG EVERYONE ON THIS FORUM WANTS TO HAVE SWEATY MAN SEX WITH YOU!!!

If that doesn't work I dno what will [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img].

Yugoslav

[/ QUOTE ]

Damn Yugo, keep your dreams to yourself...lol...

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

One Word = Pineapple [img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img]

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

[ QUOTE ]
Mike

If you are not comfortable losing more Buyins at 60's or you are not enjoying them and I would suggest move down get comfortable with your game again and rebuild your confidence so that you can take another shot. You definetly have the game to beat them long term.

[/ QUOTE ]

Mike....I think this is very true. If you're not comfortable losing at the 60's, then you're not going to be able to beat the 60's. Move back down.....try playing just 1 60 mixed in with the level that you feel comfortable at.....and work your way up like that.

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

[ QUOTE ]
One Word = Pineapple [img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

Thats just not right skipper...

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

Similar problem for me going from 16s to 27s recently. I moved down and suddenly I got better. It's not the games it's my attitude towards them.
Now I play a mixture of 16s and 27s and I don't know which are which so I treat them all the same.

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

[ QUOTE ]
Similar problem for me going from 16s to 27s recently. I moved down and suddenly I got better. It's not the games it's my attitude towards them.

[/ QUOTE ]

Nothing worse for my game than when I'm afraid to lose. Drop back down to the 27s and start slowly adding 60's in. For the life of me I don't understand this forum's habit of classifying players as this level or that or of strictly adhering to 1 level when you play. I love to play 24 turbos on FT but also regularly play 12's, 36's and will even play 60's from time to time. There's nothing wrong with playing multiple levels at once; I actually think it's quite good psychologically.

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
YOU'RE THE GREATEST OMG EVERYONE ON THIS FORUM WANTS TO HAVE SWEATY MAN SEX WITH YOU!!!

If that doesn't work I dno what will [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img].

Yugoslav

[/ QUOTE ]

Damn Yugo, keep your dreams to yourself...lol...

[/ QUOTE ]

Ok, that doesn't make you want to jump out of bed in the morning and pwn? Maybe THIS WILL!

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y24...oth/SVarga.jpg

Yugoslav

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

Yugo,

More confidence boosting please, thanks.

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

Thanks Yugo....that actually did inspire me a little bit.

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

Hey...how did you get her out of my dreams and onto this forum?

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

[ QUOTE ]

Hercules,

I played about 1,500 27s to build my roll. I went on a 500 buy-in break even stretch during this sample.

I am down 20 BI over 200 gms in the last week since moving up (not 2k). Maybe my OP was difficult to understand. I stated that I did not want to lose 2k at the 60s before moving back down.

My early game is solid, it is my pushing game that I come to second guess. I have been told by some that I play too tight early, and too crazy in the late game.

I do agree that most of this is in my head, and in the cards.

[/ QUOTE ]

Reading that, i guess it would be right to play the 27s again, since you killed them and mistakes don`t cost that much. Ok, if you`re unsure about some pushbotting, you know what to do:)
Just hang up yugo`s pic and think about something else [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]
I lost yesterday like 5 Buy-ins in NL 200, i`m on a break for the next 2 days...

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Hercules,

I played about 1,500 27s to build my roll. I went on a 500 buy-in break even stretch during this sample.

I am down 20 BI over 200 gms in the last week since moving up (not 2k). Maybe my OP was difficult to understand. I stated that I did not want to lose 2k at the 60s before moving back down.

My early game is solid, it is my pushing game that I come to second guess. I have been told by some that I play too tight early, and too crazy in the late game.

I do agree that most of this is in my head, and in the cards.

[/ QUOTE ]

Reading that, i guess it would be right to play the 27s again, since you killed them and mistakes don`t cost that much. Ok, if you`re unsure about some pushbotting, you know what to do:)
Just hang up yugo`s pic and think about something else [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]
I lost yesterday like 5 Buy-ins in NL 200, i`m on a break for the next 2 days...

[/ QUOTE ]

Cash is brutal. I played a little 200 NL and ran my AK into AA. It was a great way to go from 235 to 100 in one hand. I went on life tilt after that...lol..

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

[ QUOTE ]
Now I feel angry and frustrated, when a bad beat hits, I lose a race for the 3rd time in a session, and I lose 8 bi over 10 games. I doubt myself, at every given opportunity. Worst of all, I stop having fun, which is the reason why I started playing this game in the first place.


[/ QUOTE ]

This stuck out the most to me. I know when we talk, you tell me that your biggest enemy is yourself. I read everything, but I know this is part of it. I can see some of it because I know you IRL, but a lot of it comes out clearly in this thread.

You obviously have the poker capacity to win at any level. Its just a matter of balancing that with the mental part of it all. I can speak for you personally seeing the satisfaction of a friend succeeding and moving up.

Here is my two cents. You initially played at the lower levels for a good duration of time. You understood what it took to run over those levels, and you did it. There's no doubt that when you moved up you could succeed at the next level. You were already ready for it, you just didn't have the BR for it yet. You finally moved up and it didn't take long before you were winning on a regular basis at that level either. I think that level and this level is where there is a big gap in the thinking/level of play. You are frustrated because you aren't accelerating up the ladder as quickly as you were previously. This is just not sustainable to expect to jump up at every level and dominate within such a short time span. You just need to take it to another level.

I think the issue at hand is how fast you have accelerated from your prior level up to the 60's. There's no doubt you have what it takes to be a winning player at this level. I think with this level it will take more time and efforts. You are frustrated right now because of how well you ran at the other levels. Sure, you struggled from time to time, but you still had moderate success even when you were down at times.

My advice is there is no shame in moving down or taking time out temporarily. You need to have your mental game be as confident as your actual poker in order to succeed and concentrate to your full potential. Its just part of the roadblocks you must overcome along the way.

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

Play 2 60s and 3 27s or a combination like that. Even if you start out running like [censored] at the higher level, playing your normal buy-in should help cushion the swings while you build familiarity/confidence at the new level.

Re: OT: Confidence Boost
 

you are analyzing it way too much.

you prob are just getting luck douched + tilting a bit.

i find it hard to believe that after 1500 27s you haven't had at least one or two stretches where you can't win a donkngo to save your life.

the 60s seem a little harder b/c you have less and less complete retards, but there are still plenty of people who aren't very good to win at these with your exact same game as at the 27s