30/60 @ Wynn
 

Over the weekend I was at the Wynn playing the 1-3 and 2-5 NL games. After some observation, the best game in the house seemed to be the 30-60 game. 2 pros, 4 tourists, and 2 overly aggressive dudes from L.A. Huge pots, most show downs won by 1 pair.

Sat down in the two seat with a SUPER aggressive guy in the 9 seat (this subjected me to my BB getting raised every round).

Following hand is just one of several examples where I think I lost value when I defended my big blind and hit:

Fold to Villian in cutoff, he raises:

Me: I call with J [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 9 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

Flop: J 7 2 rainbow w/ one spade

Me: Check raise flop

Villian: Calls

Me: Lead Turn when 2 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] falls

Villian: Calls

Me: Check river when K [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] falls

Villian: Bets

Me: Call... win pot when villian shows A-7

Do you guys feel I'm loosing value by either

a) not leading flop
b) not trying to check raise the turn
c) not lead betting the river

Re: 30/60 @ Wynn
 

I think you played it pretty well. Probably got about the maximum out of him considering his holding as well.

Re: 30/60 @ Wynn
 

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I think you played it pretty well. Probably got about the maximum out of him considering his holding as well.

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Thanks for the evaluation... this is probably my biggest flaw in playing limit poker... I'm always thinking about how I "lost" value. I forget sometimes that it's not NL and it's much harder to "induce" a bluff in Limit.

Re: 30/60 @ Wynn
 

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a) not leading flop


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you are a huge favorite and you're going to make nearly 2x as much by check raising, leading is bad unless he will raise with a huge portion of his hands including air (enough that a 3bet is good). this is rare though, check/raise is much better.

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b) not trying to check raise the turn

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super bad, he should know you have a pair on this dry board so if he has overcards he's not going to bet.

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c) not lead betting the river

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this is lots closer. he may call but not bet with bad sevens, small pocket pairs, and even decent ace high hands, so you're losing money by checking against that range. however a huge portion of the time you bet he's going to fold, and you are losing money by betting there. I'd lean towards betting but this is the closest spot in the hand by far.

Re: 30/60 @ Wynn
 

Check-raise river--still will have the best hand over half the time--and call a threebet.

It's hard to play out of position; you can't always get the maximum on your winning hands.

Re: 30/60 @ Wynn
 

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Check-raise river--still will have the best hand over half the time--and call a threebet.

It's hard to play out of position; you can't always get the maximum on your winning hands.

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you really want to go 3 bets on the river w/ second pair no kicker?

i think that against an aggro dude check/call > bet/call > c/r/call...

Re: 30/60 @ Wynn
 

You played it just fine.
A)Just fine. The dude is agro and you will be defending a lot of blinds against him. Gain a little FE later by giving away one SB now.
B)No way you should risk giving him a free card. Betting is much better then CRing since it also gives you a chance to bet\3bet.
C)Just fine. He will bluff a lot more hands if you check then he will call if you bet.

Re: 30/60 @ Wynn
 

You played it textbook. Any other line and you get less value out of him. You won as much as you could here.

Re: 30/60 @ Wynn
 

I play it the same, nice hand.

Re: 30/60 @ Wynn
 

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Do you guys feel I'm loosing value by either



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http://wiki.ytmnd.com/images/1/18/Lose.jpg

Re: 30/60 @ Wynn
 

WTF happened to everyone here? The river is a very straightfoward bet/call. Aggros think everyone is FOS and he will bluffraise the river enough to make bet/call easily the best option.

Re: 30/60 @ Wynn
 

If hero's image is somewhat decent, DaveR, I think checking to induce a bluff is a fine play on the river. Bet/call isn't bad either, but I don't mind the check-call.

Re: 30/60 @ Wynn
 

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If hero's image is somewhat decent, DaveR, I think checking to induce a bluff is a fine play on the river. Bet/call isn't bad either, but I don't mind the check-call.

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Bet/call is better for the reasons I said. You haven't answered them. I also left unsaid the small advantage to value betting him thinly and fearlessly and forcing him to think about the fact that you are adjusting properly to him when he raises light. There are some river cards where check/call is best; this isn't one of them.

Re: 30/60 @ Wynn
 

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If hero's image is somewhat decent, DaveR, I think checking to induce a bluff is a fine play on the river. Bet/call isn't bad either, but I don't mind the check-call.

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I think I had a good image... only played two hands and came in for a raise on both of them over the last 45 minutes (AK and 10-10)...

was defending my blinds about 50-60% of the time.

My though process was that when the king fell on the river there were 3 options:

1) bet, I get raised if he spiked a King and had been playing all the way with overs

2) bet, he folds if he has something like A-10 or 33

3) check/call- my original line... may induce a bluff and/or save me one bet for those times when he did spike a king.

Re: 30/60 @ Wynn
 

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If hero's image is somewhat decent, DaveR, I think checking to induce a bluff

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the problem is that his range has very few hands with no showdown value, so he lacks motive to bluff. if he's a aggro donkey fine, but he's checking behind hoping AQ is good a lot.

Re: 30/60 @ Wynn
 

bet the river... he can most likely call down light here.... i'm pretty sure he's not folding something like 33 if he calls the turn with it or something like T7 and you give him an opportunity to check behind with those hands... and no chance in hell he checks a better hand than J9...

though seeing the results may have influenced my opinion...