\"reading minds\" in poker
 

this is a hand that I played that leads me to believe in being able to "read" someones mind.
It was about an hour and a half into the session and I had about 160 in front of me. There were a lot of PF limpers, and I look down and KK,so I raised to 17 dollars (in a 1-2 nl game at the casino) and ended up being called only by the SB and BB. Flop comes 6h 7h 2c. I looked at the two players to my left and the SB checked as did the BB. It was crazy when I looked at the flop and then looked back at the two players I put them on exactly what they had. I thought that the SB was probably on a weak flush draw and I felt like the big blind hit a set or maybe top two, but I was leaning towards the set. I did not want to follow up and bet into the players when I had that felling, cause if I get put all in I'd muck my hand. So I followed suit and checked. I was looking for a one outer. And it came, the Ks landed on fourth street. Was a nice catch for me. SB checked again and BB lead out with a big bet.I think it was something like fifty dollars. I raised all in right there because I wanted to shut out the flush draw and I knew that the BB would call. To my surprise, the SB went all in as did the BB I had them both covered by a whopping four dollars. The small blind flipped over Jh2h, and BB flipped over his set of sixes. I was amazed that I called there hands exactly without any real information on them. And all I had to avoid was some hearts and I would have trippled up. And then the dealer delivered the river card. Damn, a heart. Probably the sickest hand of my life.
I've done things like that before when plaing card put someone on exactly what they have. I was playing omaha with my friend and whenever I would get that feeling of what he had I would call it out, and I'm always really close if not exactly. I'd call out "queens and sevens, and also a poket pair of kings?" amd then hed flip it over. I think this is something that happens t a lot of poker players. Like doyle said in super system, that's it hard to believe that the human brain being as complex as it is, isn't able to pick up tiny electric signals. I mean, when we turn the blender on the TV gets out of wack, why can't a game of such intense concentration send little brain waves out a few feet across the table? I've seen doyle do it, I've seen chip reese make plays that almost seem as he knew exactly what his opponent had, phil iveys done it in hands, so who's to say its impossibile?

what's your thoughts on it.

lengthy

Re: \"reading minds\" in poker
 

My thought is that you should acquire some fundamental writing composition skills.

Upon successful comprehension and application of stated skills to your posts, someone might actually attempt to read it and potentially respond.

For the record, I did not attempt to read that bloated mess above...I have no desire for a self-inflicted headache.

Re: \"reading minds\" in poker
 

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this is a hand that I played that leads me to believe in being able to "read" someones mind

[/ QUOTE ]

My thoughts are that goofy beliefs like this are expensive.

Like most people here I have a tremendous respect for Doyle, but that's one of the two things he wrote in SS that I disagree with. The other being his thoughts on "being on a rush."

Re: \"reading minds\" in poker
 

i read it. but don't advise anyone else to.

cliff notes: every now and then i guess people's hands, thus i think psychic powers might exist.

Re: \"reading minds\" in poker
 

i read it and i know exactly what you mean. Sometimes its weird you just get that feeling because something so subtle in their body changes or something so subtle leads toward you knowing what they have. Now I'll be honest if you generally get these feelings and are often wrong and as a result play weakk-tight then you're fooling yourself. But I know exactly what you mean and I've gotten these feelings too. Two examples of this for me is folding AcQc preflop in a 10-20 game because I knew my opponnent had me beat preflop and another was folding AK after an open raise in 10-20 limit because I knew I was beat and he had KK preflop. Its a strange game and those electric signals you are talking about..... its true. For those of you who don't believe it, watch this clip and then try to justify this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEfLXr3eSxs

Re: \"reading minds\" in poker
 

Phil Ivey making a great read doesn't qualify as supernatural. I mean, he's Phil Ivey...

Re: \"reading minds\" in poker
 

I had a nightmare in August of 2001 that New York was being bombed by planes. In the dream I went to a Mets game (for some bizarre reason) and then planes started attacking there, too. When my friend called me on the morning of September 11th to tell me about the two planes, I was like, "yeah, okay" because I'd already been through it. And the Mets were supposed to play in Pittsburgh that day. The whole thing was still pretty surreal, the city eerily quiet, smelling like cooking meat, but I digress...

I can't count the number of river cards I've called to a suit, nor the number of times I've put my opponent a very precise hand even without substantial betting history to indicate such...

But I also can't count the number of times I've called the wrong river card, put someone on the wrong hand (although this is a real skill which is one of my poker strengths), or had a dream about zombies or alien invasions.

Needless to say, I haven't found myself fighting off martians yet.

Re: \"reading minds\" in poker
 

I agree with Gonso about the Ivey hand,although i do believe having intuition or a six sense sorta speak is a reality in humans and other intelligent animals.It varies and can not be measured but it exists.

Re: \"reading minds\" in poker
 

Oh, I'm not saying intuition doesn't exist, not at all. That's a different concept than flat-out telepathy.

Re: \"reading minds\" in poker
 

My personal belief is that your brain just subconsciously processes information which your higher (or lower?) brain functions are unaware of. It's like when someone walks in the door and you know something's wrong even though they haven't said or done anything yet. There's better examples, but the point is that intuition or a "feeling you can't explain" doesn't have to be supernatural (or science fiction). It just means that your brain is smarter than you are. Or that you're smarter than you think you are. However you want to look at it.

Re: \"reading minds\" in poker
 

This imo is a very stupid thread!!! just delete it or don´t read it... it´s not because of some stupid electric waves that you can put your opponents on hands!!!

Re: \"reading minds\" in poker
 

[ QUOTE ]
This imo is a very stupid thread!!! just delete it or don´t read it... it´s not because of some stupid electric waves that you can put your opponents on hands!!!

[/ QUOTE ]

Not that big a deal, man. Breathe deep.

Re: \"reading minds\" in poker
 

If you watch Negranau on TV, he often calls out hands that are dead on or very close. But ... if you watch very closely, you'll also notice that even when he thinks he knows a hand, even if he thinks he is behind, he often will call anyway.

In these instances, he's going with the "right play" over his intuition. I think "mind-reading" is picking up on people's betting patterns, mannerisms, timing, etc.

Re: \"reading minds\" in poker
 

1) If you truly have psychic powers, especially if they are of the clairvoyent variety, quit poker. Seriously. And take up roulette.

2) With all the billions that the casino industry spends on security and catching cheats, they don't spend a dime to stop ESP/psychics/clairvoyents. Verdict for the defense.

3) As noted earlier, intuition is different than ESP and it is possible to put players on hands, or discern the strength of their hands but not be able to articulate the exact evidence that led you to that conclusion (This is what I call intuition).

4) Finally, bankroll management. If a guy is drawing to his flush against two sets and wins the pot keep playing against him.

Re: \"reading minds\" in poker
 

when I said esp I ddnt exactly mean being a clairvoient. more along the lines of of what everyone is saying about intuition. I'm sure we have all had that "gut" feeling and ended up being right. this is more of an idea, or something fun to discuss rather then me trying to prove a fact or say that I'm a physcic. of couse if people could read minds with 100 percent certainty, we would all be in a lot of trouble at the table.

Re: \"reading minds\" in poker
 

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of couse if people could read minds with 100 percent certainty, we would all be in a lot of trouble at the table.

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And away from it.

Re: \"reading minds\" in poker
 

This happens a lot but it's nothing special, you just remember the times you have called out the cards correct more clearly than the times you don't. If you really think you have mind reading powers, then buy a notebook and write down every guess you make.
I guarantee you will quickly find out that you can not call the cards more than you miscall them.

Re: \"reading minds\" in poker
 

You weren't reading the cards. The players just had the hands that you were worried about.

Re: \"reading minds\" in poker
 

[ QUOTE ]
when we turn the blender on the TV gets out of wack

[/ QUOTE ]

"Every time Catherine would turn on the microwave, I'd piss my pants
and forget who I was for about half an hour."

-ZEN

Re: \"reading minds\" in poker
 

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And the Mets were supposed to play in Pittsburgh that day.

[/ QUOTE ]

The Mets part of your dream is trivial. The Mets probably play 5-6 times a weak in early autumn.

I haven't read the whole thread, but I think it's entirely plausible that the OP had a read that one player had a monster and the other player had a strong draw. It really wouldn't change the hand much if the monster were top two and the draw were an OESD. (Yes, I realize it would change the hand immensely if the turn paired blanks, but my point is you can perceive a monster more clearly than you can perceive "middle set of sixes".)

I've "read" someone for a turned straight flush when she checked, and lo and behold she had the straight flush, but I'm not sure I'd consider the read any less valid had she had an A-high flush and thought it was the nuts. Nothing supernatural involved; I just picked up a tell from her check motion that something was up.

As has been stated, you need to validate your reads before you value them too highly. See SSHE about tells. Don't trust tells that contradict logic, until you're very sure of them.

Then again, I'm the guy who called the maniac's push for 5 x pot on the flop with AK unimproved because I was pretty sure he was compulsively bluffing. I won without improving. Don't try that without a much better read than I can claim to have had. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: \"reading minds\" in poker
 

umm so you put them on exactly a flush draw and a set from there pf calls and checking the flop to you. this is like opening up to the right page in a book or something and getting all excited and thinking you have some kind of special talent. i want my time back [censored]

Re: \"reading minds\" in poker
 

[ QUOTE ]
The Mets part of your dream is trivial. The Mets probably play 5-6 times a weak in early autumn.

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The other plane landed outside of Pittsburgh. That's why it was "relevant". But either way, it was just a stupid dream.

As for the rest of your post, I think it's spot on. You can pick up tells to judge the relative strength of an opponent's hand, and you can combine that with hand reading ability to determine more precisely which two cards someone is likely to have. From there you can make a guess as to precisely which hand someone has.

I was playing short handed today, raised sixes, got reraised, and the flop came KT6, after he capped the flop, I felt I was up against KK. The turn was a K. Statistically, it was three times as likely he had TT than KK, but I still thought he had KK. He did. Am I psychic? Maybe, if you believe in dreams, but I think it was just a good (easy) read combined with a lucky guess. I played roulette once and lost. So yeah, not psychic.

Re: \"reading minds\" in poker
 

What really sucks is when your mind accidentally "calls" the river card that your opponent needs to give you a bad beat. You think, "If I would have just not thought about the river card I would have won."

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