Phone shuffle
 

Three honest players decide to play a game of cards with a 36-card deck over the phone.

They need to deal the whole deck of cards in 3 equal parts, with the cards "face down". How can they do that?

Re: Phone shuffle
 

This isn't specified clearly enough.

Re: Phone shuffle
 

Sorry, I must be stupid, but I have absolutely no clue what you're asking?

Re: Phone shuffle
 

Hang up and get two hookers and an eight ball.

Re: Phone shuffle
 

go fish

Re: Phone shuffle
 

[ QUOTE ]
Sorry, I must be stupid, but I have absolutely no clue what you're asking?

[/ QUOTE ]
I meant, how do they play the game while on the phone?

Re: Phone shuffle
 

Whats so confusing? Hes asking how they can shuffle and distribute the cards so that each person only knows the cards they are personally dealt.

Re: Phone shuffle
 

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Whats so confusing? Hes asking how they can shuffle and distribute the cards so that each person only knows the cards they are personally dealt.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is indeed what I was asking. The deal should be random of course.

Re: Phone shuffle
 

[ QUOTE ]
Three honest players decide to play a game of cards with a 36-card deck over the phone.

They need to deal the whole deck of cards in 3 equal parts, with the cards "face down". How can they do that?

[/ QUOTE ]

is this before or after the advent of camera/video phones?

Re: Phone shuffle
 

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[ QUOTE ]
Whats so confusing? Hes asking how they can shuffle and distribute the cards so that each person only knows the cards they are personally dealt.

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This is indeed what I was asking. The deal should be random of course.

[/ QUOTE ]

My shot at it in white:

<font color="white">Have each player take a fresh unshuffled deck of cards and lay them out on a numbered grid from 1-52. One player generates a sequence of random simple permutations that he instructs the other players to duplicate. For example, exchange the 12th card on the grid with the 27th card. After a few thousand such permutations the 3 decks will be identically randomly shuffled with the complexity high enough so that noone can follow any card through the process to predict where any of them are. One player takes the top cards, one the ones after that, and the third the ones after that. They are all honest so noone looks at cards he isn't dealt. </font>

PairTheBoard

Re: Phone shuffle
 

Looks good PTB, but somehow I doubt its the most efficient solution...

Re: Phone shuffle
 

[ QUOTE ]
Three honest players decide to play a game of cards with a 36-card deck over the phone.

They need to deal the whole deck of cards in 3 equal parts, with the cards "face down". How can they do that?

[/ QUOTE ]
Hey, Izverg.. welcome to POG. You should try a game of werewolf and get addicted like me [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

Re: Phone shuffle
 

Hmm.. if you're also mostsmooth, I guess maybe you're addicted already...

Re: Phone shuffle
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Three honest players decide to play a game of cards with a 36-card deck over the phone.

They need to deal the whole deck of cards in 3 equal parts, with the cards "face down". How can they do that?

[/ QUOTE ]
Hey, Izverg.. welcome to POG. You should try a game of werewolf and get addicted like me [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

I can't tell what level this joke is on, if any.

Re: Phone shuffle
 

[ QUOTE ]
Hmm.. if you're also mostsmooth, I guess maybe you're addicted already...

[/ QUOTE ]

OK, apparently it wasn't a leveled joke.

(You DO know who mostsmooth is...right?)

Re: Phone shuffle
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Hmm.. if you're also mostsmooth, I guess maybe you're addicted already...

[/ QUOTE ]

OK, apparently it wasn't a leveled joke.

(You DO know who mostsmooth is...right?)

[/ QUOTE ]
Not a levelled joke. I know Izverg from Elsewhere (not sure he remembers this username), but don't know if he's tied to any other accounts.

Re: Phone shuffle
 

I doubt the OP is mostsmooth...

For starters, he's Russian with 99% probability...

36 cards, lol...

Re: Phone shuffle
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Hmm.. if you're also mostsmooth, I guess maybe you're addicted already...

[/ QUOTE ]

OK, apparently it wasn't a leveled joke.

(You DO know who mostsmooth is...right?)

[/ QUOTE ]
Not a levelled joke. I know Izverg from Elsewhere (not sure he remembers this username), but don't know if he's tied to any other accounts.

[/ QUOTE ]

hahahahahahahahahahahahah

This is mostsmooth's way of still posting after banning himself.

Re: Phone shuffle
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Hmm.. if you're also mostsmooth, I guess maybe you're addicted already...

[/ QUOTE ]

OK, apparently it wasn't a leveled joke.

(You DO know who mostsmooth is...right?)

[/ QUOTE ]
Not a levelled joke. I know Izverg from Elsewhere (not sure he remembers this username), but don't know if he's tied to any other accounts.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks for the welcome. Your username sounds awfully familiar, but I can't remember who you became (I assume you changed it to something I should know better?)

Umm, I have no idea who mostsmooth is [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

I just looked up Mafia on Wikipedia -- I had no idea it was invented as late as 1986. I distinctly remember playing it in school in 1989, who would've thought that it was a brand new game.

Re: Phone shuffle
 

[ QUOTE ]
I doubt the OP is mostsmooth...

For starters, he's Russian with 99% probability...

36 cards, lol...

[/ QUOTE ]

A game of Durak, anyone? [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

On a more serioius note, anyone wants to give another shot to the puzzle? PTB's solution is not very satisfactory, since with that solution you could say that players do know each other's hands. It sucks to have the solution rely on players' bad memory.

Re: Phone shuffle
 

[ QUOTE ]

A game of Durak, anyone? [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]



[/ QUOTE ]

podkidnoi ili perevodnoi?...
[/Russian]

It's a reference to a Russian game played with a 36-card deck. Not poker-like at all...

Re: Phone shuffle
 

Her is one possible way. One player decides on the order by which each player arranges his/her deck. For example, Ac, 2h, 7d,10s, kd, 2d etc....

So, after that is done each player has the cards in the same order. Then one player ask each other player to name a number between 10 and 20. Let's say one player picks 13 and the other picks 9 (for a total of 22). Now the players count off the first 22 cards and put them on the bottom. They still all have the same sequence as each other.

They then agree to each put the cards in a grid in front of them. They aggree to 4 rows of 13. Then they take turns establishing a "common" grid.

For example, I say the first card goes in spot 1 in the 3rd row, and all three players do that. The next guy says the 2nd card becomes the first card in row 2, etc. This goes on until all 52 cards are in the 4 rows of 13. After this is done, all the grids should be identical. Also, unless someone has a photgrahic memory, nobody would no where the cards are unless they looked at the initial master sequence list, and they are all "honest" so they would not do that.

Now, to determine the hands. First, one player could claim the first 12 cards of row 3 as his, and the next guy could claim the first 12 cards in row 1 as his, and the last guy could claim the first 12 cards in row 4 as his, for example.

Note: I did this with a 52 card deck, with 36 in play, and 12 for each player. The same process could work with a 36 card deck with 12 for each player. Just make three rows of 12 of 6 rows of 6.

Re: Phone shuffle
 

I think we are looking for a mathematical solution, not one that can be foiled by either player having a perfect memory.

I think I've solved it. If this works it is pretty elegant:

<font color=" white">C shuffles the deck.

A and B agree on an order to listen to the phone, so that during each 5 second interval for the next 2 minutes, exactly one of them will be listening. For example, A could listen for the first minute, then B listens for the next minute. Or A listens for 5 seconds, then B for 10, etc. They make sure each of them is listening for a total of 12 5-second intervals.

Every 5 seconds for 2 minutes, C deals out one of the remaining card and calls its name down the phone.

C takes the remaining 12 cards and they start to play.</font>

Re: Phone shuffle
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think we are looking for a mathematical solution, not one that can be foiled by either player having a perfect memory.

I think I've solved it. If this works it is pretty elegant:

<font color=" white">C shuffles the deck.

A and B agree on an order to listen to the phone, so that during each 5 second interval for the next 2 minutes, exactly one of them will be listening. For example, A could listen for the first minute, then B listens for the next minute. Or A listens for 5 seconds, then B for 10, etc. They make sure each of them is listening for a total of 12 5-second intervals.

Every 5 seconds for 2 minutes, C deals out one of the remaining card and calls its name down the phone.

C takes the remaining 12 cards and they start to play.</font>

[/ QUOTE ]

So C knows everyone's cards???

Re: Phone shuffle
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I think we are looking for a mathematical solution, not one that can be foiled by either player having a perfect memory.

I think I've solved it. If this works it is pretty elegant:

<font color=" white">C shuffles the deck.

A and B agree on an order to listen to the phone, so that during each 5 second interval for the next 2 minutes, exactly one of them will be listening. For example, A could listen for the first minute, then B listens for the next minute. Or A listens for 5 seconds, then B for 10, etc. They make sure each of them is listening for a total of 12 5-second intervals.

Every 5 seconds for 2 minutes, C deals out one of the remaining card and calls its name down the phone.

C takes the remaining 12 cards and they start to play.</font>

[/ QUOTE ]

So C knows everyone's cards???

[/ QUOTE ]

Theres only 36 cards in the deck, and all 36 are dealt out. He'd know which cards his opponents had just by looking at his own hand, it doesnt matter that he read them into the phone. The point is that he doesn't know which player recieved each card.

Re: Phone shuffle
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I think we are looking for a mathematical solution, not one that can be foiled by either player having a perfect memory.

I think I've solved it. If this works it is pretty elegant:

<font color=" white">C shuffles the deck.

A and B agree on an order to listen to the phone, so that during each 5 second interval for the next 2 minutes, exactly one of them will be listening. For example, A could listen for the first minute, then B listens for the next minute. Or A listens for 5 seconds, then B for 10, etc. They make sure each of them is listening for a total of 12 5-second intervals.

Every 5 seconds for 2 minutes, C deals out one of the remaining card and calls its name down the phone.

C takes the remaining 12 cards and they start to play.</font>

[/ QUOTE ]

So C knows everyone's cards???

[/ QUOTE ]

Theres only 36 cards in the deck, and all 36 are dealt out. He'd know which cards his opponents had just by looking at his own hand, it doesnt matter that he read them into the phone. The point is that he doesn't know which player recieved each card.

[/ QUOTE ]

Cool.


PairTheBoard

Re: Phone shuffle
 

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Thanks for the welcome. Your username sounds awfully familiar, but I can't remember who you became (I assume you changed it to something I should know better?)

[/ QUOTE ]
So far, we've never been on the same casino cruise.

Re: Phone shuffle
 

the op is not mostsmooth
i dont know what the fark you guys are talking about

Re: Phone shuffle
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Sorry, I must be stupid, but I have absolutely no clue what you're asking?

[/ QUOTE ]
I meant, how do they play the game while on the phone?

[/ QUOTE ]
Sorry mostsmooth.. when you post to the same thread with multiple gimmick accounts ("mute", I assume), you have to expect some confusion.

Re: Phone shuffle
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Sorry, I must be stupid, but I have absolutely no clue what you're asking?

[/ QUOTE ]
I meant, how do they play the game while on the phone?

[/ QUOTE ]
Sorry mostsmooth.. when you post to the same thread with multiple gimmick accounts ("mute", I assume), you have to expect some confusion.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yikes!

Re: Phone shuffle
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Sorry, I must be stupid, but I have absolutely no clue what you're asking?

[/ QUOTE ]
I meant, how do they play the game while on the phone?

[/ QUOTE ]
Sorry mostsmooth.. when you post to the same thread with multiple gimmick accounts ("mute", I assume), you have to expect some confusion.

[/ QUOTE ]
gimmick? i dont have any gimmick accounts
who do i look like? elroy?

Re: Phone shuffle
 

[ QUOTE ]
gimmick? i dont have any gimmick accounts
who do i look like? elroy?

[/ QUOTE ]
Eh.. hard to keep track. It's just that your avatar reminds me of someone.. can't quite place it. [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

By the way, did you see that horrible "situation puzzle" that was posted the other day? Yikes.

Re: Phone shuffle
 

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[ QUOTE ]
gimmick? i dont have any gimmick accounts
who do i look like? elroy?

[/ QUOTE ]
Eh.. hard to keep track. It's just that your avatar reminds me of someone.. can't quite place it. [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

By the way, did you see that horrible "situation puzzle" that was posted the other day? Yikes.

[/ QUOTE ]
theres like 6 people with this avatar
the puzzle was fine, the guessers were awful

Re: Phone shuffle
 

The blind one should've been the answer [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

Re: Phone shuffle
 

scott has at least 6 accts

But a bunch of OOTers stole his avatar to piss him off for being a moran

Re: Phone shuffle
 

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[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I think we are looking for a mathematical solution, not one that can be foiled by either player having a perfect memory.

I think I've solved it. If this works it is pretty elegant:

<font color=" white">C shuffles the deck.

A and B agree on an order to listen to the phone, so that during each 5 second interval for the next 2 minutes, exactly one of them will be listening. For example, A could listen for the first minute, then B listens for the next minute. Or A listens for 5 seconds, then B for 10, etc. They make sure each of them is listening for a total of 12 5-second intervals.

Every 5 seconds for 2 minutes, C deals out one of the remaining card and calls its name down the phone.

C takes the remaining 12 cards and they start to play.</font>

[/ QUOTE ]

So C knows everyone's cards???

[/ QUOTE ]

Theres only 36 cards in the deck, and all 36 are dealt out. He'd know which cards his opponents had just by looking at his own hand, it doesnt matter that he read them into the phone. The point is that he doesn't know which player recieved each card.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ok...good one... This would work as well. So now we have at least two solutions.