3/6 Maximizing vs. TAG
 

CO is a multi-tabling TAG that I've played a lot against. Might be a 2+2'er, I'm not sure. He's 25/17 (edit from 12)/3.2 over a 3k+ sample. I also have some history with him in the FR games on Party. He is very capable of making tough folds at any point in a hand.

I think he knows that I would 3-bet his CO openraise relatively lightly, but regardless of that I view his cap as meaning either AK or AA-QQ. The fact that both of the blinds are loose/terrible probably gives my 3bet a little more weight, too. His bet/3-bet line on the turn (coupled with a noticeable pause before 3betting) tells me that he has an overpair pretty much 100% of the time here, and that it's going to be AA the vast majority of those. I believe he would have expected me to raise the flop with a ten, so he's very unlikely to put me on turned trips.

Full Tilt Poker
Limit Holdem Ring game
Limit: $3/$6
5 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (5 players) Hero is Button with 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]
UTG folds, <font color="#cc0000">CO raises</font>, <font color="#cc0000">Hero 3-bets</font>, 2 folds, <font color="#cc0000">CO caps</font>, Hero calls.

Flop: (9.5SB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
<font color="#cc0000">CO bets</font>, Hero calls.

Turn: (5.75BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
<font color="#cc0000">CO bets</font>, <font color="#cc0000">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#cc0000">CO 3-bets</font>, Hero...?

Given the read, go ahead and cap the turn, or call the 3bet intending to raise a non-ace river or bet the river if he checks to me?

Re: 3/6 Maximizing vs. TAG
 

he mite be able to fold to ur cap with an overpair if hes capable of what u think he is, as his 3bet is because he knows u might wait to pop the turn with a wide range he beats JJ QQ KK (if he has AA), maybe even 88 99 picked up flush draw on this board on the turn u could raise. against a very good tag u could call here pop the river call the 3bet but id cap here. river if he leads is tougher

is his capping range vs u that tight preflop? it could be 10 10 or even 77 vs many opponents if ur 3bettin light, after his turn action its a real hand im thinkin but ive seen bet 3bet bluffs on top pair pairing before so maybe not cappin here is best.

u can go either way same amount of bets go in most of the time if u cap bet river or call raise river as long as hes got what u put him on (and he cant get away from it after 3bettin the river)

Re: 3/6 Maximizing vs. TAG
 

[ QUOTE ]
is his capping range vs u that tight preflop?

[/ QUOTE ]

I believe it is. Partially a carryover from our FR days, partially because of position, and partially because he has a tendency towards weak/tight play at times. JJ-TT are possible, although I'd expect him to call the 3bet and wait for a safe flop with either of those hands. I don't think he's capping 77 OOP ever.

Re: 3/6 Maximizing vs. TAG
 

I'd cap the turn. no sense in waiting. If he has a 10 he won't fold.

Re: 3/6 Maximizing vs. TAG
 

I dont understand the point of this post. Please cap the turn. There is absolutely no other viable line here once youve established the fact that you think the villain has an overpair. Keep in mind that if you capped the turn and he folded his Aces, this is a great event for you becuz any overpair has a profitable draw to beat you.

Re: 3/6 Maximizing vs. TAG
 

Cap the turn.

You want him to fold his AA. Take the pot while you can!

Re: 3/6 Maximizing vs. TAG
 

^^

I agree with Freddy above.

Re: 3/6 Maximizing vs. TAG
 

id keep betting infinitum

Re: 3/6 Maximizing vs. TAG
 

Okay, okay...I did cap the turn, and he did fold to the cap. I was obviously a bit disappointed &amp; thought that I could've gotten at least 1 more BB out of him by calling the 3bet, but I also wasn't thinking of the fact that he actually had four outs to a win, and not just two.

Re: 3/6 Maximizing vs. TAG
 

Given your description and read of Aces I wait for the river.
If you think there is a chance this is A10 (which you don't) than I would keep banging right now.

Re: 3/6 Maximizing vs. TAG
 

[ QUOTE ]
Given your description and read of Aces I wait for the river.
If you think there is a chance this is A10 (which you don't) than I would keep banging right now.

[/ QUOTE ]

What is the point of waiting til the river if we assume the villain has AA.

Re: 3/6 Maximizing vs. TAG
 

raise flop plz

Re: 3/6 Maximizing vs. TAG
 

If you think his pf capping range is that tight then raise/call flop, raise/cap turn.

Re: 3/6 Maximizing vs. TAG
 

[ QUOTE ]
raise flop plz

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: 3/6 Maximizing vs. TAG
 

[ QUOTE ]
Cap the turn.

You want him to fold his AA. Take the pot while you can!

[/ QUOTE ]

I actually don't really care whether or not he folds to the cap. It's pretty damn close to neutral EV.

I'm actually going to vote for raising the river as he will continuation bet the river everytime when we don't cap and we will get 5 big bets both ways. Against a good opponent, I don't think that I would raise the river if he bets into u and u capped the turn, so I can't see extracting more than just than 5. Also, waiting to the river gives u chance to save 1 or 2 bets should a T fall.

That, and for the love of god, just raise the flop.

Re: 3/6 Maximizing vs. TAG
 

[ QUOTE ]
if you capped the turn and he folded his Aces, this is a great event for you becuz any overpair has a profitable draw to beat you.

[/ QUOTE ]

Good point.

And fold preflop. I'm inclined to suspect 3B'g preflop w/ 44 is a big loser.

Re: 3/6 Maximizing vs. TAG
 

i think you should raise on the flop. when ppl get aggressive in 6-max then you make a good hand you raise raise raise man.

Re: 3/6 Maximizing vs. TAG
 

[ QUOTE ]
raise flop plz

[/ QUOTE ]

I usually would. This time I didn't.

Re: 3/6 Maximizing vs. TAG
 

ok what about folding preflop especially with "loose/terrible" blinds? or do you usually do this too? i think preflop is -ev and the postflop line you chose is less +ev than raising immediately on the flop.

Re: 3/6 Maximizing vs. TAG
 

[worthless post]
fold preflop, raise flop, cap turn
[/worthless post]

Re: 3/6 Maximizing vs. TAG
 

We don't really want him folding AA assuming we always get 2BB in on the river if we just call. He has 4 outs and the pot is ~13BB, so by making him fold we gain ~1.3BB, and by waiting we make 2BB. I am still tempted to cap the turn though as I'm guessing more often than not he won't fold, and if he does we might be able to take advantage of that later on, although if he's good he'll probably make a note that he made a big laydown against you so maybe this doesn't apply.

Re: 3/6 Maximizing vs. TAG
 

[ QUOTE ]
i think preflop is -ev

[/ QUOTE ]

That's something I'd like to discuss (or if any of you have a link to a prior thread on the topic, that would be better).

I don't "usually" fold small pocket pairs on the button vs. a CO openraise, at least not if the CO is a TAG. In this case in particular I felt his initial raising standards would be fairly low because of the blinds...the cap when it got down to HU obviously showed that he had a huge hand.

But is this a fold preflop? It seems like I'm often going to have the best hand preflop, and if I can get it to heads up with position I should be able to escape for a minimal loss if I'm outflopped. I know making a play like this adds to my variance, but I can handle that aspect of it.

I'm still a noob to short-handed play, so I appreciate any &amp; all advice y'all can give me. If I sounded dismissive earlier, it wasn't intented that way.

I just checked on PT, and it's a small sample size &amp; all, but over my first 15k 6max hands on FT I'm showing a profit on all pocket pairs except 44 &amp; 22. I'm VPIP'ing at least 50% on all of them. Is that typical of 6max, or just a byproduct of the sample size?

Re: 3/6 Maximizing vs. TAG
 

"if I can get it to heads up with position I should be able to escape for a minimal loss if I'm outflopped."

yeah or maybe you end up folding the best hand when he semibluffs the flop, or maybe he decides to cap semi-light with AJ and flops K9x and you fold the flop. there are good and bad things that can happen postflop. it is hard to get value from this hand because you always have to dodge the possibility of being blown off of it.

plus just the simple fact that you have loose blinds to act back there makes it somewhat rare (maybe 40% of the time?) that you get it heads up in the first place.

regarding your vpip with these pairs, i'll try to remember to check when i get home.