Options after Neteller?
 

So what are the options after neteller?

Will e-checks work or are banks expected to stop these as a part of the regulations?

What about Central Coin? Has anybody used this before and is it a viable alternative?


Anything else...??

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

Once neteller actually dies (note: it has not yet died. the sky has not fallen.), something else will come along.

Depositing via credit card was illegal for eons, but you could do that on PartyPoker, using a US credit card, right up until the day they closed up shop.

There will be some reasonable convenient way to deposit, only problem is it might be slightly different than the current ways.

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

woah, whats happening with neteller?

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

[ QUOTE ]
woah, whats happening with neteller?

[/ QUOTE ]
Reside under a rock?

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

I got a letter from Royal Vegas Poker on the Prima network, suggesting I use something called Click2Pay. I got the letter before this Neteller announcement too, if you want to read anything into that. I don't have a ton of faith in Prima, so I'm a bit skeptical, but it's worth looking into.



The Letter:

We have a wide variety of easy-to-use deposit methods to insure that you have a great time at the Royal Vegas Poker tables!

While one of these methods - FirePay has stopped processing deposits to Royal Vegas Poker on behalf of customers resident in the United States, we have many more deposit methods that you can use to continue playing with us.

These Deposit methods include: Click2Pay, PaySpark, Neteller, eCheck Moneybookers, your Credit Cards and many more deposit methods.

If you have not used Click2Pay in the past, we would very much like like to suggest that you convert to this payment option. We believe it to be the most suitable option for you.

With Click2Pay, you will be able to:


Create a single account
Deposit from virtually anywhere
Fund your account via Credit Card, ACH and Direct Debit
Ensure security via a personal code and password
Deposit small and large amounts

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

MAIN TAKEAWAY:

Bottom line is that Neteller is still around now, business as usual. Neteller may or may not be around in 270 days, but we also have 270 days for players, e-wallets, banks, etc. to think of and establish workarounds. In this forum alone, we have already thought of 5 different workarounds in the first week after the bill was passed. How long do you think it will take for us to think of the workarounds after the law is enforced?? Not very long if you ask me.


Important Note: Though it is good to brainstorm some of the workaround ideas now, we need to be careful to keep some of these workarounds to ourselves until after the law begins to be enforced. You never know if the US government may be snooping around in these forums.

Spidey74

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

[ QUOTE ]

What about Central Coin? Has anybody used this before and is it a viable alternative?

[/ QUOTE ]

I've used Central Coin successfully several times in the past, but haven't tried it in the last year.

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

deleted

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

There will be plenty of alternatives to Neteller, there already are. The problem with Neteller going away is the reputation it has as an above the board honest company.

Players will need to be careful when choosing the alternatives.

As for ways to fund ewallets? 900 numbers, phone cards...the list goes on

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

I don't think they said they were going away after 270 days. It depends on what the regulations are.

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

[ QUOTE ]
MAIN TAKEAWAY:

Bottom line is that Neteller is still around now, business as usual. Neteller may or may not be around in 270 days, but we also have 270 days for players, e-wallets, banks, etc. to think of and establish workarounds. In this forum alone, we have already thought of 5 different workarounds in the first week after the bill was passed. How long do you think it will take for us to think of the workarounds after the law is enforced?? Not very long if you ask me.


Important Note: Though it is good to brainstorm some of the workaround ideas now, we need to be careful to keep some of these workarounds to ourselves until after the law begins to be enforced. You never know if the US government may be snooping around in these forums.

Spidey74

[/ QUOTE ]

if they are snooping i hope they can see my personal message to them: FUUUUUUUUUKKKKK UUUUUUUUU

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

I linked to CentralCoin from Stars and noticed that you have to submit your social security number. I don't remember doing that with Neteller and don't think I'd feel comfortable giving that information up to some offshore middleman. Why is that information necessary for a middleman to have? What do they need it for?

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

Now that everyone's going to give this more thought, I wanted to throw this back out there. What is the problem with a foreign bank account? Just like with Neteller, you will have to report it if the balance ever exceeds 10k as well as on your form 1040, but I hear the brits all use their credit cards to deposit. Since it would be a foreign bank not restricted from gambling transactions, we should be able to do the same.

Is the problem that our status with that bank will be a US citizen and the bank will stop us? I have to imagine those swiss banks don't give a [censored] what the US wants....

Anyone educated on this, please let me know. Why would this not be a viable option? I'd be willing to fly to Switzerland to do this. I always wanted to say I had a Swiss bank account. Minimum balance? [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

btw, thought about this after I posted. Please don't respond with the "What about the fish" or "The fish will never follow"

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Now that everyone's going to give this more thought, I wanted to throw this back out there. What is the problem with a foreign bank account? Just like with Neteller, you will have to report it if the balance ever exceeds 10k as well as on your form 1040, but I hear the brits all use their credit cards to deposit. Since it would be a foreign bank not restricted from gambling transactions, we should be able to do the same.

Is the problem that our status with that bank will be a US citizen and the bank will stop us? I have to imagine those swiss banks don't give a [censored] what the US wants....

Anyone educated on this, please let me know. Why would this not be a viable option? I'd be willing to fly to Switzerland to do this. I always wanted to say I had a Swiss bank account. Minimum balance? [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

Cuz to open a foreign bank account requires a large amount of money to either incorporate or register as a business in said country OR you have to be a resident in said country with an address there and identification

It's doable, but costly

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

What's a large amount of money? Are you guessing or do you actually know. I'm not challenging... I'm seriously asking. I would do this if it would cost a few thousand. Now if that number was 10's of thousands.....

Someone on this board HAS to be a US citizen AND have a foreign bank account and know the answer to this.

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

[ QUOTE ]
What's a large amount of money? Are you guessing or do you actually know. I'm not challenging... I'm seriously asking. I would do this if it would cost a few thousand. Now if that number was 10's of thousands.....

Someone on this board HAS to be a US citizen AND have a foreign bank account and know the answer to this.

[/ QUOTE ]

There's usually min deposit and min balance requirement of anwyhere from $5k on up for a foreign bank account.

Check the Isle of Man banks...they're cheaper than the Swiss banks and just as safe

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

There are problems within the EU with opening bank accounts. The bank usually wants some proof of residence within the country that the bank is located in etc etc...
If I was american I would go to the Caribbean somewhere...what about Canada?.
But don't expect EU-banks to be open to anybody, they are fairly strictly regulated...

But I am sure there wil be a trillion ways to get around this - there is simply too much money out there that wants to be directed into the poker sites and no legislation in the world can change that.

The poker genie went out of the bottle almost 10 years ago and the legislation cant reverse it.

Have faith, the flop will be good again soon!

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

Swiss bank accounts are -- as far as I know -- readily usable by Americans without booking a flight to Zurich. You do not have to reside in Switzerland. Everything can be done by mail.

What about using eGold? The value of your account rises and falls with gold's price. I haven't noticed that as a poker site deposit method though.

From interpretations by legal experts (not regular posters)on Cardplayer, ordinary checks will not be affected by the new regs as there are just too darn many of them to track.

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

[ QUOTE ]
From interpretations by legal experts (not regular posters)on Cardplayer, ordinary checks will not be affected by the new regs as there are just too darn many of them to track.

[/ QUOTE ]

From what I heard checks are going to be exempt from the new law. I will try to find a link to confirm.....

Edit: The law says funding through checks is illegal but te provisions for monitoring have not come out yet. I guess we will see.

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

I haven't had to deposit into my Neteller account in over 2 years. If Neteller caves, will we still be able to cash out FROM poker sites to Neteller and from Neteller to our checking accounts?

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

All forms of funding would be illegal, but if checks are exempted or impossible to enforce at least we could get money out.

The main problem is for the fish to be able to keep funding their accounts...time will tell.

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

Neteller already gave up the Maryland market after being threatened by state officials after Maryland banned online gaming, (article on media sticky). As a publicly traded company they are legally bound to follow all laws and regulations of the jurisdictions in which they operate, whether or not they are overseas. Therefore, it is extremely unlike they will continue, especially as poker is a minority of their business.

I posted these to a previous thread on Neteller, but as they haven't shown up on the official media sticky yet, here they are again,

What Would You Do Without Neteller? - including info about dropping Maryland

http://www.sportsbookreview.com/Articles/11.aspx

Online Gambling Goes Underground - A U.S. law aimed at cracking down on Internet gambling may drive the practice more into the shadows and do little to deter bettors (excellent article predicting the future landscape and role of e-wallets, discusses existing private e-payment services and likehood of increased financial risk for poker players)

http://www.businessweek.com/technolo...019_454543.htm

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

[ QUOTE ]
All forms of funding would be illegal, but if checks are exempted or impossible to enforce at least we could get money out.

[/ QUOTE ]


the law only makes deposits illegal. Electronic cashouts are not covered in the law.

all we need is for 1 foreign ewallet company to sack up and say that U.S. law doesn't have juridiction over it.

which it doesn't.

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

[ QUOTE ]
What's a large amount of money? Are you guessing or do you actually know. I'm not challenging... I'm seriously asking. I would do this if it would cost a few thousand. Now if that number was 10's of thousands.....

Someone on this board HAS to be a US citizen AND have a foreign bank account and know the answer to this.

[/ QUOTE ]

I have a foreign account at Cayman National in the Cayman Islands. Its easy and I have a VISA card with them as well.

min. deposit there is $1000 and they have applications online.

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

Are there any risks associated with having a foreign bank account? Do you report the interest on this account in your taxes, or do you just not let the US government know that it even exists? Do you transfer money between this account and a U.S. banking account, or do you just do cash withdrawals from ATMs?

Also, how much is the ATM fee? I looked at their Schedule of Fees, but it's not clear. (Or is an ATM withdrawal the same as a "Cash Advance"?)

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Important Note: Though it is good to brainstorm some of the workaround ideas now, we need to be careful to keep some of these workarounds to ourselves until after the law begins to be enforced. You never know if the US government may be snooping around in these forums.


[/ QUOTE ]

OH no ...... Um now i am scared , first my phone and now... AHHHHH I am saying tooo muuuchh. Please don't squash me like a bug.

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

[ QUOTE ]
I got a letter from Royal Vegas Poker on the Prima network, suggesting I use something called Click2Pay. I got the letter before this Neteller announcement too, if you want to read anything into that. I don't have a ton of faith in Prima, so I'm a bit skeptical, but it's worth looking into.



[/ QUOTE ]

I've used Click2Pay to deposit funds into Full Tilt. It's worked just fine. So there are perfectly viable alternatives to Neteller right now. The problem is, I'm afraid all of these services will be shut down by the new regulations. [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

Send Cash.

Sarge[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Are there any risks associated with having a foreign bank account? Do you report the interest on this account in your taxes, or do you just not let the US government know that it even exists? Do you transfer money between this account and a U.S. banking account, or do you just do cash withdrawals from ATMs?

Also, how much is the ATM fee? I looked at their Schedule of Fees, but it's not clear. (Or is an ATM withdrawal the same as a "Cash Advance"?)

[/ QUOTE ]

THere are no risks. Just pay taxes on anything u make from it. Low fees on ATM w/ds.

Indy

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

By the way, if u guys have never been to the Cayman Islands, you should really take some vacation time and go down there. Its the most beautiful and awesome place on the planet. Its the only place I've been where there are high quality coral reefs right out in front of your hotel. Its an expensive country but really worth it. I could post some of my vacation pics if anybody is interested. Did I mention that you can get great cuban cigars there?

Indy

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

On foreign bank accounts, you may want to peruse Hide Your Assets and Disappear by Pankau. It's a book by a private investigator giving advice for asset protection and generally getting off the judicial and financial radar. One section walks through off-shore banking havens. It rates countries on safety, ease, stability and confidentiality and gives detailed info about laws and account opening requirements. It's a good veiw of procedures from a source who's experience comes from finding people who make mistakes, and he seems to know what works to make his job impossible. It was written in 2000, and may be a little out of date on specifics. But the general profiles and advice probably till apply, and it's a starting point.

One hint: If you buy this book, you may want to pay cash at the bookstore and not associate your name with its purchase. Who know who's listenting?

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

[ QUOTE ]
By the way, if u guys have never been to the Cayman Islands, you should really take some vacation time and go down there. Its the most beautiful and awesome place on the planet. Its the only place I've been where there are high quality coral reefs right out in front of your hotel. Its an expensive country but really worth it. I could post some of my vacation pics if anybody is interested. Did I mention that you can get great cuban cigars there?

Indy

[/ QUOTE ]

Not to sidetrack the thread, but I think it would be cool to see those pictures. You should post them in OOT.

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
By the way, if u guys have never been to the Cayman Islands, you should really take some vacation time and go down there. Its the most beautiful and awesome place on the planet. Its the only place I've been where there are high quality coral reefs right out in front of your hotel. Its an expensive country but really worth it. I could post some of my vacation pics if anybody is interested. Did I mention that you can get great cuban cigars there?

Indy

[/ QUOTE ]

Not to sidetrack the thread, but I think it would be cool to see those pictures. You should post them in OOT.

[/ QUOTE ]

i have been perma banned from OOT.

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

[ QUOTE ]


i have been perma banned from OOT.

[/ QUOTE ]

DOH!!

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
MAIN TAKEAWAY:

Bottom line is that Neteller is still around now, business as usual. Neteller may or may not be around in 270 days, but we also have 270 days for players, e-wallets, banks, etc. to think of and establish workarounds. In this forum alone, we have already thought of 5 different workarounds in the first week after the bill was passed. How long do you think it will take for us to think of the workarounds after the law is enforced?? Not very long if you ask me.


Important Note: Though it is good to brainstorm some of the workaround ideas now, we need to be careful to keep some of these workarounds to ourselves until after the law begins to be enforced. You never know if the US government may be snooping around in these forums.

Spidey74

[/ QUOTE ]

if they are snooping i hope they can see my personal message to them: FUUUUUUUUUKKKKK UUUUUUUUU

[/ QUOTE ]

George: "Hey Dick, take a note of this guy"

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
By the way, if u guys have never been to the Cayman Islands, you should really take some vacation time and go down there. Its the most beautiful and awesome place on the planet. Its the only place I've been where there are high quality coral reefs right out in front of your hotel. Its an expensive country but really worth it. I could post some of my vacation pics if anybody is interested. Did I mention that you can get great cuban cigars there?

Indy

[/ QUOTE ]

Not to sidetrack the thread, but I think it would be cool to see those pictures. You should post them in OOT.

[/ QUOTE ]

i have been perma banned from OOT.

[/ QUOTE ]

What the hell do you do to get banned form there? All I got were some sweet ass stars. By the way...I am an exhoosier.

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

i got drunk and posted some stuff.

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/061020/to375.html?.v=5

this is a HUGE payday loan company might get interesting, they are considering buying an e-wallet

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]


i have been perma banned from OOT.

[/ QUOTE ]



[/ QUOTE ]

That falls under the heading of "Brag" [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

Re: Options after Neteller?
 

[ QUOTE ]
What the hell do you do to get banned form there? All I got were some sweet ass stars. By the way...I am an exhoosier.

[/ QUOTE ]
The Moderator for OOT is [censored]. Getting perma-banned by him depends on whether he's PMSing on that particular day or not.

If you've been banished to ** status for a few months and want to get your former 2+2 status reinstated, just send [censored] a private PM asking him to restore it. He usually complies.