Other Countries to Live/Play
 

If one was looking for a new country to belong to, what would be some good choices?

Assume:
1. English being the main language is important.
2. Cost of Living.

The obvious answer is Candada. What are some others?

Re: Other Countries to Live/Play
 

The cost of moving probably won't be worth it because poker will become ALOT less profitable if there is a ban in the U.S.

Re: Other Countries to Live/Play
 

This is something I was considering also. In doing a little research, I found one big roadblock is most countries require residency for quite some time (1-3 years?)before you can apply for citizenship. I would hate to pay taxes to a US government that made online poker illegal. Anyone who has some experience in other countries regarding taxes and living conditions a report would be appreciated.

Re: Other Countries to Live/Play
 

Gunslinger, online poker is rigged. HEHEHEHE just kiddin you.

First 80k you make in another country is tax free in the USA, however you must pay tax's on that money in the country you are in.

So the UK would be a good example of a place to go, because they dont tax gambling winnings.

Thats my understanding of it anyways.

Re: Other Countries to Live/Play
 

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First 80k you make in another country is tax free in the USA



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How do you know this? do you have a reference for this?

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research it... Ive read that in multiple places.

Re: Other Countries to Live/Play
 

IRS Publication 54
http://www.irs.gov/publications/p54/ch04.html#d0e2133

"your tax home is in a foreign country and you meet the bona fide residence test or the physical presence test, you can choose to exclude from your income a limited amount of your foreign earned income. Foreign earned income was defined earlier in this chapter.

Yyou cannot exclude more than the smaller of:

1.$80,000, or
2. Your foreign earned income (discussed earlier) for the tax year minus your foreign housing exclusion (discussed later)."

Gambling however, appears to be considered unearned income, as shown on the chart in pub 54

Re: Other Countries to Live/Play
 

Gambling can be considered income if you file as a professional. You can then also deduct expenses, but I suppose it increases your chances of an audit, too.

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I wouldn't worry too much. I think we're alone in waging a "War on ONline Poker."

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First 80k you make in another country is tax free in the USA

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Yeah, and when you're indicted for income tax evasion, you can tell the judge that some random anonymous guy on an internet poker forum said it was okay. LOL

Re: Other Countries to Live/Play
 

[ QUOTE ]
Gunslinger, online poker is rigged. HEHEHEHE just kiddin you.

First 80k you make in another country is tax free in the USA, however you must pay tax's on that money in the country you are in.

So the UK would be a good example of a place to go, because they dont tax gambling winnings.

Thats my understanding of it anyways.

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Re: Other Countries to Live/Play
 

Costa Rica or Panama but I think the cost of living might be lower in Panama. You won't have any trouble speaking English only in Canal Zone of Panama or Guanacaste in Costa Rica, but I'm giving the nod to Panama because that little country has a great energy and I think it has nowhere to go but up. Canada is OK but a bit too pricey for a Louisiana lady.

I'm going to edit my post because I sense your fear of not understanding a foreign language. The Canal Zone in Panama did not become independent of the U.S. until quite recently, so educated people and people who deal with tourists and ex-pats frequently speak excellent English. Guanacaste, in Costa Rica, is a wildly popular tourist area with an enormous population of Canadian and American ex-pats, so again, getting along in English is no problem.

As a bonus, Panama uses the American dollar as its currency, which saves endless hassle. I don't know how old you are or how big your "roll" is, but both countries have decent programs to welcome retirees or other well-to-do settlers as long as they are not trying to take jobs from locals. Check it out.

Belize is an English-speaking Central American country but I have not visited there, and I know very little about it.

The person who suggested the U.K. forgot about the "cost of living" part. You'd better be a WSOP winner if you want to live in the U.K. Holy crap, after I visited the countryside there, I realized why they all sold their houses and moved to Tampa. What a "cottage" sells for in the Cotswalds provides a lifetime income in Florida!

Re: Other Countries to Live/Play
 

Thanks for the reply. I'm gonna take a vacation next spring and check out Costa Rica and now Panama at your suggestion. I am pretty spoiled with the American lifestyle. I really enjoy my satellite tv and high speed internet along with all the shopping and resturants near me. I am also an avid bowler ( used to be a professional) and I would like to be able to keep up with that hobby. I have been to Aruba a few times and I liked how friendly the people were, and the ladies were lovely. I have a nice housing situation where I live, with a small secluded house on 1 acre for 100k. Any further information would be appreciated.

Re: Other Countries to Live/Play
 

Hi,
You are considering the best choice there is, that is leaving the USA. I moved from San Diego to Spain almost two years ago. I really don't want to move back because life is way over-rated in the USA. Let me tell you for a fact that you have more freedom in Spain than in the USA. As far as English goes, there are parts of Spain (South) where many towns seem more British than Spanish. Cost of living can be cheaper than the US.

You mention taxes. As an American you MUST pay taxes on income earned anywhere in the world. When you open a bank account in Europe they make you file a W9 form (thank you US) so that Uncle Sam has a way of keeping track of you. You really start to see how much the US has become Big Brother when you are looking at it from the outside.

As far as citizenship is concerned here is your best bet. Go to Spanish speaking new world country, Other posters have mentioned Panama. I was there this year. Very, very nice place. If I did not have a family I would move there tomorrow. So Panama, Nicaragua, Uruguay, Dominican Republic, all have methods where you can gain Permanant Residency quickly. These require some amount of money. For example in Panama if you buy a house for $200K or deposit $200K into a 2 year time deposit then you get an immediate permamant resident status. In the Dominican Republic you can do it for less. Sam egoes for some South American countries. Now here is why you do this. After five years you may apply for citizenship. Why is this good. Because after you are a citizen you can renounce US citizenship. After that say goodbye to US taxes forever. Now here is the best deal of all. As a citizen of a Spanish 'New World' country Spain has very liberal laws in terms of becoming a Spanish citizen. Why would you want that? Because as a Spanish citizen you are part of the EU. In Panama, for example, you do not have to pay taxes on income earned outside of Panam.

Ok so the process I describe takes roughly seven years to complete. This is a long term plan and if I were a successful poker player in my early 20's I would do my best to do the above.

One more thing on the ex-pat tax advantages in the USA. You get an $80K exclusion on income and at the present time you get a rent credit as well. The rent credit is a pro-rated deal as well. What no one has mentioned is that if you are self employed you are still responsible to pay 15% self employment tax on your income. Also, you need to make sure you become a resident of a non income tax state like nevada. Otherwise you must file and pay state tax while living abroad.

If you are considering leaving the US then by all means take the step and do it. It's truly the best thing you can do. we were all raised to believe in the 'land of the free.' Trust me, there is way more freedom outside of the US than inside.

I hope this helps.

Re: Other Countries to Live/Play
 

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First 80k you make in another country is tax free in the USA

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Yeah, and when you're indicted for income tax evasion, you can tell the judge that some random anonymous guy on an internet poker forum said it was okay. LOL

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um look it up on the IRS website. There appear to be some restrictions but basically he's right and you're not, which seems to be pretty common.

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[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
First 80k you make in another country is tax free in the USA

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, and when you're indicted for income tax evasion, you can tell the judge that some random anonymous guy on an internet poker forum said it was okay. LOL

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um look it up on the IRS website. There appear to be some restrictions but basically he's right and you're not, which seems to be pretty common.

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The guy making the tax evasion comment is an idiot and does not have a clue. Not only do you get an 80K exclusion but if you rent you get quite a bit of credit for that as well. I know these things for a fact because I have filed taxes for two years now living abroad. And I have a very good, conservative, accountant doing my taxes who understands 'offshore' issues.

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How hard is it for an American to move to Canada? What about someone that does not want to give up their US citizenship but does want to live in Canada for a few years at least until the worldwide growth in poker is over? Would this be easy to do or not? What if that person does not have hundreds of thousands of $$?

Re: Other Countries to Live/Play
 

Here is an extract from a web link that may help you on Canada.

I don't know about Canada, but here is how many people I know do it in Europe.

You enter as a tourist which allows you to stay for say, 90 days. They stamp your passport. You go rent a place to live. This is your 'vacation home.' Every 75 days you leave the country and get your passport stamped. You get a new stamp when you come back to your vacation home. Depending upon the country they will tolerate this indefinitely. Note that opening a bank account in the foreign country, as an American, may be difficult. If you spend some time researching this on the web you will see what people are doing.

Just remember you are always 'a tourist' with no intention of ever staying. All countries love tourists.

I don't know about Canada. I would vote for Central, or South America. Just learn Spanis and you will love it.

Good luck.

...As a general rule, tourists are admitted for a period of six months. Temporary foreign workers and international students are admitted for varying periods of time, as determined on a case-by-case basis. Extensions may be applied for within Canada.

However, possession of a valid TRV does not necessarily mean that the Immigration Officer at the Canadian Port of Entry will admit the visitor into Canada. At the Port of Entry, all visitors must demonstrate that the purpose of their visit to Canada is of a temporary nature. Canadian Immigration Officers at the Port of Entry will deny admission to all persons who, in their opinion, do not intend to leave Canada at the expiry of their visitor status...

Re: Other Countries to Live/Play
 

Isle of Man looks pretty good.

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How are the hospitals/doctors in Panama?

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Last time I went to Canada (by car) they did not ask for a visa or anything else. I am thinking they dont deport US citizens unless you get involved in some criminal activity there or have a criminal record here in the states. This is my assumption, maybe someone from Canada can confirm.

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How are the hospitals/doctors in Panama?

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The way to look at it is like this. Panama City has a huge amount of wealth. Wherever rich people exist, there also exist good health resources. What it costs is something I don't know about. Plenty of old Americans are retiring there.

I was in Panama City for four days this year opening a business. Trust me when I say it is a nice place. The only downside I saw was that the bay is polluted. If they can figure out how to clean-up the bay then Panama City will absolutely boom even more than it already is booming.

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Have you considered Belize? They speak English, and I assume the cost of living is at least somewhat low like other Latin American countries.

Can't say I really know much about it though.

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I don't know anything about bowling, but for a city with lots of shopping, banking, reliable high speed internet, friendly people, and I don't know what all, then I think your first stop has to be Panama City, Panama. Yet the mountains and nature are not very far away, since the canal requires a large watershed. Boating, fishing, birding -- it has some of the most famous spots for the Christmas Bird Count in the world. But you don't have to worry about large vicious animals like bears or mountain lions.

Oh yeah, satellite TV. They definitely have satellite TV. It is possible for the storms in rainy season to knock the TV reception off the air for a short while, but this is also possible in the U.S. or so I understand -- I don't myself own a satellite TV dish.

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Both Costa Rica and Panama have terrific reputations for top notch medical care at a good price. Costa Ricans have a longer life expectancy than citizens of the U.S. but I'm not sure about Panama. I have not required any medical services while visiting either country, so obviously I am relying on other people's reports.

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I am moving to England next year.

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I 2nd England.

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How about you stay in the US and you move the fish to a foreign country.

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Guys, he specifically said "cost of living." By that I'm fairly sure he didn't mean, "please suggest to me the country with the most ridiculously insane cost of living in the world, such that I will run screaming back to the United States to marvel how cheap everything is here by contrast." Good Lord, even a simple trip to a grocery store in England is a terrifying experience for someone on a budget. I find Japan cheap by contrast with England. Maybe he should move there!

Re: Other Countries to Live/Play
 

Latin America is your best bet.

You can't just get residency in Europe or Canada without some sort of ties. Money or "I want to" just won't do it. I didn't have to file a W-9 when I opened my bank account here, but I'm not sure if they just screwed up. I don't intend on ever giving up my US citizenship, but I do take the 80k exemption + housing credit + foreign tax credit. I expect to pay about 10-12% tax total here in Sweden, almost all of it to the Swedish government. But like I said, Europe is pretty hard to get into. Go with Latin America.

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It is my understanding that the 80k exemption only applies to earned income and gambling income isn't in that category.

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It is my understanding that the 80k exemption only applies to earned income and gambling income isn't in that category.

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If you file as self employed, it is earned income.

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It is my understanding that the 80k exemption only applies to earned income and gambling income isn't in that category.

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If you file as self employed, it is earned income.

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Is the $80K exempt from self-employment tax, or just income tax?