Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

We haven't seen enough to make strong judgments, but with what we have seen, who would you say are the 3 best NL cash game players that have been on HSP?


I'll go with:

1. Doyle Brunson
2. Barry Greenstein
3. Brad Booth - We haven't seen him play a lot of hands since he's been on a limited time, but he seems to mix it up well, and word is he is beating up the high stakes NLHE games in Vegas.

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

brunson
grenstein
forrest

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

Laak, T Brunson, T Forrest

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

Forrest is number 1 by far.
Really surprised me.

Second and third is close between Harman in season 2 (just because she improved that much from season 1) and Esfandiari.

OP:Doyle played like a total nit, i am surprised you picked him.

The dissapoitments for me are Daniel "i will call huge bets even though i am beat" Negreanu, Eli "the donator" Elezra and actually Doyle "i am overrolled for the game but i am still gonna play nitty as it could get" Brunson

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

Without giving it much thought:

1) Doyle

2) Antonio

3) Todd

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

[ QUOTE ]
Forrest is number 1 by far.
Really surprised me.

Second and third is close between Harman in season 2 (just because she improved that much from season 1) and Esfandiari.

[/ QUOTE ]

I was going to come back and give an honorable mention to Antonio and Harman was pretty good too. To me it seemed in Laak's first appearance he threw the other pro's off. Made some good bets and wasn't intimidated.

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

Forest
Laak
Antonio

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

Antonio E.
Barry G.
Ted Forrest

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

[ QUOTE ]
To me it seemed in Laak's first appearance he threw the other pro's off. Made some good bets and wasn't intimidated.

[/ QUOTE ]

Laak played okay, but ran much better, and he was definitely at least somewhat intimidated. In fact, I think it was his timid play that threw players off.

He flopped a set and just called on a draw-heavy board, then Daniel (naturally) paid off his river bet becuase he couldn't figure out why he wouldn't raise the turn with any made hand that could bet that much on the river.

He flopped a king-high flush, and let Matusow donk into him on all three streets, which was probably the best way to play it (certainly turned out to be), but again was much more lucky than good.

There was another hand where he was scared to call a river bet with a big hand (can't remember exactly, like a set of tens with a possible straight on the board or something), then when he did call and the bettor mucked his bluff, he was embarrassed to show the winner, because he took so long to make the easy call.

He raised pre-flop with 9h8h, got several callers, flopped an OESD and played it as passively as possible (c/c the flop, and c/f the blank turn). Not terrible, but hardly dynamic.

Ted Forrest was clearly targeting him. He re-raised him out of the blind with 42 once. He called Laak's big reraise of DN's open with pocket 7s (Laak had AK and flopped trips, of course).

I'm not criticizing his play, but I think it was pretty basic and non-creative, maybe a little scared, and the cards were falling his way. Even though he was only on about half the episodes, I can't recall anybody flopping more sets than he did.

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

Antonio

Phil

Barry (although that ridiculous pre-flop overbet w/ AKo vs Juanda was pretty donkish).

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

How can we forget?

Daniel Alaei...

Then I have Ted Forrest and Doyle Brunson. I'm really not sure how Doyle played nitty. He gambled it up with some non suited connectors on a lot of hands.

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

Daniel Alaei played GREAT poker, let's not forget him indeed.

I think Lindgren played pretty well for his first appearance. He made really good bets, took his time on his hands thinking things through and coming up with the correct decisions. His 95 sooted (or was it 96 hand) was very sick, but the genius of him was askling Gus to run it twice! Sure the deck was hitting him hard at times but the manner in which he played his hands, the thought put into his bets really stood out.

Laak ran well. Did he play well? Remember when he just got into the game just before his heater, he was being very tight/weak and folding all hands that didn't connect. So I don't know if this guy can really play if the cards don't come to him. Even though he's a big winner, I'll put him with Mimi Tran from last season where she also went on a sick rush playing typical TAG with every card hitting.

Antonio E. came to both seasons with some real serious game. Now HE is a player. If his BR management skills are as good as his poker skills, then I can see this guy making it to the very top of the game within 10 years. Talk about being gutsy. You knew from watching him that the money mattered a lot but he still found the courage to make the plays that he needed to. Much respect.

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

Forrest
Antonio
Doyle

Creds also too Barry G that kept his composure after losing yet another monster pot with aces. He did this by playing a very tight short stack game that worked perfect at that current table condition
----------------------------------------------------
Worst player list
would be
1. Eli for beeing totaly crappy
2. Negreanu for his total lack of tilt control, he should really have taken a break or just quit since he obviously played like a donkey at times after the beats he took
3. MM get paid some dollars to stay when his guts told him to quit and then he lost it all Good decision mike

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

Over the first 2 seasons, here are the players I've been impressed with:

Ted Forrest
Freddy Deeb
Daniel Alaei
Jennifer Harman (Season 2 only)
Antonio Esfandiari
Barry Greenstein
Todd Brunson

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

Phil Laak plays NLH cash games almost exclusively if I'm not mistaken. I think his style of play was more passive because he has less endorsements and is playing with his money. DN, Doyle, Lindgren all make money from endorsements so that if they didn't want to play any poker they wouldn't have to. Laak, to my understanding, doesn't have any endorsement deals and plays in general like a nit in the big cash games at the Commerce (see the most recent Phil Laak + Jen Tilly episode of the Circuit).

Perhaps we are impressed with some of these guys ability to get in there and throw money around, but they don't need the money anyway?

I think in the end part of the problem is that some of the players approached it like a cash game, while others approached it as a TV show. I dunno though, we really only saw a few hours worth of play. It's not completely fair to pass judgement on any of them for this small sample size.

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

Laak
Forrest
Freddy Deeb (haven't seen Deeb mentioned yet. I can't remember him ever making a bad decision during season 1)

Honorable mentions to Booth, Greenstein, Antonio

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

Eli is definitely the worst player.
I think the Brad Booth doesn't really have enough hands in to qualify for the best player title.

Most disapointing, Doyle he wasnt even involved in a hand last night

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

I would have to say Harman for season 2. She was absolutely fearless, pouncing on weakness and exploiting it.
she played perfectly this season imo.

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

Forrest
Deeb
Greenstein

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

[ QUOTE ]
Forrest is number 1 by far.
Really surprised me.

Second and third is close between Harman in season 2 (just because she improved that much from season 1) and Esfandiari.

OP:Doyle played like a total nit, i am surprised you picked him.

The dissapoitments for me are Daniel "i will call huge bets even though i am beat" Negreanu, Eli "the donator" Elezra and actually Doyle "i am overrolled for the game but i am still gonna play nitty as it could get" Brunson

[/ QUOTE ]

There's nothing wrong with Doyle's tight style, especially with [donk payoff wizards] DN and Eli at your table. Obviously it is working for him.

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

[ QUOTE ]
Most disapointing, Doyle he wasnt even involved in a hand last night

[/ QUOTE ]

It's kind of difficult to be involved in a hand when you're not playing in the game.

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

I thought Doyle was great in S2, but average in S1.

Forrest was the best in S1 in my eyes.

Aaaaand I thought Esfandiari was the most consistent player over the 2 seasons.

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

Yukon Brad has been playing in Langley BC Canada recently.
Hes been quoted while buying into the 10/20nl game saying, "I've got 20k on me, which one of you wants to get rich?"
then straddling 1k blind utg and [censored].
I guess he has alot of money.

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

Most disappointing player -- Negreanu. He's burned through literally hundreds of thousands of dollars and keeps making crap calls. And he can't seem to handle being on tilt as well as he used to... Though the hand with Gus (5s and 6s) was just brutal (and brilliant television).

Unlucky? Barry Greenstein. The man's been busted with the best hand going in over and over and over again -- it's like watching a train wreck, you know he may have pocket AA but they're going to get broken. Great player, horrendous draws.

Big winner? Hansen. Might also be the smartest to sit down. Came in, put in his chips, played a few hands, made some $300k+ from Daniel alone, and walked off WAY in the black.

Most spectularly bad player? Eli. Holy crap, I thought he was okay on the WPT, but he's just... nonsense in HSP.

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

Laak played better than I thought he would.

The few hands I remember, were where he made 2 or 3 big raises after a raise and a few limps.

Where he raises to $44,400 into an $8,000 pot.

He always picked off bluffs in those hands.

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

Antonio, Doyle, Barry

worst: Eli, daniel, corey z.

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

Doyle
Barry

Third spot goes to one of these gentlemen:

Freddy
Antonio
Phil Laak
Ted (season 1, he didn't really get to do anything this second season)
Daniel Alai

These 7 players played very good. Everyone else sucked.

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

I'm pleased to see that Eli Elezra hasn't been credited as a 'top 3' HSP'er. If anyone mentions him as a top 3 player, please quit poker for life, and submit yourself for a full frontal lobotomy immediately.


Daniel Negreanu has been making some absolutely horrific calls when he knows he his beat. The guy can't seem to lay down a hand for the life of him. Granted he has taken some brutal beats: flopping the nuts on several occasions...but the call on the river against E-Dog was terrible. All in all he is not worthy of being mentioned as a top 3 performer this year....not even close.

Can't vote for Antonio either. he just annoys the [censored] out of me. Too cocky for his own good. Seems like he is playing way over his head in this game. He's just radiating a lack of confidence but has dragged a few nice pots by hitting some monster flops.

Phil Laak is playing cautious aggressive poker and I like it. He knows the kind of gigantic pots that you can lose getting burned by a 2 outter. Definitely made some bank so far and seems to value his chips more than any other player in the game. Thumbs up for Phil Laak.

Ted Forrest is a no brainer. This guy is light years ahead of half the field on HSP this year. Always a beast in cash games and tourneys alike. I'd have to say he is in the top 5 best all around poker players in the world.

Can't really think of # 3 but...

I'd like to see guest appearances from Prahlad Friedman and Allen Cunningham and even Jamie Gold if he has any cash left....and how about Action Jeff...or even Tiffany Williamson...hell might as well bring Lance Funston along for the ride. And Phil Helmuth where are youuuu come backkkk. Phil is always gold. worst cash game player in the world...LOL

HSP poker is the best...keep it comin ! [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

[ QUOTE ]
I'd like to see guest appearances from Prahlad Friedman and Allen Cunningham and even Jamie Gold if he has any cash left....

[/ QUOTE ]

Jamie hasn't gotten his money yet, has he? Maybe they can delay the lawsuit until HSP 3?? :-)

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

yea, Daniel Alai played pretty well (#3)...forrest surprised me as well as i thought he would be too aggressive to be successful at this game (#2)...and greenstein was steady as i thought (#1)...

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

I was most impressed by Esfandiari because I didn't expect him to be that good of a player. He plays a solid style with some big bluffs mixed in. The hand where he made Laak fold a fairly big pair (I think it was JJ?) was impressive.

I was least impressed by Negreanu by far. But this is mainly because I had high expectations from him. I'm also sick of his cocky attitude and acting as if he can play every hand in every situation. He claimed that he could profitably play 80% of his hands preflop at the WSOP. Watching him play I doubt he can profitably play even half that many hands. I think his arrogance will be his undoing but at least he decided to take a break from the big game for his own sake.

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

[ QUOTE ]
Doyle "i am overrolled for the game but i am still gonna play nitty as it could get" Brunson

[/ QUOTE ]

I guess it's ok for you to call his play "nitty" since I'm sure you have a greater understanding and feel for the game than Doyle does.

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

Why are ppl impressed w/ Laak's play? he' the perfect example of running well but playing just ok. Forrest, Doyle, and Lingren and prolly Esfandiari(?) are most impressive. I just can't see how doyle played like a nit. He was pretty TAG...

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

- Doyle. He just seems extremely comfortable with the stakes and game. Has yet to make a serious mistep (on camera).

- Barry G. Same as above, willing to play nitty or LAGgy depending on the table. Out of all the players, alongside Doyle, his game seemed the least effected by outside factors. He just played whatever he thought was "right" at the moment and was almost always dead-on.

- Antonio. He played some consistently strong, daring poker and, whether it was because he was being underestimated or for some other reason, he was able to get his money in good very frequently (only to get drawn out on). He also accepted his hard luck with good grace and tilted very little--a much better showing in this respect then the supposedly personable Daniel N.

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

People are impressed with Laak's play because they had low expectations for him. I was impressed because he played very well IMO. Laak doesn't play in the big game, was alienated by the guys at the table to some degree. I have watched him play a few sessions on Live at the Bike as well, heard him discuss NLH cash games and am very very impressed by what he has to say. I think his play was very uncreative, but he is supposedly sort of a cash game nit from what I've heard and what he's said. He was playing over his head monetarily (taking a shot) and seemed somewhat intimidated by Negreanu/the big game guys, but he played very well. Running well helps, but it isn't like he misplayed anything too badly.

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

What about doubling up Negreanu's flopped set with his pocket Kings? He said he could have gotten away from it in his younger days...

[ QUOTE ]

- Doyle. He just seems extremely comfortable with the stakes and game. Has yet to make a serious mistep (on camera).

- Barry G. Same as above, willing to play nitty or LAGgy depending on the table. Out of all the players, alongside Doyle, his game seemed the least effected by outside factors. He just played whatever he thought was "right" at the moment and was almost always dead-on.

- Antonio. He played some consistently strong, daring poker and, whether it was because he was being underestimated or for some other reason, he was able to get his money in good very frequently (only to get drawn out on). He also accepted his hard luck with good grace and tilted very little--a much better showing in this respect then the supposedly personable Daniel N.

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

Lindgren (surpised me), Laak (same) and Esfandiari (sans coolers and his wuss-out with QQ to Harman)

honorable mentions: Harman & Gus H

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

[ QUOTE ]
Antonio

Phil

Barry (although that ridiculous pre-flop overbet w/ AKo vs Juanda was pretty donkish).

[/ QUOTE ]

If he made a standard reraise, he would have been commiting a little over 1/3rd of Juanda's remaining chips, I believe. It is a common theory in NL poker that if you are going to put in more than 1/3rd of you affective stack, you may as well go allin, especially if it increases your fold equity.

Odd that you mention this, but not Juanda's even MORE egregious allin overbet with AK vs Lindgren, betting 100k into a 10k pot.

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

Greenstein and Forrest are top two without a doubt. I haven't seen enough of season two though to say who else belongs with them.

Re: Name the 3 best players on HSP thus far
 

D Brunson, D Brunson, D Brunson
, but I haven't seen the last few shows.