So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

....and illegal-

Why can't I just write a check to fund my Party Poker account?

What am I missing??

Sarge[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

[ QUOTE ]
....and illegal-

Why can't I just write a check to fund my Party Poker account?

What am I missing??

Sarge[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

Opponents.

Lori

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

Maybe someone with more knowledge of banking can correct me, but I believe it will be almost impossible to stop this.

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

The original wording in HR 4411 not only eliminates credit cards but covers all bank transactions to fund illegal gambling. You'd have a better chance of still going through Neteller/Firepay than writing a check directly to the site. As it stands now, I don't think my bank would honor a check to a poker site since my debit card doesn't work there anyway (although it's a "Visa Debit Card" so it might just deal with Visa's policy).

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

really? I mean in some respects writing a check is easier and quicker than setting up Neteller and Firepay.

and if these bans go throurh, Im also willing to wager that online sites will waive any check issuing fees and what not if it ment saving their customer base.

Hell, I'm guessing there is probably some incentive waiting to happen -

"Party Poker Match Check Deposit up to $500"

I'm thinking that these major sites will do what it takes and then some to keep their kaufers fill.

Sarge[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

Keep dreaming. It's not only banking tranasctions that would be affected. The law would allow the government to require all internet service providers to block access to online poker sites. Even if it didn't, no online poker site would allow Americans to play there if this bill becomes law, because their execs wouldn't want to be indicted and sent to prison in the United States, like the online sportsbook execs who were recently indicted.

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

I think Sarge is talking about the de facto ability to fund sites with checks, not what the law may or may not say.

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

[ QUOTE ]
no online poker site would allow Americans to play there if this bill becomes law, because their execs wouldn't want to be indicted and sent to prison in the United States

[/ QUOTE ]

PartyGaming has explicity acknowleged the risk of their officers' arrest by US authorities. Frankly, I think flouting the US law is worth the risk for them and possibly some of the other large sites.

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

Why do you think most, if not all, of the online sportsbooks have stopped allowing betting by Americans? Because their execs don't want to be indicted in the United States, extradited to the United States, and imprisoned in the United States. The poker sites will do the exact same thing if this bill becomes law.

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

[ QUOTE ]
Why do you think most, if not all, of the online sportsbooks have stopped allowing betting by Americans?

[/ QUOTE ]

This hasn't happened, bro. Check out the sports betting forum, they're still allowing us to bet there. In fact, not one sportsbook has stopped Americans because of this legislation (some had not permitted it prior to the legislation even being an issue).

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

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[ QUOTE ]
Why do you think most, if not all, of the online sportsbooks have stopped allowing betting by Americans?

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This hasn't happened, bro. Check out the sports betting forum, they're still allowing us to bet there. In fact, not one sportsbook has stopped Americans because of this legislation (some had not permitted it prior to the legislation even being an issue).

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not a sports bettor, but I recall seeing a number of posts here about several online sportsbooks no longer allowing Americans to bet there after the Betonsports execs were indicted. I know that Betonsports stopped it after that.

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

[ QUOTE ]
Why do you think most, if not all, of the online sportsbooks have stopped allowing betting by Americans? Because their execs don't want to be indicted in the United States, extradited to the United States, and imprisoned in the United States. The poker sites will do the exact same thing if this bill becomes law.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's pretty hard to dispute this since some online poker sites are already turning away US citizens. So, while there may be workarounds to fund a poker account, there may be no poker accounts to fund. [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

However, if the doors do remain open for the US, the first time I funded a poker account it was with something called 900Pay, or something like that, and the deposit was charged to my next month's telephone bill. Does anyone know if this would fall under the restrictions of the bill?

Janis

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

The 900-number thing sounds promising, assuming that ISP's don't block the sites - which I don't think is nearly as likely as some are making it out. From what I've read it seems like it's the financial transactions that are the focus here.

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Why do you think most, if not all, of the online sportsbooks have stopped allowing betting by Americans?

[/ QUOTE ]

This hasn't happened, bro. Check out the sports betting forum, they're still allowing us to bet there. In fact, not one sportsbook has stopped Americans because of this legislation (some had not permitted it prior to the legislation even being an issue).

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not a sports bettor, but I recall seeing a number of posts here about several online sportsbooks no longer allowing Americans to bet there after the Betonsports execs were indicted. I know that Betonsports stopped it after that.

[/ QUOTE ]

Those were all the rip off artists. All quality books (mansion, bodog, cris, pinny, sia, wwts, etc.) still allow it. Plus, Betonsports was a different situation. Their CEO was indicted because he was an idiot. They have toll free answering in the US, and drove vans in the US where they promoted their book and let people make bets from the vans here.

This is not an attempt to make people less wary about the legislation - it's really worth worrying about - but the sportsbooks still allow us.

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

[ QUOTE ]
Why do you think most, if not all, of the online sportsbooks have stopped allowing betting by Americans? Because their execs don't want to be indicted in the United States, extradited to the United States, and imprisoned in the United States. The poker sites will do the exact same thing if this bill becomes law.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you have a pessimistic viewpoint that's fine, but this is just not accurate.

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Why do you think most, if not all, of the online sportsbooks have stopped allowing betting by Americans? Because their execs don't want to be indicted in the United States, extradited to the United States, and imprisoned in the United States. The poker sites will do the exact same thing if this bill becomes law.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you have a pessimistic viewpoint that's fine, but this is just not accurate.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not a pessimist; I'm a realist. Now go stick your head back in the sand.

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

wow have some really taken this too far. Blocking access to poker sites/sportsbooks/where does that enter the equation. That is very easy to get around. If blocking the sites were the answer then stopping transactions from banks etc wouldn't be needed. I really believe that this bill will make funding these accounts more difficult and block certain ways to fund them. blocking isp's i have not read anywhere. The us customer base is huge for these sites and they need the players from this huge country. How would you fund poker sites?? A good amount of them allow moneygram not western union but essentially the same. Party poker allows some kind of pre paid calling card you can purchase up to 250 dollars then enter the code at party's cashier and the value is in your account/i for a fact know someone who has done this. If anybody is a pro and makes good money at this game/i would leave here and go to a tax free gambling country in a minute like the UK. The USA is not the only place one can live in this world.

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

HR 4411 would make ISP's block gaming sites. No one knows if this is on the table for the DoD Authorization bill.

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

can you show me where it says this/blocking isp's??

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Why do you think most, if not all, of the online sportsbooks have stopped allowing betting by Americans? Because their execs don't want to be indicted in the United States, extradited to the United States, and imprisoned in the United States. The poker sites will do the exact same thing if this bill becomes law.

[/ QUOTE ]



If you have a pessimistic viewpoint that's fine, but this is just not accurate.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not a pessimist; I'm a realist. Now go stick your head back in the sand.

[/ QUOTE ]

Fair enough...you still are not accurate. Most major books still take action from the US (did you miss out on the free money from Mansion last week?). From recent interviews with Ware and Ayre, two of the biggest names in the industry, this isn't changing soon.

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Why do you think most, if not all, of the online sportsbooks have stopped allowing betting by Americans? Because their execs don't want to be indicted in the United States, extradited to the United States, and imprisoned in the United States. The poker sites will do the exact same thing if this bill becomes law.

[/ QUOTE ]



If you have a pessimistic viewpoint that's fine, but this is just not accurate.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not a pessimist; I'm a realist. Now go stick your head back in the sand.

[/ QUOTE ]

Fair enough...you still are not accurate. Most major books still take action from the US (did you miss out on the free money from Mansion last week?). From recent interviews with Ware and Ayre, two of the biggest names in the industry, this isn't changing soon.

[/ QUOTE ]

You really need to keep up. Two other people pointed out to me before you did that some online sportsbooks are still taking American bets.

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Why do you think most, if not all, of the online sportsbooks have stopped allowing betting by Americans? Because their execs don't want to be indicted in the United States, extradited to the United States, and imprisoned in the United States. The poker sites will do the exact same thing if this bill becomes law.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you have a pessimistic viewpoint that's fine, but this is just not accurate.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not a pessimist; I'm a realist. Now go stick your head back in the sand.

[/ QUOTE ]

In fairness, the US could send the execs to secret prisons in other countries

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

[ QUOTE ]
can you show me where it says this/blocking isp's??

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

[ QUOTE ]
If blocking the sites were the answer then stopping transactions from banks etc wouldn't be needed.

[/ QUOTE ]

Indeed.

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Why do you think most, if not all, of the online sportsbooks have stopped allowing betting by Americans? Because their execs don't want to be indicted in the United States, extradited to the United States, and imprisoned in the United States. The poker sites will do the exact same thing if this bill becomes law.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you have a pessimistic viewpoint that's fine, but this is just not accurate.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not a pessimist; I'm a realist. Now go stick your head back in the sand.

[/ QUOTE ]

You're not a realist, you're an idiot. Every post you make reeks of glee over the idea that soon, all these guys who can actually play poker will soon be out of the money.

Do you even play poker?

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

[ QUOTE ]
You're not a realist, you're an idiot. Every post you make reeks of glee over the idea that soon, all these guys who can actually play poker will soon be out of the money.

Do you even play poker?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, I play a lot of poker, both online and in Tunica. I also go to Vegas to play several times a year. You are obviously a moron who can't read if you think I'm happy about any of this.

Like I said, I'm a realist, and the reality is that this bill has a very good chance of passing and that online poker will cease to exist in the United States if it does.

Now your stupid ass can call me names or attack me or whatever, but that isn't going to change the reality of this very bad situation, no matter how much you want it to.

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

[ QUOTE ]
can you show me where it says this/blocking isp's??

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I think I'm wrong here; I guess I was confusing it with the Goodlatte bill.

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
can you show me where it says this/blocking isp's??

[/ QUOTE ]

I think I'm wrong here; I guess I was confusing it with the Goodlatte bill.

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Yeah, I would like this clarified if this is a possibility here. (besides lawman, please.)

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Why do you think most, if not all, of the online sportsbooks have stopped allowing betting by Americans? Because their execs don't want to be indicted in the United States, extradited to the United States, and imprisoned in the United States. The poker sites will do the exact same thing if this bill becomes law.

[/ QUOTE ]



If you have a pessimistic viewpoint that's fine, but this is just not accurate.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not a pessimist; I'm a realist. Now go stick your head back in the sand.

[/ QUOTE ]

Fair enough...you still are not accurate. Most major books still take action from the US (did you miss out on the free money from Mansion last week?). From recent interviews with Ware and Ayre, two of the biggest names in the industry, this isn't changing soon.

[/ QUOTE ]

You really need to keep up. Two other people pointed out to me before you did that some online sportsbooks are still taking American bets.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think sportsbooks are still taking American bets. I just opened 2 new accounts.

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

[ QUOTE ]
Yeah, I would like this clarified if this is a possibility here. (besides lawman, please.)

[/ QUOTE ]

Fine. Keep wallowing in your own ignorance. LOL

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

I'm just gonna go ahead and drown in it

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

All I have to say is that NO ISP WILL EVER BLOCK out a site if people want it bad enough. EVER. EVER. EVER.... EVER.

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

I still don't understand how they can't easily create innocuous holding companies every couple of months like "Mike's Taqueria" to process the checks and deposits for a poker site. I mean other quasi legal industries have been doing it for a long time.

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

That's so pathetic. I just hope the federal gov shows the incompetence of enforcement here that they do in all other matters. It's easier to push me around than a Jamaican Yardy so that's what these weaklings are doing.

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

[ QUOTE ]
Like I said, I'm a realist, and the reality is that this bill has a very good chance of passing and that online poker will cease to exist in the United States if it does.


[/ QUOTE ]

This is certainly not a realistic point of view. If it passes, americans will coninue to play poker. It will reduce the number of players but it won't stop it.

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

[ QUOTE ]
I still don't understand how they can't easily create innocuous holding companies every couple of months like "Mike's Taqueria" to process the checks and deposits for a poker site. I mean other quasi legal industries have been doing it for a long time.

[/ QUOTE ]

That is a big reason I have been arguing it is near impossible to enforce.

They do now... they create, for example, "MGP Limited", electronics store out of Singapore which will get by most credit cards now.

Re: So if Credit Cards and Neteller are out...
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Why do you think most, if not all, of the online sportsbooks have stopped allowing betting by Americans? Because their execs don't want to be indicted in the United States, extradited to the United States, and imprisoned in the United States. The poker sites will do the exact same thing if this bill becomes law.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you have a pessimistic viewpoint that's fine, but this is just not accurate.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not a pessimist; I'm a realist. Now go stick your head back in the sand.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you were a realist, you would realize that most sportsbooks still acccept U.S. based clients

We\'ve talked depositing, how about cashouts?
 

Whether the news reports are focusing on deposits because 90% of poker players are net losers, or for some other reason, I have heard nothing about blocking CASHOUTS. Does this mean we're OK?

Plus, if cashouts are blocked, I still don't see how a paper check from a foreign bank, with nothing to link it to a gambling site, wouldn't work.

Re: We\'ve talked depositing, how about cashouts?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Whether the news reports are focusing on deposits because 90% of poker players are net losers, or for some other reason, I have heard nothing about blocking CASHOUTS. Does this mean we're OK?

Plus, if cashouts are blocked, I still don't see how a paper check from a foreign bank, with nothing to link it to a gambling site, wouldn't work.

[/ QUOTE ]

The hardcore poker player will still play online, they will still find some ways to fund their account (if they need to), and they will still cashout. The problem is Joe Fish wont want to jump through the extra two hoops to play, which drys up the games

Re: We\'ve talked depositing, how about cashouts?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Whether the news reports are focusing on deposits because 90% of poker players are net losers, or for some other reason, I have heard nothing about blocking CASHOUTS. Does this mean we're OK?

Plus, if cashouts are blocked, I still don't see how a paper check from a foreign bank, with nothing to link it to a gambling site, wouldn't work.

[/ QUOTE ]

The hardcore poker player will still play online, they will still find some ways to fund their account (if they need to), and they will still cashout. The problem is Joe Fish wont want to jump through the extra two hoops to play, which drys up the games

[/ QUOTE ]

Some fish would quit, some. I think/hope most would say "I love poker because I'm good at it and will find a way around the blocks(not really)" or "I enjoy poker and will find a way around the blocks."