\"What do you mean I can\'t raise? This is no limit holdem!\"
 

Playing 1/2 nl at my usual room last night while this hand comes up.
UTG+1 raises to 10, MP1 raises to 30. MP3 goes all in for 42, HJ calls 42, CO wants to go all in. UTG+1 says he can only call or fold and calls over the floor and the floor makes the ruling, whats the correct call here folks?

Re: \"What do you mean I can\'t raise? This is no limit holdem!\"
 

Of course he can raise....

Re: \"What do you mean I can\'t raise? This is no limit holdem!\"
 

Already discussed. Oh, just this week...

b

Re: \"What do you mean I can\'t raise? This is no limit holdem!\"
 

diff casinos have diff rules but generally in NL if a person moves all in and has an amount equal to or over the last bet/raise, the next to act can re-raise.

if you go by this model, the $42 all in is only $12 over the $30 bet ($20 raise of $10) which is not equal to or over the last raise therefore the $42 allin can only be called.

some casinos adopt the 1/2 bet minimum criteria for raising in NL games but that is usually reserved for limit holdem.

Re: \"What do you mean I can\'t raise? This is no limit holdem!\"
 

The CO hadn't yet acted, so the 1/2 bet or full bet criteria to reopen betting is irrelevent.

Edit to actually answer the OP's question: The CO can fold, call, or raise.

Re: \"What do you mean I can\'t raise? This is no limit holdem!\"
 

you're right...

<--didn't read the post carefully

Re: \"What do you mean I can\'t raise? This is no limit holdem!\"
 

It depends if it's a full moon or not.

Re: \"What do you mean I can\'t raise? This is no limit holdem!\"
 

Floor ruled that he can't raise all in and I was upset with that ruling for obvious reasons.

Re: \"What do you mean I can\'t raise? This is no limit holdem!\"
 

[ QUOTE ]
Floor ruled that he can't raise all in and I was upset with that ruling for obvious reasons.

[/ QUOTE ]

Where is this so i can never play there?

Re: \"What do you mean I can\'t raise? This is no limit holdem!\"
 

[ QUOTE ]
Floor ruled that he can't raise all in and I was upset with that ruling for obvious reasons.

[/ QUOTE ]

Absolutely insane and completely indefensible. OF COURSE you can raise. Kick the floor in the nuts.

ok...if they have a 3 raises / 4 bets cap rule, it's slightly defensible. But since the last $12 bump wasn't a full raise, I don't think it counts.

Re: \"What do you mean I can\'t raise? This is no limit holdem!\"
 

[ QUOTE ]
ok...if they have a 3 raises / 4 bets cap rule, it's slightly defensible. But since the last $12 bump wasn't a full raise, I don't think it counts.

[/ QUOTE ]
In AC (where they use a cap) its also a half bet to reopen betting (I believe) so this would be capped.

Re: \"What do you mean I can\'t raise? This is no limit holdem!\"
 

AC has a cap in no limit? That's ridiculous.

Re: \"What do you mean I can\'t raise? This is no limit holdem!\"
 

There is no cap in the no limit games in AC, or at least the casinos Ive been to, which is most of them.

Re: \"What do you mean I can\'t raise? This is no limit holdem!\"
 

[ QUOTE ]
AC has a cap in no limit? That's ridiculous.

[/ QUOTE ]

Interesting. I thought everybody had a cap on no-limit raises when not heads-up. I've used that to my advantage a couple times when people were being silly with min-raises with a sequence like:

UTG: "Raise to $10."
UTG+1: "Make it $15"
Me: "Is there a 3-raise cap?"
Dealer: "yes"
Me: "Make it $20".
UTG: "I'M ALL IN!!!"
Dealer: "I'm sorry sir, the betting is capped"
UTG: "WTF!!!!"

I couldn't have called with my middle pair since it was clear one of these min-raisers was gonna pounce when it came back around, but with the raise capping it I could come in safely.

The cap is necessary to keep two guys from whipsawing a third for all his money.

Re: \"What do you mean I can\'t raise? This is no limit holdem!\"
 

lol @ capping in NL

CAP IT AT TEN

Re: \"What do you mean I can\'t raise? This is no limit holdem!\"
 

[ QUOTE ]
There is no cap in the no limit games in AC, or at least the casinos Ive been to, which is most of them.

[/ QUOTE ]

Borg had it for sure, they might have changed it (I don't play NL often). More likely however they just don't enforce it consistently :-(

Re: \"What do you mean I can\'t raise? This is no limit holdem!\"
 

[ QUOTE ]
The cap is necessary to keep two guys from whipsawing a third for all his money.

[/ QUOTE ]

you don't need a rule to make obvious collusion illegal. invoke IWTSTH (or better yet, call floor first, explain the situation, and invoke IWTSTH then).

it might not even be collusion. if some guy gets whipsawed for all his money, he should fold, or move allin.

Re: \"What do you mean I can\'t raise? This is no limit holdem!\"
 

[ QUOTE ]


you don't need a rule to make obvious collusion illegal. invoke IWTSTH (or better yet, call floor first, explain the situation, and invoke IWTSTH then).



[/ QUOTE ]

River (or turn), TeamMemberA bets, TeamMemberB folds.
No IWTSTH possible. Only stupid colluders get caught with IWTSTH.

Re: \"What do you mean I can\'t raise? This is no limit holdem!\"
 

ok, call floor anyway.

Re: \"What do you mean I can\'t raise? This is no limit holdem!\"
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The cap is necessary to keep two guys from whipsawing a third for all his money.

[/ QUOTE ]

you don't need a rule to make obvious collusion illegal. invoke IWTSTH (or better yet, call floor first, explain the situation, and invoke IWTSTH then).

it might not even be collusion. if some guy gets whipsawed for all his money, he should fold, or move allin.

[/ QUOTE ]

I hate to depend on IWTSTH since the hand can easily fold before the river. I'm guessing but capping was left out of NL because multi-way pots were rare and the players were usually experienced and knew what was going on. A capping rule (as long as its a well done cap e.g., i.e., the Ciaffone style) might be reasonable in modern NL, along with a raising requirement that makes the minimum raise twice the amount bet (i.e. minimum raising goes bet 2- make it 4- make it 8 - make it 16 rather than bet 2- make it 4- make it 6 - make it 8). This raising style is used at Hawaiian Gardens in the LA area.

~ Rick

Re: \"What do you mean I can\'t raise? This is no limit holdem!\"
 

The person that made it 10 to go should be able raise but the guy that make it 30 can only call or fold(which is very unlikely).

Re: \"What do you mean I can\'t raise? This is no limit holdem!\"
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
AC has a cap in no limit? That's ridiculous.

[/ QUOTE ]

Interesting. I thought everybody had a cap on no-limit raises when not heads-up. I've used that to my advantage a couple times when people were being silly with min-raises with a sequence like:

UTG: "Raise to $10."
UTG+1: "Make it $15"
Me: "Is there a 3-raise cap?"
Dealer: "yes"
Me: "Make it $20".
UTG: "I'M ALL IN!!!"
Dealer: "I'm sorry sir, the betting is capped"
UTG: "WTF!!!!"

I couldn't have called with my middle pair since it was clear one of these min-raisers was gonna pounce when it came back around, but with the raise capping it I could come in safely.

The cap is necessary to keep two guys from whipsawing a third for all his money.

[/ QUOTE ]

No it isn't because beginning with the fourth (or fifth) raise all raises must be at least half the pot. Ot at least that should be the rule. That is not in Robert's Rules, it is however on the older Hilton Rules.