Feeding my inner calling station....
 

Paradise Poker 5/10 Hold'em (10 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

Unfortunately, I don't have reads on either of my opponents.


Preflop: chesspain is UTG+1 with 7http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif, 7http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...miles/club.gif.
1 fold</font>, chesspain calls, UTG+2 raises</font>, 5 folds</font>, SB calls, 1 fold</font>, chesspain calls.

Flop: (7 SB) 5http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...miles/club.gif, 5http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif, Thttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/spade.gif (3 players)</font>
SB checks, chesspain bets</font>, UTG+2 raises</font>, SB calls, chesspain calls.

Turn: (6.50 BB) 4http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/spade.gif (3 players)</font>
SB checks, chesspain checks, UTG+2 bets</font>, SB folds, chesspain calls.

River: (8.50 BB) Jhttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/heart.gif (2 players)</font>
chesspain checks, UTG+2 bets</font>, chesspain calls.

Final Pot: 10.50 BB

Re: Feeding my inner calling station....
 

With no read, I don't mind it. Once SB folds the turn, I'd call down.

I'd expect it to be slightly -EV, but it will help develop a read even if it is.

Re: Feeding my inner calling station....
 

preflop is OK

i dont like the flop bet, youre semi-bluffing two players...id rather do it with one. youre just building the pot here

i REALLY dont like the flop reraise, not sure what youre thinking about here

river check-call, bleh

Re: Feeding my inner calling station....
 

[ QUOTE ]
i dont like the flop bet, youre semi-bluffing two players...id rather do it with one. youre just building the pot here

[/ QUOTE ]

Who says I'm semi-bluffing?



[ QUOTE ]
i REALLY dont like the flop reraise, not sure what youre thinking about here

[/ QUOTE ]

Ah, what hand are you looking at?

Re: Feeding my inner calling station....
 

This is more a question than a comment. I don't find myself open limping with lowish pocket pairs in EP unless the table is quite loose, or raising at a very tight table. Should I change this approach? Otherwise, it seems I am in hands like this all the time--out of position against an aggressor. Chess, I just wanted your overall feeling preflop..., was the table really loose or weak tight, or is this standard for you?

Thanks in advance.

p.s. sorry, I know pf is boring to talk about, but I don't see people recommending this very often.

Re: Feeding my inner calling station....
 

with the flop bet, were you betting in the hopes that UTG+2 would raise to knock out SB?

with no reads i don't mind it but i'd really like some sort of indication that UTG+2 is aggressive before calling him down like this.

Re: Feeding my inner calling station....
 

Preflop....meh. Been discussed a million times, you know what you're doing.

And yeah, once SB folds and you call the turn bet, you're pretty much committed to showdown unless an ace comes.

One thing, though...I know you don't have a read on UTG+1 &amp; don't know if he's really paying attention, but I think the preflop limp + donk on the paired flop pretty much gives away your hand to an observant opponent. I've been messing around a bit with check/calling the flop and donking the turn in situations like this, with fairly good results. Keeps the pot smaller and saves you a SB if that ace hits on the turn, and makes it a bit more difficult for your opponent to define your hand.

Re: Feeding my inner calling station....
 

you know what i would do pf(raise). i would 3bet the flop. if he caps i'm not calling down. i would bet/fold the turn if just called.

Re: Feeding my inner calling station....
 

chesspain,

Let me say that I enjoy your subject lines.

I think that to make this limp UTG+1 profitable you have to play very well postflop. You will often wind up facing a raise back to you preflop, then out of position dodging overcards. Marginal.

I am having trouble with the turn. With no read what makes you think UTG+2 is making this bet without at least TT? And if this checks through you are dodging again on the river. I am just having trouble seeing it. [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img] Help me.

Re: Feeding my inner calling station....
 

Partly for my own benefit, I plugged some numbers in the spreadsheet. This was an easy hand because it was pretty much played heads up and the board wasnt too goofy.

Chance that 77 UTG+1 preflop in a 10-handed game is beaten: 27%

Chance you are beaten on the flop: 44%

Chance you are beaten on the turn: 52%

Chance you are beaten on the river: 64%

Although statistically your hand looks good enough for at least a c/c, I think you have to fold when he gets aggressive on the flop.

-J

Re: Feeding my inner calling station....
 

Sounds like an interesting spreadsheet...is it downloadable from anywhere?

Re: Feeding my inner calling station....
 

[ QUOTE ]
Although statistically your hand looks good enough for at least a c/c, I think you have to fold when he gets aggressive on the flop.

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I Love (yes, capital L) the flop bet. I think Chess is actually attempting to get raised here in order to eliminate SB and give the sevens a better chance of holding up.

Chess: Then, assuming you were going to fold the turn if SB called, I like the way this hand is played.

The river, and more specifically PF raiser's river bet, sucks. But I'd definitely make the call there given the pot and the SD equity.

Re: Feeding my inner calling station....
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think Chess is actually attempting to get raised here in order to eliminate SB and give the sevens a better chance of holding up.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think that Chess isn't betting the flop to get raised but betting because he is likely to have the best hand and c/ring would only bloat the pot as well as tie the SB in. It is 3 handed...

Haupt_234

Re: Feeding my inner calling station....
 

This hand is real tough since the villain is unknown. I would play the flop the same, but sometimes release it on the turn if the villain fires again (since this usually means more than UI overs). Then again, I think you need a read to make that lay down so I like your line here against an unknown.

Haupt_234

Comments and results...
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think Chess is actually attempting to get raised here in order to eliminate SB and give the sevens a better chance of holding up.

Chess: Then, assuming you were going to fold the turn if SB called, I like the way this hand is played.



[/ QUOTE ]

Firstly, whereas I'm not really hoping to get raised, I don't mind getting raised (by overcards, of course), especially if the raise can knock out SB, who may well be drawing to six live outs not shared by the preflop raiser. Obviously, I didn't like the fact that the SB coldcalled the flop. Consequently, I would have folded the turn had the SB called before the action got to me.

Secondly, others have rightly questionned the preflop limp. Whereas I almost always would limp in a average game, I should have realized from my brief time at the table before this hand that the table was playing a bit tighter and LAGier than average, making the EP limp riskier.

Finally, UTG+2 showed K [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] T [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], and MHING.

Re: Comments and results...
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I think Chess is actually attempting to get raised here in order to eliminate SB and give the sevens a better chance of holding up.

Chess: Then, assuming you were going to fold the turn if SB called, I like the way this hand is played.



[/ QUOTE ]

Firstly, whereas I'm not really hoping to get raised, I don't mind getting raised (by overcards, of course), especially if the raise can knock out SB, who may well be drawing to six live outs not shared by the preflop raiser. Obviously, I didn't like the fact that the SB coldcalled the flop. Consequently, I would have folded the turn had the SB called before the action got to me.

[/ QUOTE ]

Sorry, should have clarified. Obviously, you don't want to be raised on the flop by a hand that beats yours. You do however, want to be raised by a hand that is drawing in order to knock out SB.

Nice thread.

Btw, WTF did SB have here? [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img] I can't think of a single hand...

Re: Feeding my inner calling station....
 

Perhaps the villain has a read on you for 2 high cards when limping from EP? What could be a general hand range?
AA-99, AKs-A10s, KQs. If this is true he is ahead 7/11 by the turn and a tough one on the river. Looks like you either test him by 3 betting the flop (which is probably no good at first with SB cold calling 2), or fold turn??
Any one hate this line?

Re: Comments and results...
 

That's a Loose raise... That's tough once again with no read, but maybe more support for a 3 bet on the flop (unfortunately SB killed that one.).

Re: Comments and results...
 

A4 sooted...

Re: Feeding my inner calling station....
 

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you know what i would do pf(raise). i would 3bet the flop. if he caps i'm not calling down. i would bet/fold the turn if just called.

[/ QUOTE ]
Sb cold call is crying out A5. That was the curve ball in the post flop plan. Other than that I agree.

Re: Feeding my inner calling station....
 

with small PP we want 4-5 behind us to limp in to be profitable don't we? limp against UTG+2 raise is a killer unless table is a loose-a-palooza.