89s and I\'m ascared.
 

Party Poker 10/20 Hold'em (5 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

bb is 18/15/3

Preflop: Hero is SB with 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Button raises</font>, Hero calls, BB calls.

Flop: (6 SB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
Hero checks, BB checks, Button checks.

Turn: (3 BB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">BB raises</font>, Button folds, Hero calls.

River: (7 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">BB bets</font>, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 9 BB

Re: 89s and I\'m ascared.
 

Pre-flop is such utter [censored]. At least 3 bet. I think post-flop looks ok. Post some reads or stats nextime. Poker without informatiion is just a circle-jerk.

Re: 89s and I\'m ascared.
 

bb is 18/15/3 and the pfr is 42/10/1

Re: 89s and I\'m ascared.
 

i want to c/r river

Re: 89s and I\'m ascared.
 

I think PF is raise/fold deccision, i am leaning to fold thou

Re: 89s and I\'m ascared.
 

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i want to c/r river

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I would bet/call the river. This looks like a situation where the villain will only bet the river if the hero is beat, but will call with some lesser hands if the hero donks. The BB will be freeshowdowning with a lesser hand pretty often here IMO, so I would bet and try to pick up a crying call from this range. If we check and the BB bets, were probably losing.

Re: 89s and I\'m ascared.
 

[ QUOTE ]
i want to c/r river

[/ QUOTE ]the problem there is that there is no way we can fold to a 3-bet, and he will fold his bluff or treys

Re: 89s and I\'m ascared.
 

[ QUOTE ]
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i want to c/r river

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I would bet/call the river. This looks like a situation where the villain will only bet the river if the hero is beat, but will call with some lesser hands if the hero donks. The BB will be freeshowdowning with a lesser hand pretty often here IMO, so I would bet and try to pick up a crying call from this range. If we check and the BB bets, were probably losing.

[/ QUOTE ]it just seems like there is so little value in calling a raise, wtf is he raising? but at the same time there is no way I am folding my trips.
edit: i think he will bet the river with sixes, a3, and a missed draw.

Re: 89s and I\'m ascared.
 

Why is everybody reading so much into this turn raise? It was checked through on the flop and we have no reason to think that BB is doing anything besides protecting a weak holding.

Re: 89s and I\'m ascared.
 

[ QUOTE ]
Why is everybody reading so much into this turn raise? It was checked through on the flop and we have no reason to think that BB is doing anything besides protecting a weak holding.

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I'd rather check to induce an extra bet from someone getting scrappy. Once they bet the river I think it's close, but would rather just call. Whoever said bet / call: that's usually the best way to win the least and lose the most.

Re: 89s and I\'m ascared.
 

[ QUOTE ]
Whoever said bet / call: that's usually the best way to win the least and lose the most.

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Not in this specific situation. In this spot, checking and calling is the line that will win the least and lose the most. I think youre underestimating how often a typical player is raising with a weak holding on the turn, and if we check the river he'll gladly check it down all those times he's beat, but if he does have a better hand he'll certainly bet. This is why I think bet/call is the best line in this situation.

Re: 89s and I\'m ascared.
 

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Whoever said bet / call: that's usually the best way to win the least and lose the most.

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Not in this specific situation. In this spot, checking and calling is the line that will win the least and lose the most. I think youre underestimating how often a typical player is raising with a weak holding on the turn, and if we check the river he'll gladly check it down all those times he's beat, but if he does have a better hand he'll certainly bet. This is why I think bet/call is the best line in this situation.

[/ QUOTE ]What is he raising on the river that we beat though? I'm not saying that this line is wrong I just hate the idea of calling a raise, and I think he will bet anything that he would have called a donk with.
edit: well not ANYTHING, but almost anything and he could also bet with a hand that he would fold to a bet with.

Re: 89s and I\'m ascared.
 

[ QUOTE ]
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[ QUOTE ]
Whoever said bet / call: that's usually the best way to win the least and lose the most.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not in this specific situation. In this spot, checking and calling is the line that will win the least and lose the most. I think youre underestimating how often a typical player is raising with a weak holding on the turn, and if we check the river he'll gladly check it down all those times he's beat, but if he does have a better hand he'll certainly bet. This is why I think bet/call is the best line in this situation.

[/ QUOTE ]What is he raising on the river that we beat though? I'm not saying that this line is wrong I just hate the idea of calling a raise, and I think he will bet anything that he would have called a donk with.
edit: well not ANYTHING, but almost anything and he could also bet with a hand that he would fold to a bet with.

[/ QUOTE ]

If your read is correct then bet/calling the river is clearly a mistake, but I dont feel the same way as you do about this opponents betting range. I dont believe the villain will bet anything he will call a donk with. For example, if we check this river, I dont see him betting some lower pair, but if this is the case, then check/calling is clearly better then bet/calling, but I suspect you are overestimating his betting range when you check this river.

Re: 89s and I\'m ascared.
 

Over how many hands are these stats?
I agree that villain`s line looks scary although he seems aggro enough postflop to make the river a b/c.

Re: 89s and I\'m ascared.
 

I`d like to get more input on preflop cause the fact that I would often play it the same may be the reason why I suck so much in the SB.

Re: 89s and I\'m ascared.
 

I would c/r river. Villain's line is an overpair a lot.

Re: 89s and I\'m ascared.
 

I'm surprised nobody has suggested a turn 3-bet yet!

Re: 89s and I\'m ascared.
 

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I would c/r river. Villain's line is an overpair a lot.

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Villain seems tight preflop but wouldn`t he 3-bet TT+?

Re: 89s and I\'m ascared.
 

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I would c/r river. Villain's line is an overpair a lot.

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Villain seems tight preflop but wouldn`t he 3-bet TT+?

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Sorry, I'm retarded. I thought Button checked behind flop and raised the turn. As is I probably check/call the river. :|

Re: 89s and I\'m ascared.
 

yes id lean towards ilovepokers line (like always) now that ive though about it..
but someone mentioned 3bet turn and im thinking yeah why not we have TP and FD? thoughts on that? [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] (villain is pretty agressive 3)

Re: 89s and I\'m ascared.
 

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I would c/r river. Villain's line is an overpair a lot.

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Villain seems tight preflop but wouldn`t he 3-bet TT+?

[/ QUOTE ]my guess would be that he would 3-bet 77+

Re: 89s and I\'m ascared.
 

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Over how many hands are these stats?
I agree that villain`s line looks scary although he seems aggro enough postflop to make the river a b/c.

[/ QUOTE ]112

Re: 89s and I\'m ascared.
 

[ QUOTE ]
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Whoever said bet / call: that's usually the best way to win the least and lose the most.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not in this specific situation. In this spot, checking and calling is the line that will win the least and lose the most. I think youre underestimating how often a typical player is raising with a weak holding on the turn, and if we check the river he'll gladly check it down all those times he's beat, but if he does have a better hand he'll certainly bet. This is why I think bet/call is the best line in this situation.

[/ QUOTE ]What is he raising on the river that we beat though? I'm not saying that this line is wrong I just hate the idea of calling a raise, and I think he will bet anything that he would have called a donk with.
edit: well not ANYTHING, but almost anything and he could also bet with a hand that he would fold to a bet with.

[/ QUOTE ]

If your read is correct then bet/calling the river is clearly a mistake, but I dont feel the same way as you do about this opponents betting range. I dont believe the villain will bet anything he will call a donk with. For example, if we check this river, I dont see him betting some lower pair, but if this is the case, then check/calling is clearly better then bet/calling, but I suspect you are overestimating his betting range when you check this river.

[/ QUOTE ]I see what you mean and it's pretty close either way, but again, my main problem with bet/calling is the idea of having to call a raise.

Re: 89s and I\'m ascared.
 

This seems like a flop that I would look to C/R - assuming that the PFR will bet... they normally do.

I agree that the turn is not something to get too worke up over - I could see him playing like this with a big pair. Checking through the flop to try and lure some more money out on the bigger streets. Most people on the forums will agree that this is a poor play, we it certainly does happen.

I like betting out on the river and calling his raise.
He could still be raising a big PP.

His stats make me think he has some serious flaws in his game - and his PFR is not too high.