Is this a good time for WA/WB or should i pop the flop?
 

Sorry in advance, im a bit of a hand converter noob...

Cryptologic
Limit Holdem Ring game
Limit: $0.25/$0.5
10 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (10 players) Hero is CO with :js :ks
UTG calls, UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 calls, MP1 calls, MP2 (poster) checks, MP3 folds, Hero raises, Button folds, SB 3-bets, BB folds, UTG calls, 2 folds, MP2 calls, Hero calls.

Flop: :2h :jh :6c (12.6SB, 4 players)
SB bets, UTG calls, MP2 calls, Hero calls.

Turn: :4c (8.3BB, 4 players)
SB bets, UTG calls, MP2 calls, Hero calls.

River: :kh (12.3BB, 4 players)
SB checks, UTG checks, MP2 checks, Hero bets, SB folds, UTG calls, MP2 folds.

Results:
Final pot: 14.3BB

Re: Is this a good time for WA/WB or should i pop the flop?
 

WA/WB usually applies to heads up situations.

I would raise the flop. If SB 3-bets, then the 2 players inbetween you either have to call 2 bets cold or fold.

If SB just calls, then you will be getting an overlay from the 2 players inbetween if they also call, while you probably have the best hand.

Re: Is this a good time for WA/WB or should i pop the flop?
 

This is no WA/WB. WA means that when you are ahead the other person doesn't have more then 3/4 outs, or when you are behind the other person doesn't have more then 3/4 outs. You have 3 opponents here on a 2 suited flop, you need to protect your hand! RAISE

Re: Is this a good time for WA/WB or should i pop the flop?
 

great. thanks for the replys. should have raised. because when i am ahead im not way ahead, so i need to protect.

Re: Is this a good time for WA/WB or should i pop the flop?
 

You're last to act, a raise can only be for protection if SB 3-bets. Once guys have put money in on the flop, they don't fold for one more bet at this level. Raising is still correct I think, but it's for value.

Re: Is this a good time for WA/WB or should i pop the flop?
 

WA/WB is usually most effective when you and your opponent have shown strength preflop, and the pot is heads-up. You can narrow down the opponent's range because of the preflop action.

Re: Is this a good time for WA/WB or should i pop the flop?
 

[ QUOTE ]
This is no WA/WB. WA means that when you are ahead the other person doesn't have more then 3/4 outs, or when you are behind the other person doesn't have more then 3/4 outs. You have 3 opponents here on a 2 suited flop, you need to protect your hand! RAISE

[/ QUOTE ]

Raising will not protect your hand at any point here, although this is a spot where you should at least consider waiting for the turn to raise. Do you see why?

Re: Is this a good time for WA/WB or should i pop the flop?
 

if BB IS A ROCK, WAIT!

Re: Is this a good time for WA/WB or should i pop the flop?
 

Yeah, I didn't look at the position of hero when making my statement about protection.

Re: Is this a good time for WA/WB or should i pop the flop?
 

You have to raise this on the flop or turn. I would raise the flop. The only real draw out there is to the flush. You can't protect this hand given your position relative to the SB.

Re: Is this a good time for WA/WB or should i pop the flop?
 

i would raise the turn. call/bet the river.

Re: Is this a good time for WA/WB or should i pop the flop?
 

Grunch...

I think I would raise the flop here, and see what kind of action I get. You are very likely to have the best hand here and if you were reraised on the flop then I think you could revert to WA/WB.

Re: Is this a good time for WA/WB or should i pop the flop?
 

[ QUOTE ]
if BB IS A ROCK, WAIT!

[/ QUOTE ]
notice that BB folded preflop. i believe you responded to the wrong thread.

Re: Is this a good time for WA/WB or should i pop the flop?
 

Are you waiting for the turn to try to cut down the pot odds for a flush draw if a brick hits the turn? Also a brick on the turn increases you own hand value does it not?

Edit: Dang, I didn't think about this earlier but I wanna keep my first reaction up the anyway for critique, but a flush draw would've raised it up already. So, what are we waiting to raise the turn for? Increase in value when a brick hits the turn?

Re: Is this a good time for WA/WB or should i pop the flop?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
if BB IS A ROCK, WAIT!

[/ QUOTE ]
notice that BB folded preflop. i believe you responded to the wrong thread.

[/ QUOTE ]

And in other news, Miles, having run out of suitable adversaries in Micros, has taken to fighting with himself. Film at eleven.

Re: Is this a good time for WA/WB or should i pop the flop?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
if BB IS A ROCK, WAIT!

[/ QUOTE ]
notice that BB folded preflop. i believe you responded to the wrong thread.

[/ QUOTE ]

Talking to yourself is usually either a sign of genius or insanity. The fact that you're doing it on an interent form makes one category more likely than the other.

I think waiting til the turn is the right move here. We're not gonna see a 3 bet from SB very often and when we do we're usually in trouble anyways, so folding the other 2 players is more likely to give SB the equity we hope to gain by cutting down the number of people in this pot.

Re: Is this a good time for WA/WB or should i pop the flop?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Raising will not protect your hand at any point here, although this is a spot where you should at least consider waiting for the turn to raise. Do you see why?

[/ QUOTE ]

i dont see why.. :,(

the more i look at it the more i want to find a raise somewhere. i see now that i dont have much chance for a protection raise. even if i wait for the turn to raise everyone is going to be getting ~1:6.5 (or more) to call. so if someone is on a flush draw they call profitably.

so why is raising the turn better?