Two Plus Two Newer Archives

Two Plus Two Newer Archives (http://archives1.twoplustwo.com/index.php)

- Mid-High Stakes Shorthanded (http://archives1.twoplustwo.com/forumdisplay.php?f=54)

- - Couple hands... (http://archives1.twoplustwo.com/showthread.php?t=123511)

20/40

Preflop: Hero is CO with A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
1 fold, MP calls, Hero calls, Button calls, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (5 SB) A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB checks, BB checks, MP checks, Hero bets, Button calls, SB folds, BB folds, MP folds.

Turn: (3.50 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets, Button calls.

River: (5.50 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero wants to check fold. Is that okay?

Villain is 80/0/35/1.0/54 over a small sample 35 hands.

Hand 2 ---------------------------------------------------

Preflop: Hero is Button with J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
1 fold, MP calls, 1 fold, Hero raises, 2 folds, MP calls.

Flop: (5.66 SB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
MP checks, Hero bets, MP raises, Hero calls.

Turn: (4.83 BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
MP checks, Hero checks.

River: (4.83 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
MP bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 6.83 BB

6-1 on the river call. Easy? Close? Fold that fo-shinnzille?

Hand 3 ---------------------------------------------------

Preflop: Hero is CO with 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG calls, 1 fold, Hero calls, 1 fold, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (4 SB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG bets, Hero raises, SB calls, BB folds, UTG calls.

Turn: (5 BB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, UTG bets, Hero's a bit lost.

UTG is 56/26/1.8/43 over 1514 hands. SB is 52/26/.8/51 over 12K hands.

I just don't know if I have enough hand to warrent protection here on the turn. Thanks,

Krishan

Re: Couple hands...

If the 80/0 guy is villain in hand 1 (its a bit confusing to me where that read is for) I'd bet/fold the river. Against a normal guy I guess check/fold has merit. Hand 2 I like but its pretty close cuz of the small pot. Hand 3 I'd raise the turn and feel good about it. That was a pretty huge flop and not much has changed.

-DeathDonkey

Re: Couple hands...

Hand 1) check/call, this guy can still have a wide range of hands here. Induce a bluff from JT. I would say bet/fold but I dont trust this guy, so check/call.

Hand 2) I dont get it, therefore I call getting 6-1

Hand 3) Definitely raise the turn, your hand only needs to be good a small percentage of time to justify protecting it. If the SB wasnt in the hand I would just call down. After you raise, check the river unless you improve.

Re: Couple hands...

hnad one cmon man if you folded ace 3 here really i would be suprized who are you kidding here

Re: Couple hands...

you always limp A3s after 1 limper from the CO?

Re: Couple hands...

#1: Why no raise preflop? River, plenty of hidden value from KJ,KT,K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]x[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img],99-55 to bet/fold against this Villain I think.

#2: Literally, what do you think you're ahead of? I would rather raise than call.

Re: Couple hands...

Hand 1. I think against standard opposition this is a pretty easy c/f but against this guy more of a coinflip, I'd call.
Hand 2. I fold the river and save my money.
Hand 3. I just call. The pot is too small to merit a raise.

Re: Couple hands...

[ QUOTE ]
#1: Why no raise preflop? River, plenty of hidden value from KJ,KT,K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]x[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img],99-55 to bet/fold against this Villain I think.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, I don't know what I was feeling. Seems like there are a lot of obvious draws. A lot of times I just know I'm beat and then it turns out I'm beat and I'm having trouble telling if the pot odds were right or not.

Hand 2, KJ, KQ, QJ. I'm still not sure on this one.

Krishan

Re: Couple hands...

Hand 1 I would check fold. He just seems too bad, evn based on 35 hands, to consider folding here. I'm not sure if check/call or bet/fold is better tho as even v this guy we arent ahead a huge deal. I suspect check/call here.

Re: Couple hands...

Hand 1- I want to SD, so I check and call.
Hand 2- This is an easy fold unless you hav e read on mp that we don't. The turncheck is odd, but he's still not betting river K high.
Hand 3- raising or calling small difference. I raise and expect the last guy to cc often.

Re: Couple hands...

bet/fold first one, he could have a lot of hands here and he's obv calling w/ things he shouldnt be to have vpip 80.

second one i fold or raise depending on how fishy guy is

third i call this turn and re-evaluate on river (prb folding UI)

Re: Couple hands...

[ QUOTE ]
Fold that fo-shinnzille?

[/ QUOTE ]

good effort, but just terrible krishan [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

hand 1 i don't think i can check/fold, guy appears to be an idiot, i'd bet/fold.

hand 2 i fold this close to always i think, but a lot of people seem to like calling so i'm intrigued.

hand 3 i'm calling.

Re: Couple hands...

I can't believe everyone wants to just call hand 3. Did you guys see the stats? I might cap the turn if its 3 ways.

-DeathDonkey

Re: Couple hands...

[ QUOTE ]
I can't believe everyone wants to just call hand 3. Did you guys see the stats? I might cap the turn if its 3 ways.

-DeathDonkey

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree. I'm definitely raising the turn.

Re: Couple hands...

im no expert but hand 3 looks like an easy raise on turn

Re: Couple hands...

[ QUOTE ]
Did you guys see the stats?

[/ QUOTE ]

no, i didn't. [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

Re: Couple hands...

Hand 1: I raise this preflop everytime, getting the button and some initiative is good. On the river I would still bet, a guy with these stats will still pay off with lots of mid pocket pairs and maybe even a 2 or 4.

Hand 2: I think I fold here. Seems if he semibluffed the flop with some kind of straight draw that 8 is a bad card.

Hand 3: I raise this turn. In my experience these kind of bets are usually some picked up draw. That is a great board for your hand and you still want to get SB to fold overs I think.

Re: Couple hands...

Check-call, fold, raise.

Re: Couple hands...

[ QUOTE ]
Hand 3 I'd raise the turn and feel good about it. That was a pretty huge flop and not much has changed.

[/ QUOTE ]

actually, our equity has dropped, so quite a bit has changed. i don't see the point in raising here. to clean up T outs? could you elaborate?

Re: Couple hands...

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Hand 3 I'd raise the turn and feel good about it. That was a pretty huge flop and not much has changed.

[/ QUOTE ]

actually, our equity has dropped, so quite a bit has changed. i don't see the point in raising here. to clean up T outs? could you elaborate?

[/ QUOTE ]

It's because you have the best hand, bob.

Re: Couple hands...

hand 1, you could raise preflop. but for the river i check-call.

hand 2, wow, i can't believe so many people want to call here. i fold.

hand 3, you could also raise preflop. but this turn is such an easy raise.

Re: Couple hands...

I agree on the turn raise on hand three, but are we betting every river? Is there ever a river card that we don't bet? Assume SB cold calls... again.

Re: Couple hands...

Hand 1 I like bet-folding better than check folding. Villain is an idiot, and could have anything, really. I don't really like check-fold or check-call because that is a much harder decision than bet-fold. Bet folding minimizes our chances of making a mistake.

Hand 2 I fold the river because even if he c/r the turn with a draw (likely), nearly everything reasonable has paired up. If villain really has nothing like K or Q high I think he would have also bet the turn.

Hand 3 is a raise for value, and to charge villain for whatever stupid draw he is likely to be donking. Getting 3 bet is bad, but not a problem due to the # of outs we have and the strength of our hand.

Re: Couple hands...

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Hand 3 I'd raise the turn and feel good about it. That was a pretty huge flop and not much has changed.

[/ QUOTE ]

actually, our equity has dropped, so quite a bit has changed. i don't see the point in raising here. to clean up T outs? could you elaborate?

[/ QUOTE ]

It's because you have the best hand, bob.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is where we differ. I don't see this being the case that often.
I also think that when SB folds the turn, our equity will not rise very much at all, if any. I also think that when he calls, he has the better draw or the better hand the majority of the time.
By raising, we also open ourselves up to paying 3BB to see a river in what is a 6BB pot.

I really don't see enough good coming from a raise here. Maybe you could elaborate on your thought process.