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PL/NL Texas Hold'em >> Full Ring

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ClubChamp04
addict


Reged: 08/30/06
Posts: 624
Re: Stars $50 - KK reraise vs terrible board [Re: DrMega]
      #13204151 - 12/01/07 05:43 PM

Quote:

(though I probably bet and curse when he shoves).





I probably do the same actually. I thought the OP was in position so that's why I said check but I do like firing here OOP.


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AllTheCheese
addict


Reged: 11/02/07
Posts: 508
Re: Stars $50 - KK reraise vs terrible board [Re: Chargers In 07]
      #13204438 - 12/01/07 06:12 PM

Quote:

If you bet $12 on the flop and he shoves you need 27.77% equity to call. So he needs AQ or worse 1.1% of the time to b/c. Adding in if he'll call KQo then it's an easy call because KQo felts this flop.




I understand we'll have pot odds, but why do we want to commit as a big dog? FE doesn't justify it. We're betting $37 to win $15 and he's shoving all but a few hands in his range, (AQ, 99, possibly AA but he prob four-bets all-in pre). Btw, I think it's nonstandard to put KQ offsuit in an unknown's range after they call a reraise.


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bottomset
Carpal \'Tunnel


Reged: 10/25/04
Posts: 12983
Loc: middleset ftw
Re: Stars $50 - KK reraise vs terrible board [Re: AllTheCheese]
      #13204510 - 12/01/07 06:18 PM

Quote:

Gimme a break, Chargers. Only a donk felts AQ here.

Board: Jc Tc Qd
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 26.666% 23.58% 03.09% 35715 4676.00 { KK }
Hand 1: 73.334% 70.25% 03.09% 106403 4676.00 { AA, QQ-TT, AKs, AcQc, KQs, AKo }


This range is pretty loose IMO. You played the hand fine OP.




lol its nl50 players aren't exactly good

that range is tight as hell

also if that is his felt range, you are likely +EV bet/calling as he's folding the flop a bunch then and you breakeven on the shove call

Edited by bottomset (12/01/07 06:19 PM)


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JSampras1
member


Reged: 09/06/04
Posts: 152
Re: Stars $50 - KK reraise vs terrible board [Re: Chargers In 07]
      #13208155 - 12/01/07 11:18 PM

I get your math, but the question is how much FE do i have here? I'm getting $43 in as a 3-1 dog, but is this a bet that i want to take here? I can just check/fold and avoid this bet entirely. I think it depends on how likely i feel he's in there with garbage. If i think there's a good chance he's in with 88 or AJ or some crap, then i bet/call.

But against an unknown, since it's close, I don't think a CF is horrible is it?


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Albert Moulton
Pooh-Bah


Reged: 01/15/05
Posts: 2377
Loc: Live Full Ring NLHE
Re: Stars $50 - KK reraise vs terrible board [Re: JSampras1]
      #13208601 - 12/01/07 11:48 PM

Bet $10 and fold to a raise. If villain calls, then c/f a non-Ace turn (unless it's some kind of min-bet).

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bottomset
Carpal \'Tunnel


Reged: 10/25/04
Posts: 12983
Loc: middleset ftw
Re: Stars $50 - KK reraise vs terrible board [Re: Albert Moulton]
      #13208685 - 12/01/07 11:52 PM

Quote:

Bet $10 and fold to a raise. If villain calls, then c/f a non-Ace turn (unless it's some kind of min-bet).




yuck


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bottomset
Carpal \'Tunnel


Reged: 10/25/04
Posts: 12983
Loc: middleset ftw
Re: Stars $50 - KK reraise vs terrible board [Re: JSampras1]
      #13209079 - 12/02/07 12:14 AM

Quote:

I get your math, but the question is how much FE do i have here? I'm getting $43 in as a 3-1 dog, but is this a bet that i want to take here? I can just check/fold and avoid this bet entirely. I think it depends on how likely i feel he's in there with garbage. If i think there's a good chance he's in with 88 or AJ or some crap, then i bet/call.






$36 total would be going in postflop

only $24 or so as a 3/1 dog(which is probably the low end) where you will get 3/1 on a call so its fine

the first $12 has different EV, and likely at these stakes is immediately +EV, if you get folds >45% of the time its +EV in a vaccuum(any2cards actually)

nl50 players play bad, and typically its by calling too much, so a lot of small pairs, suited connector hands can call RRs and just give up, or make a bad call with a 1pair hand where you have a lot of ev


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Chargers In 07
veteran


Reged: 09/02/07
Posts: 1383
Loc: DERB of Micro/Small stakes
Re: Stars $50 - KK reraise vs terrible board [Re: bottomset]
      #13209128 - 12/02/07 12:18 AM

Quote:

$36 total would be going in postflop

only $24 or so as a 3/1 dog(which is probably the low end) where you will get 3/1 on a call so its fine

the first $12 has different EV, and likely at these stakes is immediately +EV, if you get folds >45% of the time its +EV in a vaccuum(any2cards actually)


Thanks Mr. set, I was about to post the same thing.

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Mike Kelley
Desperately Seeking Title


Reged: 07/23/05
Posts: 2126
Loc: Reraising
Re: Stars $50 - KK reraise vs terrible board [Re: AllTheCheese]
      #13209778 - 12/02/07 01:00 AM

Quote:

Gimme a break, Chargers. Only a donk felts AQ here.

Board: Jc Tc Qd
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 26.666% 23.58% 03.09% 35715 4676.00 { KK }
Hand 1: 73.334% 70.25% 03.09% 106403 4676.00 { AA, QQ-TT, AKs, AcQc, KQs, AKo }


This range is pretty loose IMO. You played the hand fine OP.




A fairly competent Reg felted AQ against me today on this exact board. He's usually competent anyway.


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crazymoose
enthusiast


Reged: 02/07/05
Posts: 267
Loc: Remedial Math
Re: Stars $50 - KK reraise vs terrible board [Re: JSampras1]
      #13210751 - 12/02/07 02:23 AM

Readless I'd say check/folding is okay here, villain's range has you clobbered here.

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