Is Pascal's Wager self-defeating?

[Pharcyde]

Please forgive me if this topic has been discussed before in the past, but a)I'm new to this forum and b)it's been bugging me ever since the first day of my Philosophy 101 course, and I'm not the type to go to office hours.

From what I remember from the lecture, our professor said that Pascal focused on the "infinite gain" of believing in God, as opposed to the "infinite loss." He went on to explain that this meant that there aren't any consequences (i.e. Hell) for not believing in God, you simply die and don't get to go to Heaven.

Possibilities:
1. You believe in God. He exists. You get to go to Heaven.
2. You believe in God. He doesn't exist. You just die.
3. You don't believe in God. He exists. You don't get to go to Heaven. You just die.
4. You don't believe in God. He doesn't exist. You just die.

My question is: if you reject the idea of God, doesn't it follow that you also reject the idea of Heaven?

If the answer to this question is "yes," then it seems to me that the only way to be disappointed in Pascal's Wager is to believe in God and it turns out that he doesn't exist. It's clear you come out a winner in 1. and 4. Now, if you don't believe in God, then the infinite gain of Heaven doesn't exist to you. And even if it really does exist, you'll never know after you die, and because death is all you expected after life, you really didn't lose anything. However, if you believe in God and he doesn't exist, then you've made sacrifices (Lent, no pork, no sex before marriage, etc.) for no reward. So it seems like possibility 2. is the only way to come out a loser. Then again, I might have butchered Pascal's Wager and am about to get reamed out for it.

Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

[Green Kool Aid]

[ QUOTE ]
b)it's been bugging me ever since the first day of my Philosophy 101 course, and I'm not the type to go to office hours.

[/ QUOTE ]

1. going to SMP over office hours is standard.

2. i dont really have much input on religion. basically i dont want to think about it too deeply, because math/science has already ruined watching baseball, playing poker, and too many other things where i enjoyed them more before i got too smart.

[AceofSpades]

Your professor is wrong - at least according to any versions of pascal's wager I have heard. It is centrally based on Hell and eternal punishment for non-belief.

so if you believe and God exists - you win
if God doesn't exist then it is - null
and if you don't believe - you get uber pwned.

The flaw in Pascal's wager is that there are many mutually exclusive heaven and hell religions.

[spanshcastlemagc]

sometimes i think its better to believe in god because if he does exist then you get to go to heaven (i know it might not be that simple but work with me), but then if he doesn't then no big deal. But then I don't think that believing in god because of this reason is actually 'believing' in god because you do really care if he exists, youre just taken the safe route, i guess i can just see god on judgement day saying 'nice try' and blocking the passage to heaven, sorry this didnt help, just random thoughts

[Jshuttlesworth]

#3 is wrong. You don't believe and he does exist, you more than "just die."

[Pharcyde]

[ QUOTE ]
1. going to SMP over office hours is standard.

[/ QUOTE ]
Good to know

[Pharcyde]

Thanks for the replies. I guess would've been better off doing the reading and ditching the lecture.

[Homer]

What bothers me about this is that you can't force yourself to believe in God, even if based on Pascal's Wager it is the best play. I can force myself to fold a poker hand, knowing that it is the right play, but I can't force myself to believe in God even if it seems to be the right choice.

[traz]

And even if you "forced" yourself to believe in god, only true faith earns your spot in heaven, not some pro/con decision

[neverforgetlol]

the problem is, believing in god has it's negative if it's not real, and this doesn't tell you which god to believe in. you could just end up in some other religions hell.

[benjdm]

Pascal's wager is worthless. That said, this essay makes me smile a bit. The End of Pascal's Wager: Only Non-theists go to Heaven (http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/richard_carrier/heaven.html)

[keikiwai]

Pascal's wager is a good example of how the society one lives in limits ones imagination. Logically it is utterly flawed unless you decide to accept the assumptions Pascal made. But the validity of these assumptions is just as unkown as the existance of God.

[ QUOTE ]
And even if you "forced" yourself to believe in god, only true faith earns your spot in heaven, not some pro/con decision

[/ QUOTE ]

How do you know this? What if peope who believe in God are punished? I mean, isn't the old testament a mean and vengefull God... and anyway, why do you think God cares about us?