25NL: do you ever fold this spot? (weak flush)

[rwdvc]

My villain is 31/9/2.9 over 160 hands. My play here seams weak/tight to me which is just crappy to begin with. Anyhow, with such a weak flush getting some resistance do you ever fold this spot, or do you repop him AI? At any rate, any and all comments are appreciated.

Poker Stars, $0.10/$0.25 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 5 Players
LeggoPoker.com (http://www.leggopoker.com) - Hand History Converter (http://www.leggopoker.com/hh)

SB: $14.35
Hero (BB): $44
UTG: $16.10
CO: $28.25
BTN: $26.50

Pre-Flop: 7/images/graemlins/spade.gif 5/images/graemlins/spade.gif dealt to Hero (BB)
UTG calls $0.25, CO folds, BTN calls $0.25, SB calls $0.15, Hero checks

Flop: ($1) K/images/graemlins/spade.gif 4/images/graemlins/spade.gif 3/images/graemlins/spade.gif (4 Players)
SB checks, <font color="red">Hero bets $1.45</font>, <font color="red">UTG raises to $2.90</font>, 2 folds, Hero calls $1.45

Turn: ($6.80) J/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (2 Players)
Hero checks, <font color="red">UTG bets $4.75</font>

[hoyasaxa]

no. not ever. seriously, not at all. in fact, im repopping the flop and calling a shove. there are so many hands, ace of spades, pair + fd, set, that can be making this play that you are real far ahead of his range.

[vieira10]

I never, ever, ever fold this. However, I prob reraise the flop and call a push or (if he just calls) push all in on any non-spade turn. I hate checking to villain here because i think theres a good chance he checks behind and there are a lot of cards that would put him ahead or make villain shut down.

[munkey]

[ QUOTE ]

Re: 25NL: do you ever fold this spot? (weak flush)



[/ QUOTE ]

I think you're asking the wrong question. the question should be how do I get the most money out of hands I beat.

Stack sizes mean 3bet flop AI is prob best though if viilian is aggro bluff happy and has betting lead I dont mind your turn line and c/r turn AI - this way gets more out of Kx.

2pairs/sets are felting so get the money in before another spade falls/board pairs or I start moaning about the no. 100bb pots I've lost with flopped flushes vs sets/2pair this month.

[CyberMuppet]

I'll never fold this for ~60BB. I also raise flop and call if he shoves. As played I think I shove turn, too many river cards I don't want to see.

[il_martilo]

CR the turn and ship it on the river. Against this type of opponent you will almost always be good here.

[orig!naL]

Munkey, are you making an argument then it's better to just shove the flop given villain's stack size, instead of raising to $9 and calling a shove or getting it in on the turn?

[limit refugee]

Opponent dependant, your only thought is how best to get it all in...if he's agro but folds to resistance CRAI turn...aggro and likes to go to war 3B flop.

Just do what it takes to make him want it in there.

[munkey]

[ QUOTE ]
Munkey, are you making an argument then it's better to just shove the flop given villain's stack size, instead of raising to $9 and calling a shove or getting it in on the turn?

[/ QUOTE ]

Raising to 9 and calling a shove is actually what I meant when I said b3bAI (i kinda use b3bAI as shorthand for I'll get AI flop if I can and is kinda bad by me as that's not strictly what it means) though shoving/either is fine as is c/r turn AI given stacks. There's more than 1 way /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

My point was for OP to change his point of view to extracting the most monies of hands he's ahead of which is lots rather than trying to protect himself from few hands that beat him/have outs. i.e focus on VALUE.

[rwdvc]

Thanks for all of the replies people. You can't imagine how much you have helped improve my game over the last month I've been posting. So much more than any book has helped me. I thought this hand was horrible by me, but wanted some other opinions and input. I clearly misplayed it, but I'll correct next time.

[Snafu'd]

[ QUOTE ]
CR the turn and ship it on the river. Against this type of opponent you will almost always be good here.

[/ QUOTE ]
planning to c/r the turn is a bad play b/c it allows villain to take a free card if he wants. 3b the flop to $9 or just go ahead and shove. doesn't matter much either way imo.

[infinity235]

If you ever consider folding this hand, you probably need to re-evaluate your starting hand requirements and start folding suited one-gaps and connectors.

[hockeyf]

People seem to jump for joy in these spots, its far from a terrific situation in a multiway pot, he is likely to have a flush and that flush is higher than ours. But this is 25NL so you can c/r all-in confident and get shown about every hand in the deck containing a king and some other random holdings.

[DawnToDusk]

I think his range is pretty wide here. It was a limped pot PF and you flopped the flush. His range could easily include KxQs or KxJs. Something along those lines. He could also have 44 or 33 or even 34. He could just be playing all macho with As2x. So with that being said I think I am putting him in on the turn. He could easily show up with a better flush but he doesn't have a lot of money to start with so Im not to worried. If the stacks were a lot deeper then I would raise the turn and if I got reraised I would fold and if he just called I would reevaluate the turn. But given how wide his range is I just shove him in here.

[orlov]

[ QUOTE ]
People seem to jump for joy in these spots, its far from a terrific situation in a multiway pot, he is likely to have a flush and that flush is higher than ours. But this is 25NL so you can c/r all-in confident and get shown about every hand in the deck containing a king and some other random holdings.

[/ QUOTE ]
chance of someone flopping a made flush is tiny, chance of having flush over flush on the flop, is like almost non existent. This could be so many hands we beat, youll hardly ever see a better flush here

[hoyasaxa]

[ QUOTE ]
People seem to jump for joy in these spots, its far from a terrific situation in a multiway pot, he is likely to have a flush and that flush is higher than ours. But this is 25NL so you can c/r all-in confident and get shown about every hand in the deck containing a king and some other random holdings.

[/ QUOTE ]

you do realize the chances of flopping a flush are less than 1%?so there is a less than less than 1% chance two people flopped a flush?

[hockeyf]

Wow guys put in some hands! I dont care about the procent of people flopping two flushes, i just say when he plays like this its often a bigger flush.

[jackatwork]

I would never fold here, and against a villain with these stats, I would reraise the flop. He makes this raise on the flop with a lot less than a higher flush.

[Kasane]

[ QUOTE ]
Wow guys put in some hands! I dont care about the procent of people flopping two flushes, i just say when he plays like this its often a bigger flush.

[/ QUOTE ]

We've put in plenty of hands. It's almost never another flush from experience.

[LOwrestling2001]

get it in on the flop, especially because if a 4th spade falls you are screwed. if he happens to have a higher flush then chalk it up to variance.