Moral question?

[AMT]

This might seem insignificant to some, but a question I felt was worth asking:

Should one always accept someone's apology for something, when you know that they're *only* apologizing because they think (or know) that they're about to die?

Does it depend on what it is?
Why? Assume the person dying is very wrong about what they did and that you can only know that the apology is based on this premise of death.

[Xylem]

yes

[hitch1978]

I think you may wish to re-word your question. It is obviously OK, but I don't think that's what you're getting at.

Is your question not more about the motive of either the apologiser or the forgiver?

[Kaj]

[ QUOTE ]
This might seem insignificant to some, but a question I felt was worth asking:

Is it "ok" to accept someone's apology for something, when you know that they're *only* apologizing because they think (or know) that they're about to die?

[/ QUOTE ]

The whole concept of it being "ok" to accept an apology is rather silly, don't you think? What exactly is there to be gained or lost if somebody who wronged you apologizes or not? Ummm, like especially if they are dead?

[kerowo]

If they know they are going to die then not accepting their apology for something is going to serve one purpose; increase their distress at dying. In effect causing that person pain for no real reason, that's as good a definition of immoral as any other.

[AMT]

[ QUOTE ]
If they know they are going to die then not accepting their apology for something is going to serve one purpose; increase their distress at dying. In effect causing that person pain for no real reason, that's as good a definition of immoral as any other.

[/ QUOTE ]


reworded the OP, but:

is it just situationally dependent based on the "crime"? why is it so simply case dependent? the person was dead wrong in whatever it was. Should I accept the apology of a dying nazi soldier that killed my relatives? Should I accept the [censored] form high school's apology for dicking everyone that he knows over and being the biggest douche in the world and an immoral and dishonest prick and never having been able to change that?

[hitch1978]

My father left when I was three, I met him a couple of times when I was about 20, after each time he made no effort at contact.

He died this year, and I have little doubt that a visit from me in the hospital to tell him I thought he was a great dad would heve decreased his distress at dying. I chose not to make that trip.

Was my decision immoral?

[AMT]

hitch,

I do not think that it was immoral to do that but it's a bit different operating under the assumption that he did not apologize to you for your relationship's history. Would you have accepted an apology from him on his deathbed?

[hitch1978]

[ QUOTE ]
hitch,

I do not think that it was immoral to do that but it's a bit different operating under the assumption that he did not apologize to you for your relationship's history. Would you have accepted an apology from him on his deathbed?

[/ QUOTE ]

My post was directed at kerowo, but.....

Your question is a real doozy, let me give it some thought.... I'll be back.

[hitch1978]

By 'accepted', am I correct in thinking that you just mean verbally, as opposed to emotionally?

[tomdemaine]

An apology only makes sense if there can be restitution. A dying person can provide no restitution so an apology is meaningless. Accepting a meaningless apology creates in you the value "people can do whatever they want to me and apologize" this is not a good value to have as it will attract bad people who want to exploit you into your life. Only accept apologies where someone has given adequate restitution and has taken action to change their behavior in the future.

[kerowo]

[ QUOTE ]
My father left when I was three, I met him a couple of times when I was about 20, after each time he made no effort at contact.

He died this year, and I have little doubt that a visit from me in the hospital to tell him I thought he was a great dad would heve decreased his distress at dying. I chose not to make that trip.

Was my decision immoral?

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think it is quite the same thing. My interpretation of the OP was that the person being apologized to was there already and nothing else was required accept to make the accept/reject decision. Your situation is different and more complicated. I don't know where the line is for how much effort is required to give comfort to someone who has done you harm.

The OP also didn't mention what was being apologized for, which would make the story better but probably doesn't change things too much. I'm not sure why you would be in a situation to reject the apology for someone doing something really outrageous.

[kerowo]

[ QUOTE ]
Accepting a meaningless apology creates in you the value "people can do whatever they want to me and apologize" this is not a good value to have as it will attract bad people who want to exploit you into your life.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is pretty dumb. The situation described is a deathbed apology, not an every day apology. I'm also leery that being a hardass magically attracts a better class of people than if you are willing to accept an apology without extracting revenge first.

[AMT]

also if anyone feels i should cross-post this in another forum, suggest which one and I will do so, I'd be interested in lots of responses of course. I wasn't sure how appropriate it was to do so.

[RJT]

There’s a good chance that the person would have apologized earlier, but didn’t have the courage to do so – too embarrassed or whatever.

Another good probability is that with death approaching, the person finally “got it - that things came into perspective. He realized what matters and what had been nonsense prior to this point in his life.

I’d consider those types of issues and decide how I felt about the apology.

Personally, regardless of how I felt about the sincerity; I’d accept the apology and let the man die in what he would think was peace. The Truth of the matter wouldn’t really make a difference – he’d get the same relief either way. It would only matter to me – the survivor. I’d feel good about how I handled it. I’d either feel comfortable if it were an actual forgiveness or in thinking that at least I gave him some comfort despite my not being able to actually forgive.

[Leonardo daVinci]

I think it comes down to the golden rule of all human life. "Do to others as you would want done to you." If you were dying and wanted to apologize to someone, would you want them to accept your apology?

[vhawk01]

[ QUOTE ]
I think it comes down to the golden rule of all human life. "Do to others as you would want done to you." If you were dying and wanted to apologize to someone, would you want them to accept your apology?

[/ QUOTE ]

I think you have that backwards. You are giving a good argument for why you shouldnt do anything that requires you to make a deathbed apology. I mean, I would like it if people gave me all their stuff and money, but I'm not going to give them all my stuff and money.

[willie24]

you should forgive him regardless. it doesn't matter whether he apologizes or not.

this is for your own sake more than his.
of course, you have no "moral" obligation to forgive him...but whats the point of holding a grudge forever? people are selfish.

[AMT]

[ QUOTE ]
I think it comes down to the golden rule of all human life. "Do to others as you would want done to you." If you were dying and wanted to apologize to someone, would you want them to accept your apology?

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't know how my thought process mechanism would develop if I were a murderer trying to apologize to the mother of one of my victims. Your statement illustrates partially why I posted this: in most of these seemingly extreme situations (which actually have and do happen), a lot of people aren't capable of putting themselves in the other persons frame of mind/perspective because it is just not something in their nature, which makes it such a difficult situation to process in my opinion. (I hope that makes sense, I tend to ramble sometimes /images/graemlins/smile.gif)

[tame_deuces]

If they only hurt me sure, they are dying anyway.