Help! My Struggle with Religion.

[shighley3205]

This quote is from the do atheists believe in hell thread and I think it deserves it's own thread from both atheists and religous people alike

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Simple question:

Do you believe that the god you worship sends people to a place where they are to suffer for eternity, or not?

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I guess I'm sort of in the middle on this one. I was raised from childhood to be a Lutheran and as I got older I started questioning how some stuff in the Bible can be taken seriously when it seems so far off the wall. Then one night this past summer while me and my brother were blazing I got to thinking about God/Heaven/Hell/Devil etc and I've come to the conclusion that there are only two viable answers for this debate on whether or not God exists. And I wasn't going to post anything until I saw this quote but if this is a repost feel free to delete it.

First we have SEVERAL different kinds of religions, all worship a mighty being and all live by the same rules of conduct generally speaking but each worship a DIFFERENT god and subsequently each religion claims that if one doesn't believe in its faith then they are going to spend eternity in hell. And some (maybe all) teach that to disobey a law (man-made) is a sin. Now how is it a sin if a man-made law is imperfect? However each and every religion claims their "GOD" to be this all-knowing, all-powerful but most importantly ALL-LOVING being. Now assuming this is true that means the "ALL-Loving" god will send over 2/3 of the population into hell and I can't fathom that happening because then he is no longer all loving.

How can you religous people accept the fact that if your right over 2/3 of earth will perish (if you truly are good people shouldn't this bother you?) but more importantly how can you believe in a God who is this evil?

So either the athiests are right and no such supreme being exists or there is only one supreme being that is being worshiped around the world. I would like to hear what people think of this.

SH

[Brad1970]

What is blazing??

[shighley3205]

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What is blazing??

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smoking weed ftw

[Brad1970]

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What is blazing??

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smoking weed ftw

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I don't do drugs, so I had to ask.

In regard to your post, let me ask you this. What do you know/remember about Christianity from the Lutheran Church?

[hitch1978]

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What is blazing??

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smoking weed ftw

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You're going to hell dude!

/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[bunny]

It seems to me hell is inconsistent with a benevolent god. I think the religions which say God will torture everyone for eternity who doesnt follow their specific religion are wrong.

Religions are the product of humans and there's no good reason to think they are infallible. Perhaps they had other motivations for including "submit to our authority and make lots of donations or you will be tortured forever and ever"

[David Sklansky]

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It seems to me hell is inconsistent with a benevolent god. I think the religions which say God will torture everyone for eternity who doesnt follow their specific religion are wrong.

Religions are the product of humans and there's no good reason to think they are infallible. Perhaps they had other motivations for including "submit to our authority and make lots of donations or you will be tortured forever and ever"

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I already explained hell. Whereas those near death experiences have been shown to be not what people think, the same is not true for the experience of having your life flash before your eyes in that moment of time right before your death. At least the relevant parts of your life. It happened to Lee Salem if he can be believed. Since to you, this time is an eternity, any non sociopath could be considered to be in hell if he has lived his life in a way that should be regretted. Heaven, of course would be the opposite. Next subject.

[Ajahn]

Try replacing the word 'god' with 'magical bunny', and the discussion becomes much more clear.

[tame_deuces]

OP: I'd like to point out that not many religions speak of spending an eternity in hell for sinners. Most have a timelimit as hell is mostly seen as punishment or cleansing of the wicked. Christian versions of hell is also likely to be a bastardization of Abrahamic versions of hell, which are mostly seen as temporary places.

As for this board, Christianity is pretty much the only religion that gets mentioned that has 'eternal' hell, and that doesn't even go for all versions of Christianity.

[hitch1978]

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OP: I'd like to point out that not many religions speak of spending an eternity in hell for sinners. Most have a timelimit as hell is mostly seen as punishment or cleansing of the wicked. Christian versions of hell is also likely to be a bastardization of Abrahamic versions of hell, which are mostly seen as temporary places.

As for this board, Christianity is pretty much the only religion that gets mentioned that has 'eternal' hell, and that doesn't even go for all versions of Christianity.

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Was that not OP's point?

That specialist religion's that have an everlasting hell and also demand that all non-believers go there kind of mean that an all-loving god attributed to said religion is a non-starter? (Due to the fact that said religion has such a small % of global followers, therefore a large % of humans > hell?)

[Lestat]

<font color="blue"> I already explained hell. Whereas those near death experiences have been shown to be not what people think, the same is not true for the experience of having your life flash before your eyes in that moment of time right before your death. At least the relevant parts of your life. It happened to Lee Salem if he can be believed. Since to you, this time is an eternity, any non sociopath could be considered to be in hell if he has lived his life in a way that should be regretted. Heaven, of course would be the opposite. Next subject. </font>

Oh my.

Just what are you basing this on? How do you know the length of time it feels like to the person having his life flash before him? How do know it's an eternity? What makes you think there is anything significant about such an event in a paranormal way?

This subject is far from over. What we're talking about is how one justifies worshipping a being so merciless that He sentences people to eternal pain and suffering. Even the most evil people and ruthless dictators would agree that no earthly crime could warrant such a punishment. Yet theists worship such a system with smiles on their faces.

[mickeyg13]

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So either the athiests are right and no such supreme being exists or there is only one supreme being that is being worshiped around the world. I would like to hear what people think of this.

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Why does it have to be one or the other? Not all religions...not even all sects of Christianity believe that nonbelievers will spend eternity in Hell. I think that belief is primarily linked to certain forms of Protestant Christianity.

Nonetheless, I've wrestled with the notion of an omni-benevolent God condemning a sole to an eternity of punishment, and I've come to the conclusion that I think Hell probably does not exist. I don't think that even the most terrible sinners would deserve such a fate.

FWIW I consider myself Catholic.

[MaxWeiss]

That's why I posted my "I won't do god's will" post. No matter what allowances you give him, god has been, is, and will be immoral in some way.

[MidGe]

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That's why I posted my "I won't do god's will" post. No matter what allowances you give him, god has been, is, and will be immoral in some way.

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[tame_deuces]

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OP: I'd like to point out that not many religions speak of spending an eternity in hell for sinners. Most have a timelimit as hell is mostly seen as punishment or cleansing of the wicked. Christian versions of hell is also likely to be a bastardization of Abrahamic versions of hell, which are mostly seen as temporary places.

As for this board, Christianity is pretty much the only religion that gets mentioned that has 'eternal' hell, and that doesn't even go for all versions of Christianity.

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Was that not OP's point?

That specialist religion's that have an everlasting hell and also demand that all non-believers go there kind of mean that an all-loving god attributed to said religion is a non-starter? (Due to the fact that said religion has such a small % of global followers, therefore a large % of humans &gt; hell?)

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OP said each religion had its faith and an everlasting hell for not following it. My point is that this is a very rare belief, Christianity is the only religion mentioned on these boards (to any remarkable degree) that has an eternal hell. Most others have temporary hells or similar.

I have misunderstood the OP somehow, my apologies.

[Mendacious]

I don't conceptualize "heaven and hell" in the same way you do.

First and foremost, I don't accept the concept that it is God's "judgment" that decides our fate.

Heaven/enlightenment/nirvana is the state where we are at total peace with OURSELVES. Religeon/God is only a pathway to that state.

Conversely, hell is a state of unrest/judgment of ourselves.

"Salvation" is about the capacity to accept forgiveness of ourselves.

Eternity is beyond comprehension and meaningless.