*Official* PPA Fly-In Thread [Archive] - Two Plus Two Newer Archives

BRDSR

10-22-2007, 12:06 PM

Did a little searching and was surprised not to find a thread specicially dedicated to the PPA Fly-In happening in Washington this week. I'm excited about attending the opening reception tonight, hopefully meeting some of the big names in poker, and making a difference in the results of some of the upcoming legislation. Is anyone else attending the event? What are your thoughts?

As far as myself, I haven't even been playing poker for the last six months or so. Part of this is due to new factors in my life (marriage and law school, mostly). However, to be completley honest (not too proud of this), I've found that the online game has simply gotten to difficult for me. I used to make a moderate hourly profit playing, but once the legislation went into effect, a lot of the less talented players no longer went through the effort to play. If I used to be at about the 75th percentile in terms of talent, I bet that a big chunk of the worst half of players stopped playing. Now I'm around the 50th percentile and have trouble just beating the rake.

My goal is to make poker easier for every responsible player to enjoy. My hope is that lots of responsible, less talented players will get involved in the game again and I can start making a profit again.

Hope to see a few of you out there!

Incidently, I live in the Washington area, so this isn't a huge burden for me. I hope not to miss a single law school class during the week. For any of those making the trip to Washington and taking a lot of time out of your lives to help with this, please accept my sincere appreciation.

Berge20

10-22-2007, 12:10 PM

I hope to attend some of the events, but will likely only be able to swing the Tuesday evening reception due to work limitations.

Anyone coming into town (or even a local) is more than welcome to drop me a line.

DeadMoneyDad

10-22-2007, 12:36 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I hope to attend some of the events, but will likely only be able to swing the Tuesday evening reception due to work limitations.

Anyone coming into town (or even a local) is more than welcome to drop me a line.

[/ QUOTE ]

From the sound of it they are expecting over 100 out of towners. Spoke to John this morning.

I wouldn't expect a lot of out of towners to repond today as most are traveling.

The list of poker celbs is pretty good. Although Moneymaker may have to cancel.

D$D

BRDSR

10-22-2007, 12:50 PM

[quote

The list of poker celbs is pretty good. Although Moneymaker may have to cancel.

D$D

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm hoping to meet Barry Greenstein. We graduated from the same college (University of Illinois, Champaign-Urbana) and he's just supposed to be one of the nicest guys in poker.

TheEngineer

10-22-2007, 01:38 PM

I'm here. /images/graemlins/grin.gif Look forward to meeting all of you this evening.

FYI: Internet access (WiFi) is free in the rooms. Just sign up for Omni Select (also free) at the sign-in screen.

va1halla

10-22-2007, 02:51 PM

I just wanted to wish you all good luck, and to let you all know I appreciate all of those flying in and attending.

DeadMoneyDad

10-22-2007, 04:27 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[quote

The list of poker celbs is pretty good. Although Moneymaker may have to cancel.

D$D

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm hoping to meet Barry Greenstein. We graduated from the same college (University of Illinois, Champaign-Urbana) and he's just supposed to be one of the nicest guys in poker.

[/ QUOTE ]

Small world.

I used to go to concerts at SUI Edwardsville.

Saw the Greatful Dead there twice.

D$D

Skallagrim

10-22-2007, 04:41 PM

Waaaaaa

Wish I could be there.

Skallagrim

PS - Would anyone who gets to talk with Howard Lederer please tell him Skallagrim from 2+2 says hello and hopes to speak with him again.

Berge20

10-22-2007, 05:55 PM

*Grumbles more*

Now I might not be able to go to the Tuesday reception either.

It's like I have a job or something. AAAAAAHHHH

"Please join the boss for his 6:30pm event Tuesday night." WTF

CTFIRE

10-22-2007, 09:58 PM

Just got back to my hotel. I was a little disappointed in the reception. Spoke with Chris Ferguson and Barry Greenstein for a few minutes. Saw Annie Duke, Howard Lederer, Chris Moneymaker, Andy Block and Sen Demato. After 30 min, Demato gave a short speak and then they made an annoucement about a special event and all the pros left. Not sure if they were having a dinner, but the room went dead after that. Spoke with a couple other on line players from KY, WA, and CA. My congressman won't meet with me, so there isn't much left for me to do. Came to DC on business, so it's no big deal. Just would have preferred that some of the pros stuck around and chatted with those of us that took the time to show up. Was hoping a a poker game might happened, but it didn't. So back to room for some online. Not sure I will go to the Wed night reception at the Rayburn. Thought some of you that couldn't attend would like the report. Later

DeadMoneyDad

10-22-2007, 09:59 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Waaaaaa

Wish I could be there.

Skallagrim

PS - Would anyone who gets to talk with Howard Lederer please tell him Skallagrim from 2+2 says hello and hopes to speak with him again.

[/ QUOTE ]

Will do!

Chris $maker made it and was cool.
Howard was a lot of fun but Annie seemed to be in a bad mood.
Barry was very nice.
Jesus was a trip!

There was some other notables but these were the ones that had to endure me....

D$D

Uglyowl

10-22-2007, 10:43 PM

Thanks for the updates guys.

TheEngineer

10-22-2007, 11:06 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Just got back to my hotel. I was a little disappointed in the reception. Spoke with Chris Ferguson and Barry Greenstein for a few minutes. Saw Annie Duke, Howard Lederer, Chris Moneymaker, Andy Block and Sen Demato. After 30 min, Demato gave a short speak and then they made an annoucement about a special event and all the pros left. Not sure if they were having a dinner, but the room went dead after that. Spoke with a couple other on line players from KY, WA, and CA. My congressman won't meet with me, so there isn't much left for me to do. Came to DC on business, so it's no big deal. Just would have preferred that some of the pros stuck around and chatted with those of us that took the time to show up. Was hoping a a poker game might happened, but it didn't. So back to room for some online. Not sure I will go to the Wed night reception at the Rayburn. Thought some of you that couldn't attend would like the report. Later

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks for the report, and thanks for coming out to support our rights.

The pros actually weren't going to dinner. They were doing some stuff related to getting our legislation passed. I think it could have been explained to the participants better.

Sorry you didn't get enough time to chat with the pros. They'll be at the reception tomorrow.

[ QUOTE ]
Spoke with a couple other on line players from KY, WA, and CA.

[/ QUOTE ]

That was me, Lee Rousso (who's suing WA), and TuffFish. /images/graemlins/grin.gif It was good meeting you.

I understand your congressman won't meet with you, but we do have congressmen you can help us lobby. If nothing else, I'd be very happy if you'd accompany me on my 11 am one. Either PM me or see me at breakfast tomorrow. Thanks.

TheEngineer

10-22-2007, 11:10 PM

TheEngineer

10-22-2007, 11:21 PM

I found the reception to be a good chance to get together and chat. Several pros (already listed) came for the first hour. Unfortunately, they were unable to stay for the second hour. That did slow things down.

I did get to talk to Vanessa Rousso for ten minutes or so, and Sen. D'Amato for about the same length of time. He's committed to our cause, for sure.

Anyway, I'm here to lobby, not to party, and I have a meeting with McConnell's senior staff tomorrow. Now THAT should be fun! /images/graemlins/grin.gif

dlk9s

10-22-2007, 11:33 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I just wanted to wish you all good luck, and to let you all know we're all counting on you.

[/ QUOTE ]

FYP

Legislurker

10-23-2007, 12:59 AM

I wasnt able to get back from Florida in time to make it. Please do a good trip report for us. I just decided not to drive up for the reception today, Id make it just in time but Im exhausted and and I cant do much for poker on the side of a highway in Virginia asleep in a ten car pileup.

ezmogee

10-23-2007, 11:42 AM

I'm here and I do think it's a great opportunity to meet people. I'm one of the young kids that doesn't know a ton of people here, but seeing as how I'm representing my company (CardRunners) I'm trying to do a good job at reaching out to people and saying hello.

I've met a number of interesting people including Bryan, the new member relations director for the PPA, the whole crew from GPSTS (Global Poker Strategic Thinking Societies), John, Dave Dworkin, etc.

I have some non-PPA meetings in DC today, but if anyone wants to say hi at the reception tonight at the Rayburn building, I'll be around and look forward to meeting you.

Ezra

oldbookguy

10-23-2007, 06:12 PM

As this great event is taking place, please, everyone heed the request sent from the PPA and write / call Congress today or tomorrow and lets support those working on our behalf.

My letter sent to Congress and a follow up call is being made in the morning:

I am writing as a constituent, voter, and an avid Lawful Internet Game Player.

Recently the regulations (proposed) were written to enable enforcement of the Unlawful Internet Gambling Enforcement Act, 2006.

The writers recognized the inherent problems presented in the UIGEA, there is no definition of Unlawful and Lawful Internet Gambling.

As an example, gambling is considered ‘Lawful’ when played between individuals and a players skill is the predominate determining factor.

Though the Department of Justice (DoJ) is of the opinion ALL Internet Gambling is illegal, the regulations writers from the Federal Reserve Board (FSRB) and the Department of Treasury (DoT) realize this is not the case and suggest that since Congress has failed to define this issue, they will not either, though banks are expected to know. The regulations writers even suggest that the judiciary will eventually have to decide.

With this in mind, I respectfully ask you to support a version of the Robert Wexler Bill H.R. 2610, the Skill Games Protection Act and actually DEFINE Lawful and Unlawful Gambling rather than leave this to Activist Judges.

With this, these 52 pages of regulations can be boiled down to only a few pages.

Yes, I know, this is simplistic.

LAWFUL INTERNET GAMBLING: Any game or contest played between individuals in which the player’s skill is a determning factor. This includes (court cases have already ruled on this) gin Rummy, Rummy, Backgammon, Chess, Hearts, Spades, Poker and other similar games.

UNLAWFUL INTERNET GAMBLING - Courts have ruled the Wire Act of 1961 included the Internet but not Casino style games, therefore:
Sports Betting or betting on the outcome of an actual event in which the bettor has no influence and games played against a machine program unless the machine program is used to facilitate playing against real people.

Many courts and states to determine lawful gaming use the above Lawful definition and very few (estimated only 8) have laws to bar this. Games such as many mentioned above can be played for REAL MONEY via such household sites as AOL, MSN, YAHOO! and others, for REAL MONEY.

By doing this, Congress will create a safe and secure environment for players and banks.

Additionally, by doing this, all current tax rules and regulations will apply to both players and companies.

Many cite a fear of underage gambling on the Internet, however, to date it seems AOL, MSN and others have no problems with this issue nor do the current Fantasy Gaming sites authorized by Congress in the UIGEA.

If this was really an issue for you and other members in Congress I can only guess this was addressed when Fantasy Wagering and Internet Horse Wagering was exempted from the Wire Act.

Thanks in Advance,

XXXXXXXXX

Berge20

10-23-2007, 10:06 PM

Hope tonight's event went well and any visits with elected officials was productive today.

There was as glimmer of hope briefly for my attendence, but that quickly closed.

BRDSR

10-23-2007, 10:47 PM

Was not able to make it to the reception tonight, but I did make it to the morning legislative briefing and a meeting with my Representative, Rep. Moran from Virginia. Annie Duke and Chris Ferguson also came to the meeting, and I must say that Annie Duke was very articulate and (to my biased ears) persuasive on the subject. Many thanks to her.

The result was good. Rep. Moran agreed to cosponsor both HR 2046 and 2610, so count one more on the list. I have a meeting in Sen. Webb's office tomorrow, although I am not under the impression that he'll be there. Hopefully it will be another productive one, though.

TheEngineer

10-23-2007, 11:04 PM

Good article on the trip (except for the usual inaccurate UIGEA info):

www.usatoday.com/sports/poker/2007-10-22-lobby_N.htm (http://www.usatoday.com/sports/poker/2007-10-22-lobby_N.htm)

WASHINGTON — Poker might not be a sport, but it is a game of skill. That's according to the Poker Players Alliance, which is mobilizing support this week to end federal restrictions against playing for money online.
Nearly 100 of the PPA's 809,000 members, from professionals Annie Duke and Chris Moneymaker to former U.S. Sen. Al D'Amato (R-N.Y.), will lobby legislators Tuesday and Wednesday for changes to Internet gaming bills....

Let's comment.

oldbookguy

10-23-2007, 11:31 PM

Comment posted as follows:

I play online, small games, for fun and a little profit.

Is there so called skill in poker, yes.

The same ‘skill’ used by those playing LEGAL wagering games at AOL, MSN, YAHOO! and other sites. Games such as Solitaire, Hearts, Spades, Free Cell, Rummy and the list of ‘SKILL’ card games goes on and on.

So, yes, there is skill, I have to quickly calculate my odds of making the best hand or better yet, quickly calculate the odds my opponents has NOT made a hand or he has and I cannot win.

The real question is, is (sorry for the Bill Clinton there) are the other legal skill wagering games any more skilled than poker? If the answer is no (and I challenge you to prove solitaire takes ANY skill) then yes, poker is a game of skill and thus LEGAL in almost ALL states.

BTW, keep up the good work TE. If you drove to D.C., PM before you leave, perhaps we can have lunch on your way back to Kentucky if you are traveling I-79.

obg

TheEngineer

10-23-2007, 11:43 PM

Nice comment.

[ QUOTE ]
BTW, keep up the good work TE. If you drove to D.C., PM before you leave, perhaps we can have lunch on your way back to Kentucky if you are traveling I-79.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks for the compliment and the offer. Sorry, but I flew here. Otherwise I'd definitely stop by.

JPFisher55

10-23-2007, 11:50 PM

Duplicate bridge and chess might arguably involve more skill than poker. However, the skills required are completely different. I just wonder if we can ever win this skill argument.
I like the personal freedom argument better than the skill argument. However, it would not surprise me that the political experts feel that we are even less likely to win the freedom argument than the skill argument.

TheEngineer

10-24-2007, 12:03 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Duplicate bridge and chess might arguably involve more skill than poker. However, the skills required are completely different. I just wonder if we can ever win this skill argument.
I like the personal freedom argument better than the skill argument. However, it would not surprise me that the political experts feel that we are even less likely to win the freedom argument than the skill argument.

[/ QUOTE ]

I personally prefer the freedom argument, but I think it's good to be multifaceted. The more we can say in our favor, the better. That's been apparent on this visit, which has exceeded expectations (I'll write more on that later).

Skallagrim

10-24-2007, 01:12 AM

Let me handle the skill argument, I think I have got it down /images/graemlins/smile.gif. All of our efforts are important, as are all of our arguments - what persuades one congressperson may not work with the next. An advance on all fronts is preferable to an advance on a single front - I think Sun Tzu first said that /images/graemlins/smile.gif.

Keep up the good work guys, hope I can join you at the next one.

Skallagrim

whangarei

10-24-2007, 03:42 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I personally prefer the freedom argument, but I think it's good to be multifaceted. The more we can say in our favor, the better. That's been apparent on this visit, which has exceeded expectations (I'll write more on that later).

[/ QUOTE ]

Sounds promising. Look forward to the report.

TheEngineer

10-24-2007, 07:18 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Let me handle the skill argument, I think I have got it down /images/graemlins/smile.gif. All of our efforts are important, as are all of our arguments - what persuades one congressperson may not work with the next. An advance on all fronts is preferable to an advance on a single front - I think Sun Tzu first said that /images/graemlins/smile.gif.

Keep up the good work guys, hope I can join you at the next one.

Skallagrim

[/ QUOTE ]

You do have the skill argument down, for sure.

I prefer the freedom argument (if I had to choose one or the other) in the context of Legislurker's post, but the skill argument is more important for our legal fight, as well as with some congressmen. I did find one needs to show up to a congressman's office with many arguments, and I've used the skill argument successfully somewhere in the discussion in all of them.

I did catch up with Howard Lederer yesterday. He spoke highly of your work on this issue.

Sorry you couldn't make it to the event this year. We hope to see you next year, if it's necessary. The event is going very well so far. We had a good turnout and have changed some minds. We've also gotten some good press. Hopefully we'll make a difference.

TheEngineer

10-24-2007, 08:02 AM

The event is going well so far. Day #2 started with breakfast at the hotel, where we received a briefing on how to best lobby Congress. We were then each scheduled to meet with a few congressmen/congressional staff, and were provided with info sheets on their positions. Howard Lederer, Annie Duke, Andy Bloch, Vanessa Rousso, Barry Greenstein, Jesus Ferguson and other pro poker players joined us for the entire day (Chris Moneymaker had to leave due to a family emergency, but it was cool of him to still come out to greet us despite the issue).

We all met with between one and four congressmen/senators or staffs. Generally, we were each accompanied by a lobbyist and a pro poker player, which made for a good impact and effect. I met with one of Sen. McConnell's senior staffers, one of Rep. Wm. Lacy Clay's senior staffers, and one of Rep. Artur Davis' senior staffers. Others were able to meet with the politicians themselves. It's not an important distinction, as the staffs guide a lot of the decisions. We were able to meet with a substantial number of congressmen and senators or staffs.

Reps. Robert Wexler, Bobby Scott and John Conyers stopped by to kick off our evening reception. Rep. Shelley Berkley came by later to speak as well. We had about ten pros stay for the entire reception. The A/C was weak, but it was in a Congressional meeting room, so they couldn't blame the poker lobby for the heat, at least. I was going to tell them that I paid enough in taxes last year to cover the costs of cooling the room. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

I'll try to post more on this later....it's time for breakfast. /images/graemlins/laugh.gif

DeadMoneyDad

10-24-2007, 12:00 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Waaaaaa

Wish I could be there.

Skallagrim

PS - Would anyone who gets to talk with Howard Lederer please tell him Skallagrim from 2+2 says hello and hopes to speak with him again.

[/ QUOTE ]

Skallagrim,

I did as promised at last nights even. He remembered you by your real name and said that you two hand communicated quite a bit. He said to say Hi back.

The Hill reception was I thought a great sucess. Other than the room being a little hot, I didn't hear a single complaint.

There was a good number of reporters there, great work John and crew!, who seemed to get to the people they needed. The IL crew got a nice follow up with the Wash Chicago Trib reporter.

Hill attendence was also good, sure there were the usual mix of young staffers showing up for the free drinks and food, but there was a really good showing of House Memers stopping by. While only a few spoke quite a few dropped in and mingled some.

Having been to a few of these things in the past I'd say it was a sucess.

D$D

TheEngineer

10-24-2007, 08:18 PM

Day #2 impressions:

The PPA had this pretty well organized. Day #1 was a little below my expectations, due primarily to the reception fizzling out early, but Day #2 far exceeded them. Lobbyists attended every meeting with us, and pros attended at least half of the meetings. We had good press coverage at the reception as well. Also, having the pros roaming the halls on Congress seemed to make a very strong impression, and a nice buzz as well. Their enthusiastic support helped our efforts greatly. I don’t know if we’ll win yet, but I do know we were heard.

Things got a little slow between meetings, especially when we had an hour or two between them. Oh well…we were there to work. We did have a centralized location to congregate between meetings, so we could sit and chat.

When walking from one building to another, I crossed paths with Robert Wexler (this was prior to that evening’s reception). I was with someone who knew him, so I was able to introduce myself and thank him for his support. I told him my grandparents live in his district (Boca Raton, FL). He told me everyone’s grandparents live in his district. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

I learned that our letters really are read, and are worth writing. Sen. McConnell’s office was very aware of my twice-weekly letters informing then that I’m still opposed to UIGEA. :-) In fact, I mentioned that I wrote the senator “a couple of letters”. The reply was “a COUPLE?!?!?!?,” followed by a chuckle. Also, a senior staffer for Barney Frank commented on the quality of letters from us as well.

John Pappas does more for poker in one day than the prior leadership did for poker in one month. PPA has some work to do on the grassroots part of this (they’ve come a long way over the past few months, of course), but they do have the lobbying down very well.

Much of our lobbying consisted of selling the fact that explicit legalization would move the industry onshore. Seems this benefits us as players much more than it helps the current sites. In fact, I detected no bias in favor of the existing U.S.-facing sites (or against our interests as players) in any of the lobbying work done. I looked hard, as I am on the board to represent us (not the other way around). Nor did I see any biases against our interests at all from any of the board members in attendance (Howard Lederer, Chris Ferguson, Mary Magazine, John Pappas, and Sen. Al D’Amato).

TheEngineer

10-24-2007, 08:24 PM

Day #3

After breakfast, we all went to Capitol Hill for a PPA policy briefing that was covered by the press. It went okay. We did get our message out. Following this, Howard Lederer, Andy Bloch, Chris “Jesus” Ferguson, Victor Ramdin, John Pappas and I met with Rep. Ron Paul for around 15 minutes. Needless to say, he’s still with us 100%. We were there primarily to thank him for his strong support, and to show that we’re doing our part to fight for our rights.

Following the Ron Paul visit, the pros got attention walking through the halls of Congress (everyone recognizes Chris Ferguson). We walked past Rep. William Shuster of PA, who found time in his schedule to talk with us after we all introduced ourselves.

Following this, Andy Bloch, a lobbyist and I met with a staffer of my rep, Geoff Davis (R-KY). After that, we met with Rep. Dan Lungren (R-CA). Other folks met with lots of other congressmen and senators as well, of course.

So, it was a very productive trip. I hope we’ll all write and call this week and next in support of this effort. Let’s reinforce the fact that poker players care, and that poker players vote! Thanks. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Berge20

10-24-2007, 08:28 PM

Even though my schedule precluded me from making any of the events, I did what I could to make key staffers aware of the functions--hopefully it helped some and got them there.

I've spoken with several offices that were visited and all seemed to be fairly impressed with the performance and arguments that were presented. Of course that doesn't mean they immediately and fully agree, but a good impression can go a long way at getting some to consider a position they might otherwise not.

As I hear more feedback, I'll try and pass it along.

TheEngineer

10-24-2007, 08:41 PM

One more thing. Geoff Davis' staffer (who was well-versed on the details of UIGEA) had the same response as Mitch McConnell's when I commented that I wrote "a couple of letters". She said it was nice to put a face with the name. Also, she told me the letter I received from Davis' office was a real reply, not a form letter sent to everyone who inquires about Internet gaming. So, they REALLY do read the letters, so PLEASE WRITE. Even if your rep will never support us, he/she needs to know that his/her constituents care, because our work results in the following:

- Our most ardent opponents may lose a little enthusiasm to push others to vote against us.
- Our more reasonable opponents may still vote against us, but may decide against working for or cosponsoring anti-poker legislation.
- Folks currently inclined to vote against us just because they think "everyone wants to end this" may switch to neutral.
- Neutral folks may decide to support us.
- Our supports may become outspoken advocates if they feel they'll get "cover" from us.
- Our outspoken advocates will remain energized.

Any upgrade we can get is a victory. If you disagree, ask yourself what NOT writing or calling will accomplish.

TheEngineer

10-24-2007, 08:44 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Even though my schedule precluded me from making any of the events, I did what I could to make key staffers aware of the functions--hopefully it helped some and got them there.

I've spoken with several offices that were visited and all seemed to be fairly impressed with the performance and arguments that were presented. Of course that doesn't mean they immediately and fully agree, but a good impression can go a long way at getting some to consider a position they might otherwise not.

As I hear more feedback, I'll try and pass it along.

[/ QUOTE ]

Sorry you couldn't make it this year. Thanks for helping with the staffers. I'm glad to hear they're impressed with our efforts.

I agree that this doens't mean we'll win, but it does mean they ALL know we're not a penalty-free bone to be thrown to FoF.

DMoogle

10-24-2007, 08:46 PM

Hey I live in Northern Virginia, and this is the first time I've heard about this (I browse the Legislation forum occasionally, but I usually don't do much more than skim over the topics to see if anything big has happened). Since it's close (DC is about 1/2 an hour away), I'd like to attend whatever events I can.

Can someone give me any information on this? Schedules, location, etc.

Uglyowl

10-24-2007, 09:47 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I learned that our letters really are read, and are worth writing. Sen. McConnell’s office was very aware of my twice-weekly letters informing then that I’m still opposed to UIGEA. :-) In fact, I mentioned that I wrote the senator “a couple of letters”. The reply was “a COUPLE?!?!?!?,” followed by a chuckle. Also, a senior staffer for Barney Frank commented on the quality of letters from us as well.

[/ QUOTE ]

Engineer, thank you for the updates from the event. The line I quoted really got my interest. As I write to people, sometimes I get responses, sometimes I don't. I am very happy to know that my letters don't find the black hole.

I did receive a survey and donation request from the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee (boy was the survey filled with spin) which I filled out my opinions (including poker) and made a small donation. I will have to follow up with a phone call to get their thoughts.

whangarei

10-24-2007, 09:59 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Hey I live in Northern Virginia, and this is the first time I've heard about this (I browse the Legislation forum occasionally, but I usually don't do much more than skim over the topics to see if anything big has happened). Since it's close (DC is about 1/2 an hour away), I'd like to attend whatever events I can.

Can someone give me any information on this? Schedules, location, etc.

[/ QUOTE ]

You just missed it. /images/graemlins/frown.gif It was M-W.

TheEngineer

10-24-2007, 10:32 PM

http://www.nysun.com/article/65037

WASHINGTON — Coming off a resounding defeat in Congress a year ago, the country's top poker players are trying their hand at a time-honored Washington parlor game: lobbying.

Nearly 100 leading card players are flying into the nation's capital this week to urge lawmakers to roll back a ban on Internet gambling. They are led by Senator D'Amato, the New York lawmaker turned lobbyist who serves as chairman of the Poker Players Alliance.....

TheEngineer

10-24-2007, 10:34 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I learned that our letters really are read, and are worth writing. Sen. McConnell’s office was very aware of my twice-weekly letters informing then that I’m still opposed to UIGEA. :-) In fact, I mentioned that I wrote the senator “a couple of letters”. The reply was “a COUPLE?!?!?!?,” followed by a chuckle. Also, a senior staffer for Barney Frank commented on the quality of letters from us as well.

[/ QUOTE ]

Engineer, thank you for the updates from the event. The line I quoted really got my interest. As I write to people, sometimes I get responses, sometimes I don't. I am very happy to know that my letters don't find the black hole.

I did receive a survey and donation request from the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee (boy was the survey filled with spin) which I filled out my opinions (including poker) and made a small donation. I will have to follow up with a phone call to get their thoughts.

[/ QUOTE ]

They are definitely read. As we have lobbyists working hard for us, our letters are that much more important. Your efforts to write have helped our cause.

kidpokeher

10-25-2007, 03:39 AM

[ QUOTE ]
We all met with between one and four congressmen/senators or staffs. Generally, we were each accompanied by a lobbyist and a pro poker player, which made for a good impact and effect.

[/ QUOTE ]

This part confuses me as I don't know how the process works. What does the lobbyist do or add in these cases? You and the pros are effectively lobbying when you meet with them, right?

Thumbs up for Ron Paul and LOL at Wexler's comments. Nice writeup in the Sun too. They're covering all the major complaints and hypocrisy of UIGEA.

DeadMoneyDad

10-25-2007, 08:00 AM

oldbookguy

10-25-2007, 08:59 AM

Pretty good article, I hope we all post comments.

Mine as follows:

Two things really strike me in the article.

1. “Republicans had long pushed for a curb on Internet gambling before they finally succeeded in enacting the legislation shortly before they lost control of Congress. Proponents cited moral concerns, saying the industry preyed on children and compulsive gamblers…”
OK, so why then exempt horse racing, are there no concerns here for children and addicted gamblers? Come on, get real congress.

2. “The alliance also is supporting a narrower proposal by Rep. Robert Wexler, a Democrat of Florida, that would classify poker, chess, bridge, and mah jong as "skill games" and exempt them from the gambling ban.”
So, is this really necessary since ‘skill’ games are not covered by this new law? AOL, MSN, YAHOO! and others offer these games and they are legal.

AH, yes, the DoJ believes courts and congress are wrong and all wagering is illegal, so yes it is needed.

As an American I never thought I would say this, but maybe we need a law to PROTECT us from our own government and Department of Justice. That is sad.

obg

TheEngineer

10-25-2007, 11:00 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
We all met with between one and four congressmen/senators or staffs. Generally, we were each accompanied by a lobbyist and a pro poker player, which made for a good impact and effect.

[/ QUOTE ]

This part confuses me as I don't know how the process works. What does the lobbyist do or add in these cases? You and the pros are effectively lobbying when you meet with them, right?

Thumbs up for Ron Paul and LOL at Wexler's comments. Nice writeup in the Sun too. They're covering all the major complaints and hypocrisy of UIGEA.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
We all met with between one and four congressmen/senators or staffs. Generally, we were each accompanied by a lobbyist and a pro poker player, which made for a good impact and effect.

[/ QUOTE ]

This part confuses me as I don't know how the process works. What does the lobbyist do or add in these cases? You and the pros are effectively lobbying when you meet with them, right?

Thumbs up for Ron Paul and LOL at Wexler's comments. Nice writeup in the Sun too. They're covering all the major complaints and hypocrisy of UIGEA.

[/ QUOTE ]

D$D summed up the need for PPA to have lobbyists when we're not in town. They fight the day-to-day fight, and our letter and phone calls augment that.

There were good reasons to have lobbyists with us at the meetings. Most recreational poker players don't post on the Legislation forum, unfortunately. Many don't necessarily understand the ins and outs of every detail of the legislation out there. They do know that they want to play poker online without government hassle and that they'll vote their beliefs. For these folks, the lobbyist helps with the introduction, keeps the conversation on track and focused, and ensures all of our points were addressed with the congressman. In this way, the recreational poker player only has to say "I want to play poker" and represent his district, then can simply nod in agreement while the lobbyist atriculates the specific argument for our position.

For folks who know their stuff (the ones who post here regularly), the lobbyists helped in getting us a friendly introduction, such that our opinions would be considered rather than just "heard". They also ensured that all the points were made. And, they helped ensure that the points matched the concerns of that congressman.

Also, as we here know more about politics than 98% of the U.S. population (not hard....merely knowing your congressman's name probably puts you in the upper half or better), it's easy to imagine we'd be right there in terms of lobbying. The truth is that all the folks on Capitol Hill (the politicians, staffers, lobbyists, and reporters) live this. These guys were great to have at the meetings, and I was very impressed with the quality of the PPA lobbyists.

kidpokeher

10-25-2007, 04:07 PM

Thanks Eng and D$D

whangarei

10-25-2007, 06:51 PM

Anybody get a read on whether the lobbyists feel any of our bills have a chance of passing this year?

PPAdc

10-25-2007, 06:51 PM

Wow! What an amazing three days poker had in Washington D.C. And the momentum is continuing to build.

From Oct 22 – 24, nearly 100 PPA members including some of the top professional poker players converged on Capitol Hill to meet with lawmakers and defended your right to play online poker. By all accounts the Washington Fly-In and policy conference was a huge success and we made a significant impression on Congress and the media.

In just two days of lobbying the “fly-in” participants met with nearly 50 members of the U.S. House and Senate. We were armed with the message that poker is a game of skill which should be regulated, not prohibited -- and we successfully delivered that message. Several of our meetings resulted in commitments of support and co-sponsorship of H.R. 2046 and H.R. 2610.

We also garnered tremendous media attention for our cause and through this effort we are showing Congress and the American people that there is a true and vocal and growing constituency that cares about poker. Click here for selected coverage (http://pokerplayersalliance.org/pressreleases/newsandarticles_article.php?DID=342).

One of highlights of the conference was the Tuesday night reception on Capitol Hill. More than 150 staffers and PPA members gathered together in one room to talk poker. It was awesome! Even better, Eight members of Congress attended the reception, including Judiciary Committee Chairman John Conyers (D-MI), to show their support for the PPA. I have worked in Washington for a longtime and I can tell you how difficult it is to get Members of Congress to show up to these types of events. It is a testament to the many hours the PPA has spent building our credibility with lawmakers.

Our Wednesday policy forum entitled, “Poker: Public Policy, Politics, Skill and the Future of an American Tradition,” was equally a success. With Howard Lederer, professor Charles Nesson, Radley Balko and Kenneth Adams leading the discussion, the PPA took a serious look at the political future of poker. The consensus? Poker players must become politically aware, register to vote and make their voices heard in debates and elections.

Overall, the three days in Washington were well spent and we really upped the ante in our fight for regulating online poker and getting federal support for our game of skill.

On behalf of our Chairman, Senator Alfonse D’Amato, I want to thank the dedicated PPA members and PPA state representatives who joined us in Washington. Without you, this could not have been accomplished. Senator D’Amato has always said that our membership is our strongest voice in Washington and this week you really proved it!

Let’s keep the momentum moving in the right direction. Please use our member tools (http://pokerplayersalliance.org/pressreleases/newsandarticles_article.php?DID=310) to make your voice heard, write, call or set up your own meeting with your Member of Congress in your hometown.

Sincerely,
John A. Pappas
Executive Director
Poker Players Alliance

DeadMoneyDad

10-25-2007, 08:05 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Anybody get a read on whether the lobbyists feel any of our bills have a chance of passing this year?

[/ QUOTE ]

This is just my personal opinion and again will be unpopular but we are looking at mid '09 at the earliest.

Sure a number of things could happen that could force a vote on a poker bill sooner. I did not spend much time asking these type high level strategy questions from the lobbing group, nor would I seriously expect a straight answer from a group as accomplished as "our" team.

I was heartened to learn that the PPA's lobbiests do have poker taxes in mind in their efforts.

In my opinion it will take all of us working as hard as we do not even know we can to achieve our ultimate goals. Yes I am a bit of a cinic but I fully believe this goal can be accomplished.

We did some great things, these past three days, but we will need to keep doing them if we want to end up where I think we need to be in the future.

D$D

Uglyowl

10-25-2007, 08:18 PM

Sounds like good stuff is going, I made a donation tonight.

As a suggestion I was going to donate and had $30-$35 in mind and only specific figures were available. I could see this as a problem for the $100- $1,000 range with no in betweens.

$5 : Ante
$10 : Small-Blind
$20 : Big-Blind
$50 : Raise
$100 : Re-Raise
$1,000 : All-in

Also any more donation/bonus tie-ins at Fulltilt (donate $100, get $100 bonus at Fulltilt to clear); I will gladly bust through 1,500 hands again.

TheEngineer

10-26-2007, 11:11 AM

Selected Coverage of the PPA DC Fly-In (https://pokerplayersalliance.org/news/newsandarticles_article.php?DID=342)

kidpokeher

10-26-2007, 02:56 PM

This article is my favorite...

http://www.pokerplayernewspaper.com/viewarticle.php?id=2288

TheEngineer

11-04-2007, 10:14 PM

Annie Duke spoke well of the Fly-In

http://www.annieduke.com/journal.php?journalID=2291

I just came back from one of the most exhilarating experiences of my life. The Poker Players Alliance ( www.pokerplayersalliance.org (http://www.pokerplayersalliance.org) ) organized a fly-in to Washington, DC to lobby members of congress to support Representative Barney Frank's proposed legislation (HR 2046) and Representative Robert Wexler's proposed legislation (HR 2610). Basically, HR 2046 allows for internet gambling to be legalized and regulated in the US. HR 2610 is a skill game carve out for the UIGEA. If lotteries, horse racing and fantasy sports are carved out of the UIGEA, Wexler argues that games of skill such as poker, bridge, Mahh-Jong and Backgammon should be as well. Makes sense to me......

Berge20

11-05-2007, 12:40 AM

Very nice

It seems you guys were able to maximize their celebrity to a large extent as well, which is incredibly helpful. Generally gets the member's attention more (right or wrong) and leaves a more lasting impression IMO.

TheEngineer

11-05-2007, 10:07 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Very nice

It seems you guys were able to maximize their celebrity to a large extent as well, which is incredibly helpful. Generally gets the member's attention more (right or wrong) and leaves a more lasting impression IMO.

[/ QUOTE ]

They did get a lot of attention for us, and they probably helped us get some meetings. I was impressed with how hard they were willing to work for this cause.

We did get one meeting from this. Four or five pros were in the meeting with Ron Paul. When they all left and walked down the hall together, it looked a little like the beginning of Poker After Dark, especially with Chris Ferguson there. A congressman saw them, introduced himself, then decided he could spare some time and he invited us all in for a meeting.