Putting opponent all-in on the river ...

[Genesis]

When you have a hnad you believe is best on the river and want to put your opponent all-in do you do anything special with the bet size?

As an example,

Pot is $10 going to the river.
Opponent has $4.57 remaining.
You have $14.47 left.

Opponent has called pot sized bet on flop, 2/3 pot on turn. You suspect he has top pair with a decent kicker, you have an overpair AA. You want to get him all-in.

What would you typically bet? I know the question may seem ridiculous as we are putting him in all-in regardless, but is there any psychological effect of our bet size on his chance to call?

[reemas]

I've always shoved, but this is a great question.

[Sniiii]

I usually just use the slider.

[WhiteWolf]

Where's the $4.58 option????

[Genesis]

Only so many options I can give. I would lump $4.58 with $4.57. Both are intentional manually typed amounts trying to put pressure on opponent.

[iheartponeez]

I usually put in exactly his stack. Never considered it in detail though.

[baker2g]

i round up, so in this case id just go 5

[You're No Daisy]

When I am confident I have the best hand on the river and have my opponent covered, I will put him all-in by typing the exact amount he has left in his stack. This does a few things:

1. It makes him say, "This [censored] put me all-in, cocky [censored]! This sets you up later when you do it to him again and he decides to call with a 2nd best hand. It also works when he decides to take a 2nd best hand to the river and you just put in a decent sized value bet and he calls (because he's still pissed you put him all-in earlier LOL).

2. It really messes with some people. They just plain don't like it. It's very psychological. Villains think you're being a cocky SOB.

When you shove all-in or go all-in over the top of someone or they check the river and you bet 1/2, 2/3 of the pot they'll typically fold. They tend to believe they're beat. But when you put someone in for the exact amount of their stack, they tend to not like that. I know I don't. It's really psychological. This is just my opinion. I'm looking forward to what others have to say.

AC

[well named]

I do the exact amount when I have some inclination that the villain thinks I might be on air, especially if they have folded to my turn or river bets in big pots in the past. It probably doesn't have a huge effect but it does annoy some people so why not. Otherwise I just round up to the next even number.

[buttonpusher]

I usually just shove, I think a shove seems more like a bluff to people which can get a call. Bet sizing to a persons stack does work against certain opponents though, they just hate it.

[Genesis]

That's the kind of information I was looking for.

If someone types in the exact amount I have left it does irritate me a little, but more importantly it makes me think 'why the heck did he do that when he could've just bet $5'. It makes me step back through the hand and see if everything makes sense. If it does then it reassures me to fold. On the other hand if things don't make sense I would guess it makes me more likely to call because it seems like he's trying to put the pressure on me. He must be trying to make me fold...he could be weak.

On the other hand a 1/2 pot river bet of $5 could seem almost like standard ABC play. Making me think 'maybe he's not paying attention, I could still be good here with my KQ'. I guess a lot depends on the opponent's mind set.

[You're No Daisy]

That's the other thing I forgot to add. When you type in the exact amount of villain's stack (especially against a LAGtard), it not only irritates him, but makes him think A) you're weak, or B) he's getting bullied and LAGs don't like that and usually push back. Might not be this particular hand, but like I said in an earlier post...you do it again or put him in a situation for all or most of his stack and you're confident you're ahead, he'll call you with second best hand for the sole reason that, "I DON'T GET PUSHED AROUND!!"

AC

[RedSoxFan]

What about betting $4.56? I did it for attitude control (just got bad beat and thought this would be funny- maybe just to me). Funny thing is that the dude called without raising in his last $0.01. He had the 2nd best hand.

[CowsFTW]

[ QUOTE ]
What about betting $4.56? I did it for attitude control (just got bad beat and thought this would be funny- maybe just to me). Funny thing is that the dude called without raising in his last $0.01. He had the 2nd best hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

I have done this as well. I don't know if it matters or not.

[Hail Eris]

I typically shove to obscure the pot size.

[Sniiii]

I tried it, and it worked!

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool (http://poker-tools.flopturnriver.com/Hand-Converter.php) from FlopTurnRiver.com (http://www.flopturnriver.com) (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Hero ($19.15)
MP ($9.80)
CO ($7.75)
Button ($11.85)
SB ($9.75)
BB ($3.60)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with Q/images/graemlins/heart.gif, Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
<font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $0.35</font>, <font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, BB calls $0.25.

Flop: ($0.75) 4/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 5/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 2/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">BB bets $0.1</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $1</font>, BB calls $0.90.

Turn: ($2.75) 5/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $2.25</font>, BB calls $2.25 (All-In).

River: ($0) 7/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players, 1 all-in)</font>

Final Pot: $7.25

Results in white below: <font color="#FFFFFF">
BB has 2d As (two pair, fives and twos).
Hero has Qh Qd (two pair, queens and fives).
Outcome: Hero wins $7.25. </font>

Final Pot: $7.25


Or it might just be the fact that he sucked. But who knows?

[Win.by.TKo]

[ QUOTE ]
What about betting $4.56? I did it for attitude control (just got bad beat and thought this would be funny- maybe just to me). Funny thing is that the dude called without raising in his last $0.01. He had the 2nd best hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

This has an added annoying benefit of screwing up his next hand before it is even dealt. Imagine villian waking up w/ AA, but with only $.01 in front of him. PRICELESS!!! /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[members_only]

[ QUOTE ]
I typically shove to obscure the pot size.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is probably the best answer as the others are all just a question of levelling

Edit: Also I have def fallen for it myself in the past /images/graemlins/frown.gif

[chanchuan]

What about those who're using a betting script which bets a certain percentage of the pot on every street? I find it weird that noone ever mentions this option in bet-sizing discussions. Pluses:

- it's impossible to read your hand based on your bet sizing because you always bet the same amount

Minuses:
- it's impossible to take advantage of any ideas that consider bet-sizing and are discussed here, because you always bet the same amount

Thoughts?

[Richard Tanner]

[ QUOTE ]
i round up, so in this case id just go 5

[/ QUOTE ]

Wow, this really is a great OP. This, by the way, is the correct answer. In my experience, betting his exact stack projects an image, not of weakness, but of stregth. It's almost as if you know you've got him and want to make sure you get his money.
Rounding up however, seems to project the idea that you might be trying to buy it by betting a larger amount.
As for pushing, I think most newer player or awful players associate an "all-in" with a big hand, so that's less likely to be called.

Cody

[gotmarc]

You bet the amount you think your opponent will be most likely to call.

If you think your opponent will view a bet of $14.47 as an attempt to steal the pot--Bet that amount.

If you think your opponent will view an amount equal to his stack ($4.57) as a sign of weakness then bet that amount.

YOu can do a similar anaylisis on all of these scenerios but a lot of it has to do with your perception of your opponenet as well as your opponents image of you. A.K.A. your table image

[CrAcK_N_CoKe]

I always shove all my chips in the middle.I like it.

[wslee00]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
What about betting $4.56? I did it for attitude control (just got bad beat and thought this would be funny- maybe just to me). Funny thing is that the dude called without raising in his last $0.01. He had the 2nd best hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

This has an added annoying benefit of screwing up his next hand before it is even dealt. Imagine villian waking up w/ AA, but with only $.01 in front of him. PRICELESS!!! /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[/ QUOTE ]
unfortunately you can't do .01 increments at 50NL on stars /images/graemlins/frown.gif