NL$25: LOL sick river....

[NL Newbie]

UTG has slowplayed 2pair oin flops before, he's also very loose and loves to call flops to see turn cards.

Around 38/12/1 over 350 hands.

No read on the all in guy, but not to bothered about him beating me.


Full Tilt Poker, $0.10/$0.25 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 6 Players
LegoPoker (http://www.legopoker.com)Hand History Converter (http://www.legopoker.com/hh)

UTG: $32.25
MP: $6.05
CO: $23.65
Hero (BTN): $25.05
SB: $26.05
BB: $42.80

Pre-Flop: J/images/graemlins/diamond.gif T/images/graemlins/club.gif dealt to Hero (BTN)
UTG calls $0.25, MP calls $0.25, CO folds, Hero calls $0.25, SB calls $0.15, BB checks

Flop: ($1.25) 9/images/graemlins/diamond.gif 8/images/graemlins/club.gif 6/images/graemlins/club.gif (5 Players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, MP checks, Hero checks

Turn: ($1.25) Q/images/graemlins/heart.gif (5 Players)
SB checks, BB checks, <font color="red">UTG bets $1</font>, <font color="red">MP raises to $5.80 and is All-In</font>, <font color="red">Hero raises to $10.60</font>, 2 folds, UTG calls $9.60

River: ($28.25) 9/images/graemlins/club.gif (3 Players - 1 is All-In)
<font color="red">UTG bets $21.40 and is All-In</font> Hero?

I like my turn minraise, but do you? /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Now can we call?

Range please?

[CruS]

In my book, you have about a 12% equity in this hand, 8% coming from ties.
I really think unless he is bluffing or sucks terribly, you (since the river SUCKS) are beat almost all the time.
I can't see a reasoning for bluffing since another player is all in and I don't think any sane player shoves a bare 9 here.

[CruS]

you beat the other straights and ties all the JT combos. I like the fold.

[johnnybeef]

Bet flop, dont ever minraise again.

[thac]

Did you just minraise the turn?

Sometimes I'll raise preflop. A lot of times I'll bet the flop especially in position.. Turn is pretty gay but I'm sure you know that. I suppose I fold here.. but I don't like it.

[NL Newbie]

[ QUOTE ]
Bet flop, dont ever minraise again.

[/ QUOTE ]

I do alot, however vs 5 loose players i feel this will be -EV and i only have perhaps 6 outs+Others which could be expensive to discover.

Minraise is fine here imo, whats bad about it? Because the 9/images/graemlins/club.gif hit?

[thac]

[ QUOTE ]
Minraise is fine here imo, whats bad about it? Because the 9/images/graemlins/club.gif hit?

[/ QUOTE ]

If they're calling a minraise, they're calling a raise to ~14-15ish. There's a [censored] of draws and no loose-passive guys are folding a queen here.

[Casper05]

betting the flop is petty bad imo.

min raise gave him odds to draw to whatever on the turn...raise it up or just shove.

fold river.

[NL Newbie]

No, Mp shoves, UTG must call $9 with a pot of $18 or so.

2:1 on his...w/e it is.

He calls with FD incorrectly but should shove sets/2pair/other.

If your argument if he calls 15$ with FD so i missed value, then there may be some truth in that but i'm doubtfull. I essentially want a call, hence the raise size.


TOP... villan makes mistake blah blah lol

[whyzze]

umn...u limp preflop because you are on the button...then you check the flop? Im baffled.

dont care for the minraise, could be a little more...i usually save my minraises for the river when I have the ace of a 4 flushed board.

fold river.

[NL Newbie]

[ QUOTE ]
umn...u limp preflop becausethey dont fold preflop, my hands not that strong, it wont cut the field, ill often miss flops, cbets wont fold post flop


you are on the button...then you check the flop?Wont fold people, my equity is pretty low, FE doesnt make up for this, im probably behind


Im baffled.

dont care for the minraise, could be a little more...i usually save my minraises for the river when I have the ace of a 4 flushed board.

fold river.

[/ QUOTE ]

[Casper05]

NL_Newbie, I see your point (still dont agree with the minraise, but thats fine)...but if you're going to call the river then he had odds!

[NL Newbie]

[ QUOTE ]
NL_Newbie, I see your point (still dont agree with the minraise, but thats fine)...but if you're going to call the river then he had odds!

[/ QUOTE ]

Didnt :P But its close.

I folded river, i dont see him having 2pair/trips here.

its on video btw, check it out here http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showfl...0&amp;fpart=all (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=0&amp;Board=microplnl&amp;Number=12512282 &amp;page=0&amp;fpart=all)


You know you wanna /images/graemlins/heart.gif

[whyzze]

folding preflop is better than playing this passively. you are rarely going to win much if you play it this way. bet and build the pot. You have 2 overs that could easily be good as well if they call. i will bet the turn alot here too if it bricks...but I would either raise or fold preflop

[iheartponeez]

[ QUOTE ]
folding preflop is better than playing this passively. you are rarely going to win much if you play it this way. bet and build the pot. You have 2 overs that could easily be good as well if they call. i will bet the turn alot here too if it bricks...but I would either raise or fold preflop

[/ QUOTE ]

At least one of those overs is definitely not a clean out.

And if it doesn't ruin his hand, it's an action-killer.

[whyzze]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
folding preflop is better than playing this passively. you are rarely going to win much if you play it this way. bet and build the pot. You have 2 overs that could easily be good as well if they call. i will bet the turn alot here too if it bricks...but I would either raise or fold preflop

[/ QUOTE ]

At least one of those overs is definitely not a clean out.

And if it doesn't ruin his hand, it's an action-killer.

[/ QUOTE ]

im not saying shove if you make a pair. Against loose passive villians that would be more than enough sd value. We are in position, I would not mind a pair at all.

[Lego05]

I raise pre-flop most likely...or otherwise fold.


I think this is the first time I've ever said this, but I actually like the minraise on the turn there.


Wow that river sucks. I guess I fold but I'm not liking it.

[monkeymaps]

I dont think limping in pre is that bad here its not like we are goin to pick up many pots with a c-bet and loose passive oponents tend to go to far with their hands anyways so prob dont need a raise to encourage them to call big bets.

[members_only]

The thing is it's not really a min-raise because it's $10 more to UTG

[AZplaya]

wow I really hate a bet on the flop here. We have a villian who is known to slowplay UTG possibley waiting to c/r us off our hand. We have zero fold equity in a family pot like this. Yes it builds the pot but for what? With a fd on the board theres a good chance were drawing to 6 outs. Take the free card. Once you hit on the turn, your standard $25 fish isn't folding his hand with this much money in the pot so for gods sake shove over the top of mp's shove and watch him snap call with a fd. Then you can post this hand in bbv instead of folding the river and posting it here.

[Bigka79]

im disgusted by the min raise. then again i always am because i think a min raise is the worst play in the game. there is no need for this unless its getting you or ur last oponent all in.

raise it up to like 14-18ish area and charge a set to draw out. charge 2 pair to draw out. i dont like this play at all