Limping from SB in general

[Arcturus]

For the past two months, I have been "experimenting" by never raising from the small blind if folded around to except for one condition: the BB folds to preflop aggression a high percentage of the time. This means I don't raise my pocket pairs, my top pair hands, my suited connectors, or offsuited connectors.

So why am I doing this? Well, I read an article two months ago in a poker magazine that stated that not raising from the small blind preflop will not hurt you in the long run. In the grand scheme of poker, the times you "should" raise would be a small mistake compared to the times you do raise OOP and end up in a difficult situation with more money on the line causing a large mistake. It was a very interesting article.

I have read a lot of posts where people advocate raising from the SB with decent hands. However, top pair hands are tough to play when the BB calls or re-raises and you don't hit the flop. Medium pocket pairs and connectors in general are tough to play out of position.

I totally understand that every situation is unique and depends on reads and your opponents stats. So, I will say in absence of reads, do you lose a lot of value by limping from the SB against the BB? Has anyone ever thought about this or is currently following this same philosophy? I would be very interested in hearing comments about this.

[whyzze]

show me ur positional stats.

It all depends on BB imo. And not their so much their stats. But how much they fight for pots postflop.

[oneeyejak]

I found that a big leak in my game was that I was always limping in from the SB. I figured with a limper or two already in, I was getting good enough odds to justify a call. But, the vast majority of the time, it was limp/check/fold. That 1/2 BB added up a lot over time.

Now, if there are people in front of me, I'll lay down a lot of cards including: small pairs(but sometimes I'll raise with them), AX lower that AJ, some suited connectors, and definately hands like K10, QJ, etc...

It makes me feel awfully tight, but I avoid sticky situations OOP and I save that 1/2 BB.

If it folds to me in the SB, its a different story. I'll open up my range a bit and almost always raise when I bring it in, especially against a tight passive opponent who I'll usually raise a lot of junk in front of also.

My play when its folded to me in the SB is a lot like when its folded to me BTN. I'll raise with almost any two cards until people start playing back at me.

[Milky]

[ QUOTE ]
I found that a big leak in my game was that I was always limping in from the SB. I figured with a limper or two already in, I was getting good enough odds to justify a call. But, the vast majority of the time, it was limp/check/fold. That 1/2 BB added up a lot over time.

Now, if there are people in front of me, I'll lay down a lot of cards including: small pairs(but sometimes I'll raise with them), AX lower that AJ, some suited connectors, and definately hands like K10, QJ, etc...

It makes me feel awfully passive, but I avoid sticky situations OOP and I save that 1/2 BB.

If it folds to me in the SB, its a different story. I'll open up my range a bit and almost always raise when I bring it in, especially against a tight passive opponent who I'll usually raise a lot of junk in front of also.

My play when its folded to me in the SB is a lot like when its folded to me BTN. I'll raise with almost any two cards until people start playing back at me.

[/ QUOTE ]

While it's good to tighten up in the SB, you're tightening up WAY too much.

[Gigglegirl]

I play very loose passive from the blinds and limp a lot when given the opportunity.
I think it plays well in the micros where there are a lot of limped multiway pots and you're okay at hand reading and don't mind playing OOP. As you move up to 100NL and beyond, there is less chance to play an unraised pot of course.

I remember Pokey posted something about the advantages of playing this loose passively from SB although I don't have a link.
This is my blinds stats from all the micros games I've played.
http://i237.photobucket.com/albums/ff183/gigglegirlpoker/Blinds.jpg

[Arcturus]

[ QUOTE ]
show me ur positional stats.

[/ QUOTE ]

I considered doing this, but I don't multi-table so my sample size is very small (almost 4000 hands). Also, since my sample size is small, I can't make any convincing argument that it does work. However, if I compare my "Diff w/o Blind" numbers before and after I started doing this, I do see a difference. But, once again, the sample size is small.

[TTStrangler]

[ QUOTE ]
I remember Pokey posted something about the advantages of playing this loose passively from SB although I don't have a link.

[/ QUOTE ]

You may be referring to Pokey's day in the well (http://http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=7651827&page=0&fpart=all &vc=1).
He describes some interesting ways he plays out of the blinds, especially the SB.

Here's an excerpt, I'll quote it since the entire thread is pretty long:

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acidca said:
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Do you often pull any moves that are nonstandard?

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Pokey said:
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All the freakin' time. My most common "nonstandard" move is limping any crappy hand that amuses me in the SB. Another is open-completing the SB heads-up against the BB, which I will do with most of my hands (up to and including AA). Another is open-limping speculative hands from EP on a table of calling stations (which SHOULD be standard but isn't, because 2+2 dogma is too strong and people think open-limping makes the devil smile). Another is almost never three-betting unless I have to do so to isolate. On the flop, my most common "nonstandard" move is to B/3BAI with any monster and any good draw. Another nonstandard flop move (which SHOULD be standard) is to often use the right of first bluff to steal the pot from SB when the flop is all low cards (again, it helps that I complete any random crap -- it makes it much more likely that the 943 flop actually hit my hand). Another nonstandard move I make is calling huge overbets with good-not-great hands if the situation is right.


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There's also another related section in there where he discusses his unusual plays out of the blinds, you can do a find. Here's what to look for:

Pokey said:

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OMG, you probably don't want to follow my advice in blind play, because it's WAY weird.

I complete over 40% of my hands from the SB.

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