PNL Study Group Day 7: The REM Process "Intro" and "R is for Range" [Archive]

Onaflag

09-10-2007, 10:56 AM

Putting opponents on a range of hands is the most difficult thing for me to do. I don't know where to begin. For the first couple years in minbet poker I got caught up in the popular attempt to put someone on an exact hand. Then the next couple years in SNGs, I'd assign a range based on pretty much nothing in particular that consisted of "top 10%, top 13%, etc".

Does it just take observation over time to develop a feel for what a particular opponent may open with, or call with, or raise with?

To make it more confusing, its mentioned somewhere in the book that if a hand is possible, don't rule it out. Its too early in the morning to go find the book, but it was something like, if 85o makes the nuts and villain is betting strongly, reconsider your assigned range.

Maybe I just need more practice, but I understand I cannot calculate my equity without assinging a range. Then again, maybe its just the nature of the micros that makes this part difficult.

Onaflag.........

Matt Flynn

09-10-2007, 12:53 PM

Hand reading is tough because people are fairly random in what they play.

Biggest things are stuff like "he made a big bet on the turn after limping preflop" - usually that means a player has a big draw or a hand > top pair, and mostly a big hand.

retleftolc

09-10-2007, 12:56 PM

I think it is very interesting that the basic concepts are seemingly glossed over. Range is SO important.

Why is it that in every article or interview that Aba does he says NL is all about putting an opponent on a range of hands? He then says it’s about the E and M.

I realize that it’s a hard topic to discuss. It takes tons of experience to "know" what ranges to assign to different players. If one wants to become a better player, they must constantly assign ranges- in and out of hands.

Perhaps we could through some HH in here of typical situations and discuss how we arrive at the range for the specific opponent. I would start, but I have no access to PT right now.

Ret

Jzo19

09-10-2007, 01:14 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I think it is very interesting that the basic concepts are seemingly glossed over. Range is SO important.

Why is it that in every article or interview that Aba does he says NL is all about putting an opponent on a range of hands? He then says it’s about the E and M.

I realize that it’s a hard topic to discuss. It takes tons of experience to "know" what ranges to assign to different players. If one wants to become a better player, they must constantly assign ranges- in and out of hands.

Perhaps we could through some HH in here of typical situations and discuss how we arrive at the range for the specific opponent. I would start, but I have no access to PT right now.

Ret

[/ QUOTE ]

aba is pretty sick at note-taking , if youve watched his videos on cardrunners , you can see how many notes he takes in a small span of time , in about 20 min (playing HU) , he already has enough notes to tell about a persons playing style/tendencies and makes adjustments accordingly ...

traz

09-10-2007, 01:17 PM

What's the EM stand for?

Onaflag

09-10-2007, 01:18 PM

[ QUOTE ]
What's the EM stand for?

[/ QUOTE ]

Equity. Maximize.

Genz

09-10-2007, 03:14 PM

*grunch*

When it comes to hand reading, most tutorials are like: "you start with a bunch of hands, then you add and subtract from them." So they imply that you really go ahead and be like "55+, AJo+, ATs+, KQ, KJs" etc. etc. I find this pretty hard to do and often even confusing and misleading since I feel like I waste a lot of time on thinking about hands that don't matter, i.e. big broadways that miss.
In one of your examples, you state a range more like "any Ace, any K, any pair, set, draw, air", i.e. in a more general way. So how do you really go about that? How detailed is your thinking about individual holdings? Or do you just think of classes of hands (TP decent kicker, set, air) and try to remember the implications of hand distributions?

This really troubles me, because I find the detailed way ineffective and I can't learn things that I consider sub-optimal. Yet every theory posts repeats it although in praxis most people seem to think differently.

traz

09-10-2007, 03:25 PM

I haven't actually read the book, so this may not be relevant to the discussion, but it relates to the post above me.

I've never thought about how I approximate hand ranges while playing, but after the last post I thought about it a bit, and I think my though process is like this: If his complete range is a,b,c,x,y,z, I arrive at that range through:

What hands beat me that this player would take this line with on this board? a,b,c
What hands do I beat that this player would take this line with on this board? x,y,z
Are they all equally likely?

and then I do some super fast equity approximations and hopefully choose the right action /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

The more you think about it regularly, the more automatic it becomes. This may not matter at all, but I thought I'd try put my thoughts into words anyways :P

corsakh

09-10-2007, 03:37 PM

I am simply thinking in ranges of

- a draw (flush, straight, overcards)
- a monster (big over, two pair and better)
- strong one pair (small overpair, TPGK)
- weak one pair (TPNK, middle or underpair)
- air

This of course changes from player to player, for some players TPTK goes into weak hand category, some people think TPNK is a mosnter. Then I look at their stats, trends and how they played a hand and try to assign one of those ranges.

Sunny Mehta

09-10-2007, 04:00 PM

some good comments so far, and some good ideas about how to go about assigning ranges....I like retleftolc's idea that maybe a couple of y'all can post hands that you played where you were unsure of the range analysis....and we can all discuss it....you don't even have to give the whole hand if it's not pertinent - let's focus specifically on range assignment....

Sunny Mehta

09-10-2007, 04:05 PM

one more comment is that I personally narrow hand ranges by looking at very specific tendencies wrt lines....specific action (check/call, check/raise, lead/call, etc.), vpip, pfr, 3-bet frequency, c-bet frequency, how they play the turn in and out of position, how they play the river in and out of position, etc. are all key things which aid me in narrowing an opponent's range....

Matt Flynn

09-10-2007, 04:46 PM

Hi all,

I usually do it by feel until the turn. Then it's line analysis, like "he raised preflop, got three callers, bet flop, now half-pots turn against me alone." At that point I assign hands. When playing live I analyze physical cues too.

Matt

dubiousdrift

09-10-2007, 04:49 PM

traz, nice post!
One of the first board reading exercises that I did when I first started learning was to take two cards and a flop, then name all the hands that beat those two cards (similar to Ed Miller's 'Hidden Outs' exercises). While this was a great exercise and a real eye-opener that helps to tighten down a noob's pre-flop range, it also plants the 'monster under every bed' neurosis seed (or it did for me anyway). This commonly led to my misunderstanding of range as "the specific hands that beat me, one of which is sure to be in my opponent's hand"

Some of the things that I think of when I'm trying to put a person on a range now include:
1) Does this player play junk hands? Loose players who see 80% of flops *must* be playing all sorts of garbage including stuff like J3s - it's sooted, 95o - i could make a straight with it, K9o - I'm not dominated often enough for it to matter (or even better - what do you mean dominated).

2) Is the person aware of position, and do they play it. If so, what position are they in this hand. If not, no adjustments are necessary to widen the range for later positions. The person who routinely limps from the first three spots has no idea what position is.

3) Does the person limp a lot of hands, and only raise pre-flop occasionally? If they raised pre-flop, they probably don't have a set of 7's, but if you have a set of 7's, you can probably stack them on a A,K, or Q high flop.

Angel Largay's book contained a great collection of caricatures for various players of varying looseness and aggressiveness. Even if you don't agree with his strategies (opinions are varied here on 2+2), I think the psychology section is worth the price of the book - and it helps to be able assign people around the table an archetype of 'former football star', 'curmudgeon', 'the wife is shopping and we are trying to out-spend each other'.

Mostly however, I think this is a slowly acquired skill and that the more I actively observe, pay attention and devote 'effortful study' to putting people on ranges, the better I get - But I still have much road to cover.

Disconnected

09-10-2007, 07:27 PM

One of the difficult things about ranging opponents for me is that I usually bias ranges on what I would do, even for a player that doesn't have similar stats to me. I mean, I know I shouldn't do that, and being aware of it, I lessen the problem, but sometimes it's really difficult to put poor players on ranges at the micros (and I try to avoid the good players)...you don't see them enough, and guys with similar stats can still have different ranges.

I try to compensate by using the techniques mentioned in a couple different posts, of seeing what specific action they take with various types of hands. I don't think that I do a great job of it, but I do think that's the way to go, at least until you start running into the same players on a more frequent basis than I run into my opponents now.

retleftolc

09-11-2007, 12:37 AM

Since I spoke up I'll try one . . .

A dry one- Vill is 44/13/1.35 over 136 hands.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (5 handed) Hand History Converter Tool (http://poker-tools.flopturnriver.com/Hand-Converter.php) from FlopTurnRiver.com (http://www.flopturnriver.com) (Format: 2+2 Forums)

MP ($24.50)
Hero ($37.75)
SB ($34.60)
BB ($49.85)
UTG ($16)

Preflop: Hero is Button with K/images/graemlins/spade.gif, A/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
2 folds, Hero raises to $1, 1 fold, BB calls $0.75.

Flop: ($2.10) 7/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 5/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, K/images/graemlins/club.gif (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $1.5, BB calls $1.50.

Assign a range.

I know this is a sad starter, but I searched my database(which made me sad- I suck, good thing others suck more) for others and had a hard time finding good ones. Probably because im tired.

Ret

Jamougha

09-11-2007, 12:51 AM

Any one pair better than 44 and worse than AA, a set, any 2 pair, 86s, 64s, 98s.

traz

09-11-2007, 12:56 AM

yea his range is hella wide, and you're ahead of most of it

retleftolc

09-11-2007, 01:02 AM

OK. Its a start. Somebody find a better example and submit for review.

Ret

stickNmove

09-11-2007, 01:06 AM

Deleted last hand because it was probably a poor example.

Don't have exact tracker numbers because I am getting the HH from my email at work. The guy was fairly loose (~41 percent of flops) and I had seen him go for his entire stack with j10 on a 10 high board and q9 on a 9 high board - both of which were no way co-ordinated.

Poker Stars - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.25/$0.50 Blinds - 5 Players - (LegoPoker (http://www.legopoker.com) Hand History Converter (http://www.legopoker.com/hh))

SB: $47.75
Hero (BB): $106.55
UTG: $42.30
CO: $50.45
BTN: $49.95

Preflop: Hero is dealt xs xh (5 Players)
UTG raises to $2.00, 3 folds, Hero calls $1.50

Flop: ($4.25) 8/images/graemlins/diamond.gif 2/images/graemlins/diamond.gif 9/images/graemlins/club.gif (2 Players)
Hero checks, UTG bets $3.50, Hero calls $3.50

Turn: ($11.25) T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (2 Players)
Hero checks, UTG checks

Pot Size: $11.25

retleftolc

09-11-2007, 01:21 AM

Deleted because posted hand was deleted

clowntable

09-11-2007, 01:28 AM

[ QUOTE ]
One of the difficult things about ranging opponents for me is that I usually bias ranges on what I would do, even for a player that doesn't have similar stats to me. I mean, I know I shouldn't do that, and being aware of it, I lessen the problem, but sometimes it's really difficult to put poor players on ranges at the micros (and I try to avoid the good players)...you don't see them enough, and guys with similar stats can still have different ranges.

I try to compensate by using the techniques mentioned in a couple different posts, of seeing what specific action they take with various types of hands. I don't think that I do a great job of it, but I do think that's the way to go, at least until you start running into the same players on a more frequent basis than I run into my opponents now.

[/ QUOTE ]
One thing I write down in my notes very often is if a given player is an "Ace hunter" and/or a "flush hunter". Helps to not lose as much on cbeting into A high boards and calling bets once a flush hits

I pretty much use the same thought process as traz. What beats me and would play like this/what doesn't beat me and would play like this. Then I kinda weight it by what I think the player is capable of (i.e. supernit might raise a set that beats my TP but not a draw that doesn't) and that's about it.

jeffnc

09-11-2007, 09:40 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Loose players who see 80% of flops *must* be playing all sorts of garbage including stuff like J3s - it's sooted, 95o - i could make a straight with it, K9o - I'm not dominated often enough for it to matter (or even better - what do you mean dominated).

[/ QUOTE ]

No, even better - K2o - I might flop a pair of kings! That is the depth of thinking, literally, and in some games, that is kick ass because everyone else is playing J3 and 95 and middle pair is the nuts, so a flop of KJ9 you are starting to think about felting someone. The guy with the jacks knows the raisor is just bluffing that K.

4_2_it

09-11-2007, 10:09 AM

As for pre-flop, I assign the same range (which is wide) to the best and worst players at the table. The unimaginative weak tight ones that probably break even and the 15/2 rocks are the only ones worth trying to narrow down pre-flop.

wallenborn

09-11-2007, 12:37 PM

That's an often overlooked point: preflop and postflop ranges can be uncorrelated. Some players have a wide preflop range, but a straightforward postflop play. Others can be put on narrow preflop ranges, but their postflop play doesn't give you much information. If you think: "It's impossible to put these donkeys on a hand," well, these donkeys might call a preflop raise with 32s, but on the flop they often tell you exactly what they have.

ABCofPKR

09-11-2007, 03:21 PM

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool (http://poker-tools.flopturnriver.com/Hand-Converter.php) from FlopTurnRiver.com (http://www.flopturnriver.com) (Format: 2+2 Forums)

SB ($32)
BB ($34.60)
UTG ($66.15)
Hero ($24.90)
CO ($15)
Button ($31.95)

Preflop: Hero is MP with K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, K/images/graemlins/club.gif. CO posts a blind of $0.35.
1 fold, Hero raises to $1.25, CO (poster) calls $1, 3 folds.

Flop: ($2.95) Q/images/graemlins/club.gif, T/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 2/images/graemlins/spade.gif (2 players)
Hero bets $2, CO calls $2.

Turn: ($6.95) 7/images/graemlins/spade.gif (2 players)
Hero bets $4, CO raises to $11.65, Hero calls ??

what is the range of my villain?

45/18/0.93 180hands

ABCofPKR

09-11-2007, 04:01 PM

I put him on:

- donkey because posted the blind out of time

- got some medium hand like: A8+, K9+, suited connectors, pocket pairs. KQ, QJ, QT... he didnt reraise pre flop, so he cant has AA, KK, QQ(assumig he is not a freak, what seems to be).

- on the flop I made my standard c-bet(value bet) and he called. at this moment I put him on a draw(89s, J9o and hands like that) or KQ, AT and hands like these. He didnt raise me on the flop, so I can start assuming he hasn't QT, QQ or TT... maybe 99, JJ(btw, JJ starts to enter on the range of hands he would have me raised pre flop).

- the draw HEATS. now WHAT? I think its pretty weak checking the turn and let him draw free for the river. so I bet and he insta shoves...

- now WHAT?

What hands beat me that this player would take this line with on this board? a,b,c
What hands do I beat that this player would take this line with on this board? x,y,z

Shocker101

09-11-2007, 09:43 PM

On the turn when he raises you can put him from two pair flush to a flush draw to nothing. Hard to get away from the hand put it in you are still ahead of his range.

Bauz

09-12-2007, 02:45 AM

with an aggression factor this low they show up with a flush most of the time (at least in my games).

RobertJohn

09-12-2007, 07:52 AM

Here's a hand that I analyzed recently by assigning a calling range for my opponent if I were to shove and used Pokerstove to calculate my equity against it. Hopefully you guys could provide comments on the positive/negative aspects of it. DISCLAIMER: preflop is probably bad.

EXAMPLE HAND:

Poker Stars
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.25/$0.50
6 players
Converter (http://www.neildewhurst.com/hand-converter)

Stack sizes:
UTG: $41.25
Hero: $42.50
CO: $83.70
Button: $89.15
SB: $32.35
BB: $28.20

Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is UTG+1 with 8/images/graemlins/spade.gif 6/images/graemlins/spade.gif
UTG calls, Hero raises to $2, 4 folds, UTG calls.

Flop: 9/images/graemlins/spade.gif 3/images/graemlins/diamond.gif 7/images/graemlins/heart.gif ($4.75, 2 players)
UTG checks, Hero bets $3.5, UTG raises to $9 . . .

I haven't played many hands with this villain so I can't get a good read on his check-raising range.

However, up to this point I had been playing pretty aggressively and so I thought besides his obvious big hands he might also check-raise here sometimes as a bluff.

If he calls my jam, he might have something like:

9c9s,9d9s,9h9s,88-77,33,A9s,K9s,T8s,98s,97s, and A9o.

This range consists of:

A few combos of top set, middle and bottom set, top two, a couple combos of T8, the strongest top pairs, and occasionally he will have played a really weird overpair. He also might sometimes stacks off with second pair: 88.

My equity in this case is around 34%.

Given that I have 34% equity when called, he has to fold here greater than 30% of the time for me to start showing a profit on a shove.

Questions:

a) with such little info to act on, is it reasonable to assume that my opponent will fold > 30% of the time with this action sequence?
b) what is a decent estimate of an average opponent's check-raising range on this board with this preflop/flop action?
c) if I do shove, is the calling range I've assigned to my opponent a decent one?

Any comments on my assumptions or methods would be great.

Tre976

09-12-2007, 10:20 AM

I'd put him on A9,K9,q9,j9,109,88,A7 or possibly 1010,108,98
The CR to $9 - to me - seems that he wants to end the hand now.

NL Newbie

09-12-2007, 11:46 AM

[ QUOTE ]
PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool (http://poker-tools.flopturnriver.com/Hand-Converter.php) from FlopTurnRiver.com (http://www.flopturnriver.com) (Format: 2+2 Forums)

SB ($32)
BB ($34.60)
UTG ($66.15)
Hero ($24.90)
CO ($15)
Button ($31.95)

Preflop: Hero is MP with K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, K/images/graemlins/club.gif. CO posts a blind of $0.35.
1 fold, Hero raises to $1.25, CO (poster) calls $1, 3 folds.

Flop: ($2.95) Q/images/graemlins/club.gif, T/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 2/images/graemlins/spade.gif (2 players)
Hero bets $2, CO calls $2.

Turn: ($6.95) 7/images/graemlins/spade.gif (2 players)
Hero bets $4, CO raises to $11.65, Hero calls ??

what is the range of my villain?

45/18/0.93 180hands

[/ QUOTE ]

Heres my take on the analysis of this hand, something which im working on.

I may be wrong, so dont take it for gospel.

So his range is wide on the flop, we can bet for value/take pot down. +EV bet.

[/b]Turn analysis:[/b]

Now here its probably wise to do two things, first give him a VERY TIGHT RANGE followed by a more optimistic/wider range.

Tight range:
Flush (9s8s will do for pokerstove, a flush is a flush and we have no redraw anyway so its fine)
Sets(QQ/TT/22)
2pair but ONLY WITH REDRAW TO FLUSH, Qs or Ts).

Poker stove raw range: QQ,TT,22,9s8s,QcTs,QdTs,QhTs,QsTc,QsTd,QsTh

Equity here: 7%

Wider Range
Same as tight range but we add others now.
2pair without redraws(QTo),
TPTK+Redraw,
TPTK+no redraw

Stove range: QQ,TT,22,AQs,AQo,QTo

Equity here: 37% (<2:1 required).

Now if we interpolate this range of %7 to 37% and look at our pot odds.

$7 pot + $4 bet + $12 shove =$23 vs $8 to call. 3:1 pot odds.

Optimistic range, easy call.
Tight range, Easy fold.

However the wider range isnt very wide, due to the line he took i feel he has FD alot more than say KQ here hence i discounted KQ to add more weight to flush.

So i dont mind a fold or call in this spot due to odds, however you will see a flush alot. Will it be more that 3 out of 4 times?

boardertj

09-15-2007, 11:03 PM

So did the study group die? There is no longer a sticky at the top of the forum and I see no discussion of day 8 yet... I think the Equity and Maximization discussions would be very useful and SPR as well. Lets not let this die uNL!

inverted

09-16-2007, 06:59 AM

I actually think that this range is the most important, it hasn't really had much input though. The equity chapter seemed quite straight forward and Maximization obviously relies on the range. So it's a shame that this chapter hasn't been covered very thoughtfully.

Monster207

09-16-2007, 02:33 PM

I really hope this gets going again. I thoroughly enjoyed the book and I feel that range is quite important. I was really hoping to get some help on creating effective SPR's when at a 6max table. I find myself using the REM process much more effectively which is nice but I'd really like to work on the SPR concept. (once the REM section is done obviously)

Matt Flynn

09-16-2007, 05:05 PM

we're still here. a ton going on and Sunny's been on a cruise. E/M, commmitment threshold and SPR still to come. dunno who unstickied the sticky.

QTip

09-17-2007, 08:36 AM

[ QUOTE ]
we're still here. a ton going on and Sunny's been on a cruise. E/M, commmitment threshold and SPR still to come. dunno who unstickied the sticky.

[/ QUOTE ]

Would a mod be resticky the thread?

QTip

09-17-2007, 04:42 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
we're still here. a ton going on and Sunny's been on a cruise. E/M, commmitment threshold and SPR still to come. dunno who unstickied the sticky.

[/ QUOTE ]

Would a mod be resticky the thread?

[/ QUOTE ]

shyturtle27

09-17-2007, 05:08 PM

Why is this not stickied?

Monster207

09-17-2007, 05:26 PM

Sticky...? hello?

QTip

09-17-2007, 06:49 PM

Maybe someone can use that alert modifier thingy...I can never find that link.

jtr

09-20-2007, 01:01 PM

[ QUOTE ]

Tight range:
Flush (9s8s will do for pokerstove, a flush is a flush and we have no redraw anyway so its fine)

[/ QUOTE ]

Newbie, I like your idea here, but I think that letting 9s8s stand in for all possible flushes in the pokerstove analysis is a big mistake. He would obviously play all flushes pretty much the same way, and there are a large number of other flushes he could have. Therefore a bigger part of both the tight range and the optimistic range will be flushes, and your equity calculations will shift accordingly.

shyturtle27

09-21-2007, 06:25 PM

Bump for sticky.

itWASaDREAM

09-21-2007, 07:42 PM

bump for continued strategy talk, not sticky...

icheckcallu

10-09-2007, 03:08 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Since I spoke up I'll try one . . .

A dry one- Vill is 44/13/1.35 over 136 hands.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (5 handed) Hand History Converter Tool (http://poker-tools.flopturnriver.com/Hand-Converter.php) from FlopTurnRiver.com (http://www.flopturnriver.com) (Format: 2+2 Forums)

MP ($24.50)
Hero ($37.75)
SB ($34.60)
BB ($49.85)
UTG ($16)

Preflop: Hero is Button with K/images/graemlins/spade.gif, A/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
2 folds, Hero raises to $1, 1 fold, BB calls $0.75.

Flop: ($2.10) 7/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 5/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, K/images/graemlins/club.gif (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $1.5, BB calls $1.50.

Assign a range.

I know this is a sad starter, but I searched my database(which made me sad- I suck, good thing others suck more) for others and had a hard time finding good ones. Probably because im tired.

Ret

[/ QUOTE ]

his range here is pretty wide and you will narrow his range when u bet again on the turn. AGAIN aba o rgalfond i forgot which one once said that villains range changes when the turn card is dealt.

brinan

10-11-2007, 06:26 PM

Let's add some substance (albeit derived from a small sample).

A) Range analysis (using Holdem Manager and Excel) based on:
1 Sample of hands played by "winning" players during August.
2 Specifically, those players whose pre-flop raising frequency is >12.7% and <= 15.1% (percentage range represents mid 30% percentile).
3 Hands all involved 6 players playing $1-$2 no-limit at 6-max tables located at one particular site.

B) Estimated Range Distribution for Big Blind Position
1 Pre Flop Raise (7%, VPIP 14%)
45%.........88+
40%.........AJ+
11%.........KJ+
4%..........other

2 Re-raise (5.3%)
50%.........99+
42%.........AQ+
5%..........KQ
3%..........other

3 Cold Call (11.3%)
25%.........88-22
24%.........AJs-A2s
21%.........J9s+, T8s+, 97s+, 86s+, 75s+, JT-76o
=70%
12%.........KJs+, KQo
8%..........AQ-ATo
4%..........JJ-99
7%..........other

C) Usage
1 Analysis repeated as more hands come in (and this helps to embed into memory).
2 Starting point where players fitting profile unknown.
3 Ranges individualised as players fitting profile become known.

D) Note
1 Sample size for this profile is 30 "winning" players (minimum number of hands for each player is 1,000).
2 Analysis carried out for other positions, and for upper/lower 35% percentiles.
3 Not claiming calculations are error free, nor analysis devoid of improvement.

D) Finally
Point being made is you do not have to rely on your own experience.