Moving up... stats check.

[WarhammerIIC]

Okay, well I've made enough to move up to 50NL, but I thought I would post my stats to see if there is any major flaws/leaks I should be worried that would keep me from staying on this track one level up. I'm thinking that I play a little too tight and passive, especially on the turn and river, and that I don't raise enough/play too many hands in early position. Thoughts?

BTW, yeah, yeah, I know there are some FR stats... sorry, I play both. Kill me.

http://yeltzen.tripod.com/poker/ptstats082907small.jpg

http://yeltzen.tripod.com/poker/ptpositionstats082907.jpg

http://yeltzen.tripod.com/poker/pokergraph082907nosn.jpg

[CmnDwnWrkn]

I think a solid TAG strategy works best at NL50, so if you are between 15 and 18 VPIP, that is a good range.

Raise more preflop - a PF raise percentage that is half of your VPIP is too small IMO. Also, try to get your turn and river AF a bit higher. If your total agression factor gets to about 3, I think that is a good solid number

[Gelford]

Your vpip/pfr gap is a wee bit large to my taste, but ok you make money

What strikes me is that you can see that your Won$WSF is a bit on the low side ... this might easily be linked to the high vpip gap .... BUT !

You Won$@SD is very high, so basically that is happening is that you are seeing a lot of cheap flops but getting paid off big when you hit.


At some point, you are going to get punished for this approach, but whether that will happen at 50NL is another thing ... hehe /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[WarhammerIIC]

[ QUOTE ]
Your vpip/pfr gap is a wee bit large to my taste, but ok you make money

What strikes me is that you can see that your Won$WSF is a bit on the low side ... this might easily be linked to the high vpip gap .... BUT !

You Won$@SD is very high, so basically that is happening is that you are seeing a lot of cheap flops but getting paid off big when you hit.


At some point, you are going to get punished for this approach, but whether that will happen at 50NL is another thing ... hehe /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[/ QUOTE ]
That's a good point, and I didn't even think of that. I have a feeling I will get destroyed at either 100NL or 200NL (assuming I make it that far) if I don't change that, but I might be okay at 50NL. I don't think I'll be able to see nearly as many flops as cheaply as I have at those levels.

[Gelford]

Destroyed is perhaps a bit on the dramatic side, but as you move up, it does become a fight for the initiative, so passively splashing around becomes more and more turbulent and difficult ... but don't be afraid of higher stakes, 100NL is not where you encounter aba and cts /images/graemlins/smile.gif

GL Warhammer /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Disconnected]

It would be better to see your positional stats without the full ring hands mixed in there, because it looks like you're limping a lot first in, which is probably something you'll need to stop as you move up levels (not sure if it will hurt you so bad at 50NL), because otherwise you'll get isolated by the TAGs and LAGs on your left, and playing raise pots OOP sucks.

Also, you'll probably want to look at raising your steal percentage a bit, which would also bump up your PFR. As mentioned, your turn and river aggression looks low, and also your turn aggression is lower than your river aggression. I don't know if that's bad, but it's not something that you usually see, and you might want to dig into some hands and examine how that came to be.

Nice graph, though /images/graemlins/smile.gif.

[WarhammerIIC]

[ QUOTE ]
It would be better to see your positional stats without the full ring hands mixed in there, because it looks like you're limping a lot first in, which is probably something you'll need to stop as you move up levels (not sure if it will hurt you so bad at 50NL), because otherwise you'll get isolated by the TAGs and LAGs on your left, and playing raise pots OOP sucks.

Also, you'll probably want to look at raising your steal percentage a bit, which would also bump up your PFR. As mentioned, your turn and river aggression looks low, and also your turn aggression is lower than your river aggression. I don't know if that's bad, but it's not something that you usually see, and you might want to dig into some hands and examine how that came to be.

Nice graph, though /images/graemlins/smile.gif.

[/ QUOTE ]
TY sir. Here's my 6-max only stats.

http://yeltzen.tripod.com/poker/ptpositionstats082907short.jpg

[XHitman014]

I saw that the steal % was low also...is that calculation based off being the initial PF raiser from CO/BU? Since a lot of people limp in NL25 that could be the reason. I don't love raising up limp-callers with marginal holdings against players that refuse to fold if they hit their TPWK.

[bozzer]

raise more in late position.

raise more in general /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Gigglegirl]

Small sample but you're losing UTG in 6max. You shouldn't lose money in any position that isn't a blind, otherwise you'd be better off folding every single hand in that position.
You're playing 12/6 there. What is your raise/limp range here?
If you're limp/folding to a late position raise here a lot, that's a big leak.
The higher you go, the less you'll be able to see a flop just limping UTG.

[WarhammerIIC]

[ QUOTE ]
Small sample but you're losing UTG in 6max. You shouldn't lose money in any position that isn't a blind, otherwise you'd be better off folding every single hand in that position.
You're playing 12/6 there. What is your raise/limp range here?
If you're limp/folding to a late position raise here a lot, that's a big leak.
The higher you go, the less you'll be able to see a flop just limping UTG.

[/ QUOTE ]
Good catch. I was limping a lot here with low/medium pocket pairs. I have corrected that recently and I'm raising with those hands almost all the time.

[bung]

open up your range more, open raise many more hands, steal more blinds, be more aggressive post-flop (esp 6max), showdown a touch less (small sample I know).

Do you open-limp a lot in ep?

[WarhammerIIC]

[ QUOTE ]
open up your range more, open raise many more hands, steal more blinds, be more aggressive post-flop (esp 6max), showdown a touch less (small sample I know).

Do you open-limp a lot in ep?

[/ QUOTE ]
A lot more than I originally thought, yes. Looking at the difference between my small/medium PP and SC hands when I limp and when I raise is pretty crazy.

[bung]

you can even raise 22 UTG. You'll take down the blinds often enough, and when you don't, a c-bet HU will usually do the trick. If the pot is multi-way and you flop a set....$$$

[WarhammerIIC]

[ QUOTE ]
you can even raise 22 UTG. You'll take down the blinds often enough, and when you don't, a c-bet HU will usually do the trick. If the pot is multi-way and you flop a set....$$$

[/ QUOTE ]
Yep, I've been realizing that lately and my stats are at least slightly better over the last week or so.

[Disconnected]

[ QUOTE ]
I saw that the steal % was low also...is that calculation based off being the initial PF raiser from CO/BU? Since a lot of people limp in NL25 that could be the reason. I don't love raising up limp-callers with marginal holdings against players that refuse to fold if they hit their TPWK.

[/ QUOTE ]

A steal is when you open-raise from CO, BTN, or SB. If someone limps and you raise, it's not a steal. The steal % is based on number of opportunities to steal, as well (some of the other PFR-related stats are based on total number of hands).

[Tuff Enuff]

I'm a noob so dont take this the wrong way but,is 500 your roll? 10 buy in's seems a little risky. Most people say 20 BI's for each level. Do you feel your game is ready or are you just taking a shot to see how you do?

[TheSalche]

I think you need to play a lot more hands at 25 before moving up, this sample is pretty damn small.

[maciczka]

UTG is your leak. Your range either is to wide or YOu limp tooooooooo often. Also Your attempted to steal blinds % is to less. Perfectly is at least 30%.

[Spanky1974]

[ QUOTE ]
I think you need to play a lot more hands at 25 before moving up, this sample is pretty damn small.

[/ QUOTE ]

[WarhammerIIC]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm a noob so dont take this the wrong way but,is 500 your roll? 10 buy in's seems a little risky. Most people say 20 BI's for each level. Do you feel your game is ready or are you just taking a shot to see how you do?

[/ QUOTE ]
My roll is $1000 now. I started with $500 of my own cash money. Now I've made $500 more.

[Micro Donk]

id just stay at 25NL, build a more solid roll/idea of winrate before i took shots at 50NL. but im a bigger nit with a roll then most

[WarhammerIIC]

[ QUOTE ]
id just stay at 25NL, build a more solid roll/idea of winrate before i took shots at 50NL. but im a bigger nit with a roll then most

[/ QUOTE ]
After having a day to consider it, this is probably what I'm going to do. I think I was just excited to hit $500. This thread helped bring me back down to earth, so it definitely worked. Thanks all.

[Spanky1974]

I won't play $50NL without $1500+, but I'm prone to tilt and running bad. The way I would look at my bankroll in this case, is that I can play another 10K hands at $25NL (2-3 weeks) and will have that $500+ padding in my bankroll for taking a shot at $50NL. My bankroll definitely grows faster than my skill.

[LethargicMule]

[ QUOTE ]
I think a solid TAG strategy works best at NL50, so if you are between 15 and 18 VPIP, that is a good range.

Raise more preflop - a PF raise percentage that is half of your VPIP is too small IMO. Also, try to get your turn and river AF a bit higher. If your total agression factor gets to about 3, I think that is a good solid number

[/ QUOTE ]

Why are these solid numbers? honestly I think people heard AF 3 and 18/16 is gold but never really thought why this would be good at microstakes.

[Lego05]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I think a solid TAG strategy works best at NL50, so if you are between 15 and 18 VPIP, that is a good range.

Raise more preflop - a PF raise percentage that is half of your VPIP is too small IMO. Also, try to get your turn and river AF a bit higher. If your total agression factor gets to about 3, I think that is a good solid number

[/ QUOTE ]

Why are these solid numbers? honestly I think people heard AF 3 and 18/16 is gold but never really thought why this would be good at microstakes.

[/ QUOTE ]


When you're going to disagree with something that has been working very well for people you generally need to supply the reasons why you disagree...not the other way around. 90+% of the larger winning players in this forum could send you their stats and it would be similar to those numbers.

I'm about 20/17.5/3.5

~5.7 over my last 72,000 hands
I don't know exactly what it is but I know I'm over 4.2 over my last 120,000 hands or so.



Probably leaks but not too bad.

[WarhammerIIC]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I think a solid TAG strategy works best at NL50, so if you are between 15 and 18 VPIP, that is a good range.

Raise more preflop - a PF raise percentage that is half of your VPIP is too small IMO. Also, try to get your turn and river AF a bit higher. If your total agression factor gets to about 3, I think that is a good solid number

[/ QUOTE ]

Why are these solid numbers? honestly I think people heard AF 3 and 18/16 is gold but never really thought why this would be good at microstakes.

[/ QUOTE ]


When you're going to disagree with something that has been working very well for people you generally need to supply the reasons why you disagree...not the other way around. 90+% of the larger winning players in this forum could send you their stats and it would be similar to those numbers.

I'm about 20/17.5/3.5

~5.7 over my last 72,000 hands
I don't know exactly what it is but I know I'm over 4.2 over my last 120,000 hands or so.

Probably leaks but not too bad.

[/ QUOTE ]
I'm not really too high on the "your stats have to be X, X, and X" mentality. Unless there is a serious reason why your stats need to be that way, I don't buy it. Most people just see someone else's stats, see they're winning, and assume you have to have those stats to win.

[shat4brains]

how many tables do you play?

i think ur a little to nitty i like my stats to be like 21/18 but ur style is winning albeit a small sample so if thats what ur comfortable with than by all means stick to it but keep in mind that style will no longer be profitable as you progress in limits and come across better players. 6k hands means absolutely nothing. i have lost 20 buy ins before in 6k hands and im a winning player so i deff wouldnt move up until u have 25-30k hands.

[Gelford]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I think a solid TAG strategy works best at NL50, so if you are between 15 and 18 VPIP, that is a good range.

Raise more preflop - a PF raise percentage that is half of your VPIP is too small IMO. Also, try to get your turn and river AF a bit higher. If your total agression factor gets to about 3, I think that is a good solid number

[/ QUOTE ]

Why are these solid numbers? honestly I think people heard AF 3 and 18/16 is gold but never really thought why this would be good at microstakes.

[/ QUOTE ]


When you're going to disagree with something that has been working very well for people you generally need to supply the reasons why you disagree...not the other way around. 90+% of the larger winning players in this forum could send you their stats and it would be similar to those numbers.

I'm about 20/17.5/3.5

~5.7 over my last 72,000 hands
I don't know exactly what it is but I know I'm over 4.2 over my last 120,000 hands or so.

Probably leaks but not too bad.

[/ QUOTE ]
I'm not really too high on the "your stats have to be X, X, and X" mentality. Unless there is a serious reason why your stats need to be that way, I don't buy it. Most people just see someone else's stats, see they're winning, and assume you have to have those stats to win.

[/ QUOTE ]

Warhammer, you'll be fine .. good luck mate (and 18/16 with an AF of only 3 .... now that is meh,but it is all about balance, but if you have a good balance, practically every vpip up to at LEAST 30 can be played at any level)

[Klopzi]

I think moving up to $50 NL is fine if:

1. You don't mind moving back down to $25 NL if you lose a buy-in or two at $50 NL.

2. You feel comfortable with your game. By this, I mean that you generally know what you want to accomplish with your hands. And you rarely (or at least not regularly) find yourself in situations where you go: "Uh oh, he jammed...what do I do now?"

In the end, you really should just give $50 NL a shot. Trust me, you'll be back and forth between $25 NL and $50 NL at least two or three times before the jump becomes permanent.

Good luck.