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View Full Version : [50NL] Is he taking me to valuetown?


ciro bonano
08-24-2007, 07:56 AM
No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (6 handed)

SB ($16.80)
BB ($8.90)
UTG ($41.95)
MP ($62.70)
Hero ($49.00)
Button ($62.45)

Preflop: Hero is CO with A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
UTG calls $0.50, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $2.25</font>, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, UTG calls $1.75.

Flop: ($5.25) 5/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 6/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 6/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
UTG checks, Hero checks.

Turn: ($5.25) A/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
UTG checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $4</font>, UTG calls $4.

River: ($13.25) 5/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">UTG bets $6.5</font>, Hero...

Villain is 65/18/1.67 over 50 hands. So he's not overly aggressive, given his VPIP, and I'm not beating much (some draws missed), but I'm getting 3:1 and haven't played my hand strongly. Should I call this?

(I usually cbet this flop, but checked behind this time because it's not very likely I hit this board)

VivaHate
08-24-2007, 08:00 AM
Firstly I c-bet 100% of the time here.
As played I call here, you beat any weaker ace, any busted draw, also he might think you were stealing on the turn and has decided to bluff the river. The fact that he's a donk makes the call easier against a solid player it's a tougher decision.

whiteladder81
08-24-2007, 08:00 AM
probably, but I still call. You have to bet the flop.

Panic__NL
08-24-2007, 08:10 AM
considering oyur line and the odds you get this is a call.
Not cbetting is not bad, the flop has likely missed you so you wont get Villian to fold a lot of hands that beat you.

lanolin
08-24-2007, 08:18 AM
It is possible that he's taking you to value town, but there are also other possibilities.

For vlaue town he's got to have some kind of suited connector with a 5 or 6 or Ax, Kxs where x = 5 or 6. Or as a long shot possibility he hit his quads.

The other possibilities are that he has some kind of medium/low pair not 55 or 66 and thinks that you're turn bet was just a scare card bluff, Ax, x != 5 or 6 and he thinks it might be best, or just a bluff (even with passive players there is always a percentage chance they are on a bluff *) like a busted flush / straight draw or some high cards.

All in all, you're getting 3:1 on your hand, so unless you think that it's more than 75% likely that he slowplayed you w/ a 6, AK or even AA, or hit his third 5 on the river you're gonna have to call. I think the hand was played fine, I don't mind the check on this flop, and I would definitely call for value.

* note: Harrington often uses a 10% minimum chance that his opponents are bluffing. In cash games this would likely be lower, and your villain hasn't been overly aggro, but it is 6 handed, and he hasn't been overly passive either.

.xxxx.
08-24-2007, 08:18 AM
easy river call given turn wasn't a RR, river is a block bet for a weaker A/mid pair/bluff attempt

traz
08-24-2007, 10:47 AM
bet flop bet turn

HoldEmNewby
08-24-2007, 10:54 AM
cbet flop.

Is anyone mini raising this river?

samwallistea
08-24-2007, 11:00 AM
Bet flop and you avoid this kinda situation as you will have a much clearer idea of his hand strength and will get him to fold air. There a lot more reasons to cbet, you need to do it more, particularly in situations like this

corsakh
08-24-2007, 11:02 AM
This is hardly a town, some hermit village at best.

And fix your location please.

filsteal
08-24-2007, 11:23 AM
As played, river is a definite call.

You absolutely have to bet this flop. Given that you don't have a made hand, you have an obscene amount of equity here against villain's range.

Daniel LeClaire
08-24-2007, 11:40 AM
I call this all day. Odds are too good to fold. He could be trying to push you off a split pot or be betting a pair, thinking he has a better two pair.

Panic__NL
08-24-2007, 12:55 PM
what will Villian fold that beats us when we cbet here?
He probably will assume that we missed the flop and will call likewise.
I think you must pick your cbet spot instead of automaticly hit the bet button when a flop appears. We dont cbet cause people say we should, we cbet cause we are representing a hand better than Villians holdings and want him to fold the best hand. On a flop like this against a villian like this that is very questionable.

Kasane
08-24-2007, 03:14 PM
cbetting this flop is a must. We have fantastic equity on the flop, and wouldn't mind getting it in right there against a doofus who might just go all in with an overpair that we've got positive equity on. Or, conversely, we might fold out that hand. We also build a pot in case we hit, disguise our hand somewhat...

On the turn, our equity is likely to take a dive -- and we'll have to call a bet in a lot of cases. We can check behind turn or bet again if we bet the flop for the same or less cost to hit our hand.