another tough spot. JJ utg against loose raiser

[cb4mvp]

First time tangling against this guy. No reads at the time, but he had stats of 29/24/3 over just 41 hands. I didn't really want to play this hand oop, so I 4 bet him. I think my sizing was off, no? Maybe not by much, but looking back I'm thinking $8.50 might have been better. And I'm totally lost on the flop. Could I be up against a worse hand here? It doesn't feel like it. Anyway, plz help here. I've been getting in alot of spots like this lately and I think I have a big leak in these reraised pots. Definitely need some assistance here.



PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool (http://poker-tools.flopturnriver.com/Hand-Converter.php) from FlopTurnRiver.com (http://www.flopturnriver.com) (Format: 2+2 Forums)

BB ($25)
UTG ($35.25)
Hero ($29.15)
CO ($54.55)
Button ($31.35)
SB ($27.70)

Preflop: Hero is MP with J/images/graemlins/spade.gif, J/images/graemlins/heart.gif.
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $1</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Button raises to $3</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $7.5</font>, Button calls $4.50.

Flop: ($15.35) 4/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 6/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 5/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $8.95</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Button raises to $17.9</font>, Hero...

[Spurious]

Push allin. I think he got 88-QQ.

[cooker3]

I prefer a call pf for set value, playing this oop is tough. I make it 8 pf but your 4 bets shouldn't be that large in anyway.
Seeing as this is the first hand against this opponant I probably just c/f but some other reads would be nice, does he 3 bet a lot? has he 3 bet light? is he aggro post flop?
Depending on the answer to this, I would change my mind on what to do

[sanoxx]

Hi all,

This is my first post here after reading the forum a lot, and I hope I won't say many stupid things, despite being good at it!

As for the hand, I think you are behind.
First, even though he's a semi-lag, you have to give him credit for a hand after 3betting and calling the 4bet, even if the 3-bets light.
Secondly, by 4-betting, you practically gave away your hand : big pp, maybe AK. And on the flop, he mini-raises despite the strength of your hand.
Given it's one of the first hands between you, I doubt that he is on a "second level of thinking" kind of bluff, so my guess would be AA-KK, and more probably AA.

I would have probably call the flop, and a check-raise this kind of flop if I knew he has a large 3-bet range.

[Pharcyde]

Your PF raise puts you in a tough spot on the flop. It's not enough to scare Villain away, and it creates a pretty big pot. Any continuation bet you make commits you to the pot, possibly with the worst hand. If you check, it gives Villain a free card or makes a tough decision for all of your chips if he makes a big bet.

[ QUOTE ]
I didn't really want to play this hand oop, so I 3 bet him.

[/ QUOTE ]

FYP. Sounds like you wanted to define his hand to make your flop decision easier. If that's what you were going for, a 3bet of $10 PF does a lot for you. Villain probably folds everything except AA-QQ &amp; AKs to a 3bet from an opponent who's OOP. If he calls, you should c/f the flop unimproved and shove when you spike a J.

I hardly ever comment on hands. Hope this helps though. Let me know if you see something wrong with my thinking.

[Pharcyde]

Am I missing something from the PF action? Hero opened. Villain re-raised. Hero 3bet. Why is everyone saying Hero 4bet?

[cooker3]

[ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
I didn't really want to play this hand oop, so I 3 bet him.

[/ QUOTE ]

FYP. Sounds like you wanted to define his hand to make your flop decision easier. If that's what you were going for, a 3bet of $10 PF does a lot for you. Villain probably folds everything except AA-QQ &amp; AKs to a 3bet from an opponent who's OOP. If he calls, you should c/f the flop unimproved and shove when you spike a J.


[/ QUOTE ]

If your raise only gets hands to play back at you that are ahead then your turning your hand into a bluff which is bad especially with jacks.

[Spurious]

[ QUOTE ]
Am I missing something from the PF action? Hero opened. Villain re-raised. Hero 3bet. Why is everyone saying Hero 4bet?

[/ QUOTE ]
Blind = 1bet
Raise = 2bet
Reraise = 3bet
Rereraise = 4bet

[Pharcyde]

Well damn. My bad.

[AroundTheHorn]

you've got half your stack in the middle agains a very loose player, i think you have to push this

[tannenj]

op, your thought process is bad. if you're not willing to felt your hand on this flop, you can't 4bet preflop.

i think the hand is played fine, and at this point it's an easy shove. you're behind quite often, though.