JJ facing overcard on turn.

[MARK R]

Cant remember any reads this is just a hand I have found in poker tracker.

** (0.25|0.50 No Limit - Cash Game) Real Money

- BU sitting in seat 1 with $49.25 [Dealer]
- SB sitting in seat 2 with $46.21
- BB sitting in seat 3 with $52.03
- Hero sitting in seat 4 with $48.86
- MP sitting in seat 5 with $52.60
- CO sitting in seat 6 with $106.59

SB posted the small blind - $0.25
BB posted the big blind - $0.50
** Dealing card to HERO Jack of /images/graemlins/club.gif, Jack of /images/graemlins/heart.gif
Hero raised - $2.00
MP called - $2.00
CO - $2.00
BU folded
SB folded
BB called - $2.00

** Dealing the flop: 8 of /images/graemlins/spade.gif, 7 of /images/graemlins/heart.gif, 2 of /images/graemlins/club.gif
BB checked
Hero bet - $6.00
MP called - $6.00
CO folded
BB folded

** Dealing the turn: Queen of /images/graemlins/heart.gif
Hero: ??????

Also what is your plan on the river if.
1. total blank card. eg 3.
2. a card the makes the str8 eg 6.
3. another over card. eg A
4. The flush card hits.

Thanks for you input.

Mark.

[Jeff P]

This is a situation I struggle with also. The pot is approx $20 on the turn. MP called a 3/4 psb on the flop that's fairly dry, only slightly connected with the 7 and 8. I just don't think the Qh changes too much (I think if we're behind now, we were probably already behind at the flop).

The bad thing is we are OOP. If we make a decent bet on the turn, say $12-$15, we've committed over 1/3 of our stack to this hand, so it's gonna be hard to fold if he comes over the top (since we don't have a read). Check and fold the turn is also difficult to swallow, since we can't be so sure we're beat.

I don't have any advice to give, but I think this is a good illustration of the power of position. Villain has position on us, and that makes our hand more difficult.

[onz3145]

Id bet like 14 on turn and fold to raise.

[HBomb]

There's no reason not to bet the turn, you could be up against alot of straight draws and unless he raises you on the turn, I think you are good here for the most part.

[MARK R]

I bet $15 and he just called the bet.

The river came a 3

Whats my play?

[Waingro]

Check and call a really small bet, no more than $10. That way it can still be a vb with an 8 etc. I think you got as much value you could get.

[onz3145]

Villain never vbs an 8 on the river here

[Waingro]

[ QUOTE ]
Villain never vbs an 8 on the river here

[/ QUOTE ]
Sure they do, all the time. They make really small pointless vbs in huge pots with marginal holdings because they "put you on AK". If villain calls down with an 8 he obviously thinks he has the best hand and then Hero checks he is going to vb what he thinks is the best hand. But he bets small, because he knows he has a really crappy hand and basically no worse hand will call. But it doesn´t stop him from betting.

[justhetip]

What about bet the river and fold to a raise?

[Waingro]

[ QUOTE ]
What about bet the river and fold to a raise?

[/ QUOTE ]
Stack sizes. Hero has a half pot bet left.

[justhetip]

Then I guess the problem lies on the turn. We could check for 'pot control' however we would also lose control over the hand. Difficult playing OOP I guess.

So on the river, we have a half pot bet left. We think villain will vb 8 and also I guess 99 1010 by that logic, so there are some hands he will bet that beat us.

1. So on a total blank card it makes sense to check. He will vb some hands that we beat, bluff some hands, and obviously bet hands that beat us. This seems most + ev.

2. The straight completing card is the most difficult. If we are ahead in the hand we have to assume that a straight completing card is likely to give villain 2pair or the straight. I'm not really sure what to do here.. blocking bet is out of the question maybe due to stack sizes. I guess check and fold to a reasonable bet is best here.

3. and 4. play as 1. in my mind. These holdings are too unlikely for villain to have and while scary for you, may be just as scary for villain. Check/call.