50NL: AK OOP faces raise and RR. Note odd stack sizes

[SirFelixCat]

MP is 22/17 and is solid and 3bettor is unknown, but can't be given much credit hence due to his stack size.

So raising to how much is correct here with his odd stack size, assuming the original bettor will fold w/o a monster (KK or AA)?

Full Tilt Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.25/$0.50 Blinds - 6 Players - (LegoPoker HH Converter (http://www.legopoker.com/hh))

SirFelixCat (SB): $65.55
BB: $50.00
UTG: $41.30
MP: $73.95
CO: $31.75
BTN: $96.80

CO posts $0.50
Preflop: SirFelixCat is dealt K/images/graemlins/spade.gif A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (6 Players)
UTG folds, <font color="red">MP raises to $2.25</font>, <font color="red">CO raises to $4.00</font>, BTN folds, <font color="red">SirFelixCat ???

[Genz]

to 12. he is pretty much commited if he calls and we hit but he won't autopush every flop with every hand and we don't have to call if he does.

[Fiksdal]

[ QUOTE ]
3bettor is unknown, but can't be given much credit hence due to his stack size.

[/ QUOTE ]

And due to this:

[ QUOTE ]
CO posts $0.50

[/ QUOTE ]

OOP posters never give up. I typically 4bet here, fold to a shove from MP, instacall from CO.

[SirFelixCat]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
3bettor is unknown, but can't be given much credit hence due to his stack size.

[/ QUOTE ]

And due to this:

[ QUOTE ]
CO posts $0.50

[/ QUOTE ]

OOP posters never give up. I typically 4bet here, fold to a shove from MP, instacall from CO.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ok fellas, so a 4 bet is in order, ok. But the size of it is the big question.

If we raise to 10 or 12 or 15, w/e, this sets a price that shorty, if calls, is commited to on the flop. Assuming he doesn't 5bet/push here (which we call, obv), are we allowing him to play his med pair or AQ type hand and try to out flop us? If we miss the flop, it's an "ugh" spot OOP knowing villain is commited, no?

Couldn't we just raise enough to really put the screws here? Or is that just too gross of an overbet to, say, $30 here or so?

[BackdoorQuads]

Raising that big seems like spew to me, because once in a while, MP has a huge hand. I say we're probably ahead of CO, so we want him to call but aren't upset if he folds. What will he call with something worse (or flipping with) our AK? Probably about $10 or $12 or $15. I make it $12, call a shove from him, and play fit-or-fold on the flop if he calls. I will probably check the flop regardless of what hits.

[Genz]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
3bettor is unknown, but can't be given much credit hence due to his stack size.

[/ QUOTE ]

And due to this:

[ QUOTE ]
CO posts $0.50

[/ QUOTE ]

OOP posters never give up. I typically 4bet here, fold to a shove from MP, instacall from CO.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ok fellas, so a 4 bet is in order, ok. But the size of it is the big question.

If we raise to 10 or 12 or 15, w/e, this sets a price that shorty, if calls, is commited to on the flop. Assuming he doesn't 5bet/push here (which we call, obv), are we allowing him to play his med pair or AQ type hand and try to out flop us? If we miss the flop, it's an "ugh" spot OOP knowing villain is commited, no?

Couldn't we just raise enough to really put the screws here? Or is that just too gross of an overbet to, say, $30 here or so?

[/ QUOTE ]

1) short stacks are 20BB stacks, not 60 BB stacks. I don't know why everyone keeps referring to them as short stacks and thinks they will hold crap all the time when they push. I don't think that his reraising range is extremely wide here.
2) Overbetting the pot like this is a big waste of money, imo, since you are turning your hand into a bluff. I gave a reasoning for $12: pot is $26 and he has $18 left. If he open pushes and we haven't hit, I think we can still get away from the hand. If we hit, we can play for the rest of his chips.

[Fiksdal]

SFC

I just 4bet exactly pot here, to around $14. Signals to shorty that if he wants to continue, he has to put it AI, but at the same time allows us to get away if MP happens to have KK+.