25,000 Hand Stats Review. Advice greatly appreciated.

[yntm3]

Hi everyone I play 25nl,

I can't remember who it was (it was somewhere in the master sticky thread) but I decided to take their advice and play 25,000 hands and re-evaluate before moving up a level. Well I have done that and drawn some conclusions for myself, but I am interested into what everyone else thinks. I watched the low stakes video series on card runners and I think it turned me into a nit and I am not sure if I am getting the aggression right post-flop because my win rate is very low.

Here are my stats:

http://www.warrenhennessy.com/25k.jpg

http://www.warrenhennessy.com/1.jpg

http://www.warrenhennessy.com/2.jpg

http://www.warrenhennessy.com/3.jpg

http://www.warrenhennessy.com/4.jpg

Can any conclusions be drawn? Any places you think I can tinker with my game?

Cheers and thanks for your time.

[Capone]

For starters you would greatly help your winrate by really tightening up in the blinds. Play like a nit in the blinds if you have to. Its either your playing to many hands in the blinds, or your just weak post flop oop.

[barryc83]

won$WSF% is 34%? seems low to me but you can prolly win 5ptbb/100 playing nitty like you are. seems like youre messing up postflop somewhere like capone said. dont bluff them, valuetown them. dont be a payoff wizard with 1 pair hands.

[vixticator]

Fold to river bet 76%? Am I a station or is this way too high? You seem to be super aggro on the flop and then shut it down. Too weak on later streets. I think opponents are likely exploiting this.

[yntm3]

Thanks guys, keep the comments coming.

Any ideas how I would go about weeding out this post-weakness because I do believe deep down that I am not strong. I used to play SNGs for one year and am just making my start with cash. Maybe this is a problem?

[jonyy6788]

I can't really spot much wrong with your game except you're getting raped from the SB/BB. You really need to work on blind play.

Your other #'s are almost identical to mine.

[davebwell]

I dont play 6 max but shouldn't the went to showdown percentage be a little higher and the won money at showdown percentage be a little lower? You may be folding too many winners on later streets. Hopefully someone can comment on this.

[jonyy6788]

mid 20s is pretty std. with 50% or more W$SD

I've ran 24/54 over last 42k hands FWIW

[yntm3]

I don't understand the comments about the blinds...

I made a thread a while ago asking what I should be winning/losing from these positions and I was under the impression that if I can make a profit excluding the price of posting then I am doing okay.

[jonyy6788]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't understand the comments about the blinds...

I made a thread a while ago asking what I should be winning/losing from these positions and I was under the impression that if I can make a profit excluding the price of posting then I am doing okay.

[/ QUOTE ]

well, you're not winning from the SB (you're breakeven under the Diff w/o Blind column). My BB under the Diff w/o Blind column blows every other position outta the water. I can post a pic if you want to show you what I mean.

Under the BB Won/hand, I'm -0.10 from the SB and -0.09 from the BB, your #'s are much worse than that.

[KEW]

obv I see NO glaring STATISICALL errors...I think you know that..Stat reviews can only go so far and point of mainly obv PF leak(often only opinion on playing style)..

You are winning so you are WAY ahead of over 90% of the poker playing world be proud...Your leaks are post flop and looking at stats will nor disclose them...I would focus on your self review post session...obv posting hands that gave you trouble..

Somethings to possibily look at:
-How you play TP
--Are you getting MAX value from your TP hands
-Are you checking the turn IP to induce a bluff but then folding to a river bet???
--Are you OVERPLAYING TP and losing extra bets
-Are you playing sets fast enough..Avoid slowplaying it's usually a mistake..
-How are you playing draws??? Too fast,too slow and/or not giving yourself enough FE???
-How is your concentration when playing????
-How many tables???? Usually when unsure and learning cut back number of tables...

[Gelford]

[ QUOTE ]

Under the BB Won/hand, I'm -0.10 from the SB and -0.09 from the BB, your #'s are much worse than that.

[/ QUOTE ]

[jessyj07]

You suck in the blinds. Stop overplaying hands from the blinds and your wr will thank you. Stealing more wouldn't hurt either but the blinds is a really big leak there.

[jonyy6788]

ya looking again, I think u can go to SD more and definitely work on ur game in the blinds

[yntm3]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I don't understand the comments about the blinds...

I made a thread a while ago asking what I should be winning/losing from these positions and I was under the impression that if I can make a profit excluding the price of posting then I am doing okay.

[/ QUOTE ]

well, you're not winning from the SB (you're breakeven under the Diff w/o Blind column). My BB under the Diff w/o Blind column blows every other position outta the water. I can post a pic if you want to show you what I mean.

Under the BB Won/hand, I'm -0.10 from the SB and -0.09 from the BB, your #'s are much worse than that.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks for correcting me otherwise I would not have picked up on that!

[Nytecaster]

A bit of advice if I may.

If you are having problems with your blind play, remember to look for opportunties to raise when first in the pot. I've found it often prevents steals against you just as much as it allows you to steal. Some people get carried away and feel you should do this almost everytime. Do not fall into that trap and remember to think "opportunity" unless you are against someone obviously exploitable.

However, if this is new to you, only attempt these on people you have feel are very capable of folding and you have a good read on or your postflop play will suffer. Keep changing tables until you find one. It's easy enough to do that online. Basically you are going to learn how to plug the hole those seem to be exploiting against you. Once you know how they exploit you, the better you will able to defend the exploit. (You may take some lumps in the beginning but stick with being aggressive in an opportune way). After awhile you'll have all the tools to play most tables. Even the best players prefer a softer game rather than fighting it out for blinds. Table selection and discipline will be key here.

Your stats seem to dictate you are playing a tight aggressive game until you get to these big pots and then you back down. If you have lost a lot of the big pots and have become fearful of them, that is a good indication you are playing predictably, undervalue your hand, or are obviously fearful of big pots. You might want to figure out what it is and try to correct it.

I will follow up with this. Not every hand you play has to be played for max value. Of course we would all like this but you should keep in mind that you need to protect your chips just as much as get value out of your hand.

Good luck.

[yntm3]

Thanks everyone, very informative. I will be sure to go through the hands in the blinds and figure out what the hell is going on. I also spoke to a few people and will learn to open up my game a little more.

Stay tuned for my next 25,000 hand review soon. If I am happy with the outcome, I will move up /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Thanks again.

[hunt1897]

You actually have great stats for a coach to start helping you. It is much easier to coach you than someone who is hyper aggro with leaks all over the place. As said before, you are beating the rake, most of the people looking at your stats don't do that.

IMO.

[Nato76]

Wow. 15.52 Vol. Put $ in the Pot. Am I the only one that thinks he is playing way too tight?

[hunt1897]

NO, 90% of the players looking at his stats think that.


GET IT?

[Spurious]

There are major leaks in his game.
The rollercoaster graph indicates that as well.
I'd loosen up a little bit and dont fold on the river that often. They bluff at you all the time. Make more blocking bets on the river and don't check too often. If an opponent check-called all the way and the river is a blank fire again.
Post some hands here in the forum and ask for advice.


Check out Pokey's post about how to use PokerTracker.

[Nato76]

[ QUOTE ]
NO, 90% of the players looking at his stats think that.


GET IT?

[/ QUOTE ]

I guess you are trying to say that only the losing players think he is playing too tight. I have a 7PTBB over 32k hands playing at 22% Vol. This is at 50NL though. I guess 25NL is tougher.

[Scrubbo]

as others have stated something is wrong with your blind play.
i also think you're playing way too weak for a 15% vpip.
your w$wsf is 34 and wtsd 20
whereas i play 25% vpip and mine are 33 and 23 respectively

[Nato76]

[ QUOTE ]
as others have stated something is wrong with your blind play.
i also think you're playing way too weak for a 15% vpip.
your w$wsf is 34 and wtsd 20
whereas i play 25% vpip and mine are 33 and 23 respectively

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree. I think he is playing way weak.

[+EV]

I play 6max and fluctuate between 17-20% VPIP. My first impression is that those swings are way sick for someone playing as tight as OP. The variance should be less if the VPIP is lower.

I think there is strong evidence from the graph that OP has some tilting issues, some "There is no way this loose player has a better hand than me" type issues. I should know because I play super tight and also had those issues.

To OP: At this limit you need to nut pedal. More likely than not when someone plays at you strongly, they have you beat if you just have one pair. Learn to read aggression as a good hand and not as a bluff. Also try to play your A game all the time. Don't start calling people down to keep them honest. Play all 2pr and better hands strongly. Try to build big pots when ahead and recognize that AK is a great starting hand that will usually be beaten if you have your whole stack in the center. Control the pot and play more aggressively in position. Use your nitty tendancies to fold hands in the blinds that you would not normally fold and loosen up a LITTLE in position. Be willing to let go of hands sooner if you get massive resistance (getting checkraised on the turn is a great place to start).

I guarantee that with stats like yours and those improvements you will see a dramatic increase in your win rate. You can definitely win with stats as nitty as yours at 6max. Just don't fall into the "I have the best starting hand and don't need to worry about post flop play" trap.

+EV

[hunt1897]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
NO, 90% of the players looking at his stats think that.


GET IT?

[/ QUOTE ]




I guess you are trying to say that only the losing players think he is playing too tight. I have a 7PTBB over 32k hands playing at 22% Vol. This is at 50NL though. I guess 25NL is tougher.

[/ QUOTE ]



If this is true, you are in the top 1%, good job.

[Spurious]

[ QUOTE ]
I play 6max and fluctuate between 17-20% VPIP. My first impression is that those swings are way sick for someone playing as tight as OP. The variance should be less if the VPIP is lower.

I think there is strong evidence from the graph that OP has some tilting issues, some "There is no way this loose player has a better hand than me" type issues. I should know because I play super tight and also had those issues.

To OP: At this limit you need to nut pedal. More likely than not when someone plays at you strongly, they have you beat if you just have one pair. Learn to read aggression as a good hand and not as a bluff. Also try to play your A game all the time. Don't start calling people down to keep them honest. Play all 2pr and better hands strongly. Try to build big pots when ahead and recognize that AK is a great starting hand that will usually be beaten if you have your whole stack in the center. Control the pot and play more aggressively in position. Use your nitty tendancies to fold hands in the blinds that you would not normally fold and loosen up a LITTLE in position. Be willing to let go of hands sooner if you get massive resistance (getting checkraised on the turn is a great place to start).

I guarantee that with stats like yours and those improvements you will see a dramatic increase in your win rate. You can definitely win with stats as nitty as yours at 6max. Just don't fall into the "I have the best starting hand and don't need to worry about post flop play" trap.

+EV

[/ QUOTE ]

QFT

you probably call down too much

[Nato76]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
NO, 90% of the players looking at his stats think that.


GET IT?

[/ QUOTE ]




I guess you are trying to say that only the losing players think he is playing too tight. I have a 7PTBB over 32k hands playing at 22% Vol. This is at 50NL though. I guess 25NL is tougher.

[/ QUOTE ]



If this is true, you are in the top 1%, good job.

[/ QUOTE ]

Are you serious? There are several 2+2 players with 20%+ VPIP crushing the micros. Stop being a NIT your whole life.

[Mike Kelley]

I highly recommend pokey's post on blind stealing. The only time I like to play the blinds is if I'm the bb and the sb limps to me. I raise a high percentage of hands here and play them in position against the small blind. Position, Position, Position. There is a reason you can raise the blinds from the button unmercifully and it is usally correct to fold your blind.

I think you need to tighten up in early position and loosen up in late position more. According to Pokey, (who I recommend you attempt to emulate.) Your PFR% should be double for the Button what it is for UTG.

If we are giving credentials. I've won about 9.72BB/100 at 25NL Full Ring over 30,000 hands and I'm about 1bb/100 at 6max 25NL (I started with a sick 6 BI downswing and just got positive, probably 10,000 hands of 6max.)

How are you playing small pairs? Are you raising and continuation betting with them? Calling with them when you have position? They are gold mines for me.

[yntm3]

[ QUOTE ]
I think there is strong evidence from the graph that OP has some tilting issues

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't get frustrated at the tables so any kind of tilt is definitly very subtle. I am a humble person by nature, the money is meaningless, only the joy of success is appealing to me while playing this low. I don't think I am giving up money due to tilt but think the problem (other then the blinds) lies somewhere with lack of experience post-flop.

[ QUOTE ]
How are you playing small pairs? Are you raising and continuation betting with them? Calling with them when you have position? They are gold mines for me.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yep- opening from any posistion and c-betting.

Thanks everyone for your contributions, even the harsh reality ones. Keep em coming for anyone else who drops by! /images/graemlins/smile.gif