NL50 - JJ, and I'm completely lost

[KriStuS]

Sry about the bad HH, there's no converter avaible for B2B HH's.

I'm gonna be honest, I 8-table and therefore have no read except on the regulars, and I don't even recognize this player.
So, I suck at playing JJ and QQ in 3beted pots. All thoughts and input are really appriciated.


Game # 607779816 - Texas Holdem No Limit EUR 0,25/0,50 - Table "Arjeplog"

Players(max 6):
intro (EUR 94,81 in seat 1)
Benando (EUR 22,95 in seat 3)
Dementix (EUR 27,40 in seat 4)
B_Bedrup (EUR 60,80 in seat 6)

Dealer: Dementix
Small Blind: B_Bedrup (0,25)
Big Blind: intro (0,50)

intro was dealt: J /images/graemlins/heart.gif - J /images/graemlins/spade.gif

Benando Fold
Dementix Raise (2,00)
B_Bedrup Raise (6,25)
intro Call (6,00)
Dementix Fold

Flop 6 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif - 5 /images/graemlins/club.gif - 3 /images/graemlins/club.gif

B_Bedrup Bet (9,00)
intro Raise (30,00)
B_Bedrup All-In (45,30)
intro Call (24,30)

I would prefer folding preflop. I know we are getting implied odds, however I don`t like playing JJ solely for set value here. B_Bedrup is probably 3betting loose, and even if we hit a set we might not get paid off, if we don`t hit it we don`t know where we stand. Also, button might come over the top and 4bet ;(

[KriStuS]

If I know he's a nit and just 3betting AA, KK, AKs I guess I can fold.

But if I know hes 3betting loose I don't know how to proceed, surely folding can't be right? I mean, if we know he's 3betting light and we´re ahead of he's range we must play it somehow?

Against unknown like this I dunno anything at all.

If you really suspect that you are ahead of most of his range then you could 4bet. But remember button is also still in the hand. let`s asume he is a TAG. IMO, at 50NL his range for 3betting should be something like this

AQ, AK, TT, QQ, KK, AAif he is 3betting loose (but you have no read) then his range is

AQ, AK, 99, TT, QQ, KK, AA, (suited connectors occasionaly)

I don`t think we are ahead enough to justify a call. Are you willing to raise his CB with a ragged flop ?

Preflop, I much rather have AKs in that spot.

[spivey]

I don't understand why people at this level say we should fold more to three bets when the person who does it is looser. It makes absolutely no sense.

Call flop bet, in position. How are we in position on flop though when we are in one of the blinds? Is this one of those weird casino position rules on this site?

If villain fires a big bet on turn, I'll dump it then.

[mvdgaag]

<font color="green"> EDIT: preflop </font> fold or reraise, but don't call...

There are two things you can do on the flop; raise and fold to a reraise (he must have an overpair most of the time) or just call, which seems a better option since you are likely WA/WB. If I'm not going for set value I found I'm making more profit from TT/JJ when I take passive lines when played back at and cannot fold. You let them bluff off money with worse hands and don't bloat the pot when you are beat. But that's if you can't fold, most of the time when you think you are beat with jacks you probably are and you should fold.

There is something strange about the numbers... he bets $9, you raise to $30, he reraises to $45.30, so you should be putting in another $15.30 instead of $24.30 (I see it could come from the original $9). Whichever the case, if I wanted to raise to $30 and he has only $45.30 than I'm allin instead. He's commited anyways and you want to maximise FE.

[Kasane]

If I'm reading this right, you have to 4bet this unless SB is a rock of some sort. Button opens (steal often), SB 3bets, you've got a really good hand 4 handed and multi-way it's pretty [censored]. If button or SB pushes, I think you can safely fold.

This will usually get you two folds or a push. A push you can call if you can tell us anything about their ranges -- but default is fold, I think, without stoving it exactly.

Reads (on yourself and your two opponents) change this a lot though.

6 handed, UTG raise, Button rr and the like might change my opinion.