To everyone bashing Pokernews

[benza13]

I understand that they aren't doing a good job. Acting like this is different than last year is a joke though. Card Player was TERRIBLE last year, constantly making mistakes in their reporting. I am starting to believe that it is probably tougher than any of us give credit for, especially when the retards at Harrah's use one color for the last 4 chips in play only changing the shade of that color. I'm pretty sure there is a reason other than money that Pokernews got coverage rights this year, and that reason is how bad Card Player was before.

I also know that BJ is trying really hard to give us the best coverage possible and I would wager that if they are the primary reporter again next year the coverage will be much better.

[DoGGz]

I'm just amazed we didn't get pictures of the final 27 or something. That is like basic basic and they failed miserably at it.

[gdaily]

I have myself done a lot of live coverage from mainly the European Poker Tour, for example hand by hand coverage from the final tables.

I remember last year when CardPlayer had the coverage. It was really really terrible. This year it is not perfect, but it is WAY better than last year.

I can tell you one thing: It is really really hard to do good livereports. You are not allowed to sit by the table with a computer, you have to run to a media room long way behind to get down the story. You are not allowed to do chipcounts (you have to stand by tre rail and try to count the chips by the eye. The staff will treat you like [censored], security are all over you.

So give these guys a break. To be able to cover at tournament good, you will need one reporter for every four tables. That will be a staff of roughly 100 persons (*), to get the quality you guys want...

I can agree with the lack of photos - that are the easiest part to do, and also the part that the wiewers appriciate the most.

(*) 1600 players/day = 160 tables = 40 reporters/shift

[Devilboy666]

gdaily I understand what you're saying about covering 1600 players, but today we only had 3 tables and the coverage STILL sucked. That's not acceptable.

[benza13]

[ QUOTE ]
gdaily I understand what you're saying about covering 1600 players, but today we only had 3 tables and the coverage STILL sucked. That's not acceptable.

[/ QUOTE ]

If anyone who has this opinion also followed the coverage on Card Player last year then you have to realize that it might be a lot harder than we think, especially since ESPN and their cameras get in the way more and more involved as the tournament rolls on. Card Player was making at least as many mistakes as Pokernews is, probably more, and wasn't correcting them

[W brad]

People are bashing PN for the same reason they bash the dealer when their opponent sucks out on them.


They have no emotional control and are results oriented morons who are currently pissed at a few key eliminations.


PokerNews has done a great job for the past month. Fantastic when you consider how much we pay for the service. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[greggg230]

PokerNews has done a great job. What are you guys talking about? /images/graemlins/confused.gif

[W brad]

[ QUOTE ]
PokerNews has done a great job. What are you guys talking about? /images/graemlins/confused.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Where are you getting your updates?

How much are you paying for your updates?

When volunteer reporters get 99%+ of things right and make corrections when we point them out, and encourage us to point them out, and try their best to be as fast as possible with the results, an honest person has to say they are doing a great job.

[PokeReader]

I think Pokernews is doing on the whole, a much, much better job than Cardplayer. However, there were a few parts of the Cardplayer coverage I liked, and hope they try to be able to incorporate next year: linkage to players stats for all players, graph chip count tracking in addition to numerical, and more photos and blogs. I definitely prefer them, and hope they get the next contract, although ideally we would be like all other sports and coverage would not be on an exclusive rights basis.

[greggg230]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
PokerNews has done a great job. What are you guys talking about? /images/graemlins/confused.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Where are you getting your updates?

How much are you paying for your updates?

When volunteer reporters get 99%+ of things right and make corrections when we point them out, and encourage us to point them out, and try their best to be as fast as possible with the results, an honest person has to say they are doing a great job.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't know if you thought I was being sarcastic or something, but I wasn't. I've been reading PN obsessively during the ME and the coverage is excellent.

[W brad]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
PokerNews has done a great job. What are you guys talking about? /images/graemlins/confused.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Where are you getting your updates?

How much are you paying for your updates?

When volunteer reporters get 99%+ of things right and make corrections when we point them out, and encourage us to point them out, and try their best to be as fast as possible with the results, an honest person has to say they are doing a great job.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't know if you thought I was being sarcastic or something, but I wasn't. I've been reading PN obsessively during the ME and the coverage is excellent.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, I misread your post. But what I said does apply to all the complainers out there.

[PITTM]

pokernews has been awesome so far imo. i jst wish the uploaded pics were higher rez.

[ESKiMO-SiCKNE5S]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
PokerNews has done a great job. What are you guys talking about? /images/graemlins/confused.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Where are you getting your updates?

How much are you paying for your updates?

When volunteer reporters get 99%+ of things right and make corrections when we point them out, and encourage us to point them out, and try their best to be as fast as possible with the results, an honest person has to say they are doing a great job.

[/ QUOTE ]

i agree that they are doing a great job and have no idea why ppl are complaining... but come on. they are doing this to:

1. build their brandname
2. sell adspace on their website

are they really volunteers? how do you get this?

[zerocarb]

I think the coverage has been terrific. It's never going to be perfect, but as long as they're not charging me to read the updates I'll keep clicking F5.

[Chomp]

Anyone with any professional media experience (print, radio, TV, web) will understand how enormously difficult it must be to cover this event.

Mistakes are absolutely unavoidable in such chaotic conditions, and IMO PN's coverage is at least a B+ from that perspective. The pics issue is odd and does knock them down a bit, but there could be a reasons for this that we are unaware of.

Overall, probably as good a job as it's possible to do.

[MiltonFriedman]

It is enormously difficult to cover a live event, especially when you are the ugly stepchild pushed around by ESPN.

Pokernews has done pretty well on the interviews I have seen. Thei chip coverage and updates could stand some improvement, however, the playing field within the torunament area is problematic at best.

Overall, I would give them a B grade, with room for improvement. .... To put it into perspective, I would rate ESPN last year at a C +. Last year's Cardplayer coverage rated a C - at best.

However, PokerNews has NOT tried to manufacture news about its owners or screwed around with coverage to get its faces on the news.

[Stealthy]

Given how difficult a job it must be, especially with the similar chip colours I think the coverage has been excellent.

[Eric H]

I think Pokernews is doing a very good job.

[Dids]

It really doesn't matter how bad CP was. Pokernews still is making some pretty basic mistakes. I think we all have some understanding of how hard this event is to cover. That means that we should accept that things will be slow, and that sometimes a hand won't be accurate.

The mistakes that are not acceptable are the dropped zeros on chipcounts, incorrect bust out notifications. Stuff that should be caught if people were doing some basic journalism 101 editing.

[Texter]

I don't think they are volunteers; a lady I played poker with said that her son was a chip counter for them and he got paid $125/Day.

[MrFizzbin]

The thing I dislike most about Pokernews coverage, is that I miss that genuine independent coverage of the event. By paying to be Harrah's designated media whore, we lost stories like the one's about bad structures, bad tent, etc... the most critical story from pokernews was the cards and the chips. I miss the Independent News Authority, not the paid PR arm of Harrahs.....

[Johnny Hughes]

I have been following it on Poker News and Dr. Pauly's blog and here. I have noticed plenty of pointing out Harrah's problems and player's complaints. To get over 6000 players down to 9 is a large job. The side elements, Vinnie's chair, Eskimo's health, Phil's horrible, devastating car crash, the drunk crowds, and the pros falling like a row of dominoes have all added drama.

[MrTimCaum]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm just amazed we didn't get pictures of the final 27 or something. That is like basic basic and they failed miserably at it.

[/ QUOTE ]


right on. i've been annoyed at PN about this since the start of the series. cardplayer is definitely lacking in some areas of their coverage of events, but this isn't one of them.

the best photographs this year during the series were on pokerwire. heather did a fantastic job and took some amazing photographs, especially of me /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Johnny Hughes]

I would have thought there would be bios of the final nine but they played 16 hours of more. I am not even sure where they are from which makes for the drama and who you root for.

[Kneel B4 Zod]

[ QUOTE ]
I would have thought there would be bios of the final nine but they played 16 hours of more. I am not even sure where they are from which makes for the drama and who you root for.

[/ QUOTE ]

if you go to an EPT finale, the staff has a printed bio of each final tablists that anyone can pick up. it's very odd pokernews doesn't have this up on their website. I just read an article on si.com which has more info than on pokernews

[yi style]

[ QUOTE ]
I think Pokernews is doing a very good job.

[/ QUOTE ]

[NickMPK]

I think the poker news coverage got much better over the course of the series. There's only one thing I think they were really deficient in: there should be a way, at all times, to easily tell (about) how many players are left in an event. Cardplayer always had this, but Pokernews never did, until you got down to the final few tables.

[Dunkman]

My problem with pokernews isn't errors in some hands, or failure to get chip counts. We all have seen the orange sea of chips, and if you're trying to type out a hand description in under a minute mistakes happen. My complaint has been that the coverage has been inconsistent...it was quite good yesterday I thought. Each of the 2 days before, it seemed like they pretty much quit after the dinner break, posting 2-3 hands an hour and only bustouts. Hell, Bart's bustout didn't even get posted, someone found it on gutshot the next day. I think they've done a good job for most of the time, but lack of updates those 2 evenings were really frustrating. Oh, and BJ is obviously their best reporter and has done a great job. On night 5, they had him doing chip counts and other stats stuff, so that probably helps to explain the spotty nature of the hand reports...they didn't have their horse out there.

[RonFezBuddy]

[ QUOTE ]
PokerNews has done a great job. What are you guys talking about? /images/graemlins/confused.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

[Rottersod]

How is PN setup to cover the ME? Is it a few roving reporters who do the chip counts and report on the hands and each one uploads their own stories and counts to the main site? Or is there an editor who takes their reports and counts and sends it to the site?

If I were setting this up and money/space was tight I would prioritize by hiring a couple or reporters (for the later stages of the ME) who would write the hand reports and an editor who would consolidate the reports, edit typos, and who would have an assistant (volunteer)who would make the actual postings. This isn't difficult to do with laptops and accessible accounts. Chip counters should be experienced and should be able to send their counts to another person (volunteer probabaly) who would consolidate them, have a spreadsheet with built in formulas to calculate the difference between them and the total # chips in play to see if they are off by major amounts) and some macros to highlight any counts that deviate from their previous ones by a certain percentage so they can spot decimal errors quickly and before they are uploaded.

[Cactus Jack]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
PokerNews has done a great job. What are you guys talking about? /images/graemlins/confused.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

[/ QUOTE ]

This thread would not have happened last year. Nobody defended Card Player's coverage.

[PITTM]

[ QUOTE ]
How is PN setup to cover the ME? Is it a few roving reporters who do the chip counts and report on the hands and each one uploads their own stories and counts to the main site? Or is there an editor who takes their reports and counts and sends it to the site?


[/ QUOTE ]

from what i say at the bay 101 wpt. they have like 5-6 roaming reporters who periodically go back to their laptop to type up an update. i imagine this is done on a much larger scale for the wsop.

[doublejoker]

doesnt CardPlayer generally favor Fulltilt players in their coverage?

[La Brujita]

i haven't read this whole thread but of those complaining how many were at the wsop?

the pokernews guys are working super hard, the conditions are difficult and every single one i have talked to has been super friendly.

[Kneel B4 Zod]

[ QUOTE ]
i haven't read this whole thread but of those complaining how many were at the wsop?

the pokernews guys are working super hard, the conditions are difficult and every single one i have talked to has been super friendly.

[/ QUOTE ]

the counters are doing a good job, I just think there is a lack of overall strategy at the top. the fact that I still don't know who the final tablists are/where they come from is really poor.

[Dids]

Still pointing out the lack of an editor/proof reader/whatever.

[ESKiMO-SiCKNE5S]

Dids - with live journalism there is always going to be a trade-off between quality of information received and the speed it gets out there. Clearly PN prioritises speed over quality and for me and im sure most others this is exactly how it should be done. small errors that are later fixed are a small price to pay for the fact that we are getting almost live coverage which we wouldnt with an editor....

[Dynasty]

[ QUOTE ]
doesnt CardPlayer generally favor Fulltilt players in their coverage?

[/ QUOTE ]

My impression is that they favor their advertisers' players.

[Dids]

[ QUOTE ]
Dids - with live journalism there is always going to be a trade-off between quality of information received and the speed it gets out there.

[/ QUOTE ]

Disagree. Strongly.

Accuracy > Speed. Take the time to get it right, we'll understand.

[grdred944]

[ QUOTE ]
Dids - with live journalism there is always going to be a trade-off between quality of information received and the speed it gets out there. Clearly PN prioritises speed over quality and for me and im sure most others this is exactly how it should be done. small errors that are later fixed are a small price to pay for the fact that we are getting almost live coverage which we wouldnt with an editor....

[/ QUOTE ]

We are receiving near-real time coverage. Even a small operation like PN can setup workflow processes that include a filter before posting. The editor does not have to blue line items and send them back. Simply correct any obvious errors and post.

ANY publication has a responsibility to ensure quality and accuracy over speed. In this case they can have both and the hit on speed, per update, would literally be measurable in seconds if they had the correct processes in place.

I've been OK with PN's coverage and will parrot those who have said that it is far superior to the crap CP gave us last year. But, they do need to look at how they process information.

[horrorshow]

I preferred it when the coverage wasn't exclusive so I could go to pokerpages among others and get something useful. However, PN was a lot better than CardPlayer's Full Tilt Pro, oh yeah and the rest of you idiots coverage. Whoever has the exclusive coverage should not be signing partnership deals with someone supplying players.

[BenTurpen]

What bothered me mostly about PN coverage was the fact that day one coverage had updates every 5 mins and then when it actually matters late in the events(ESPN and Non) we would go 30 mins. sometimes without updates. It was also painfully obvious for most of the events that after dinner break everyone went to bed.