25NL - 3-Bet Suited Connectors Preflop?

[calmB4storm]

When is it best to 3-bet suited connectors preflop?
Obviously it depends on your opponents, but let's assume we're facing unknowns.
In late position after an early position raise?
What about a spot like this? Is a 3-bet > call in this situation?

Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Hold'em Cash Game
$0.10/$0.25 Blinds
5 Players - (LegoPoker HH Converter (http://www.legopoker.com/hh))

Hero (SB): $26.40
BB: $24.75
UTG: $24.50
CO: $25.80
BTN: $26.30

Preflop: Hero is dealt T/images/graemlins/club.gif 9/images/graemlins/club.gif (5 Players)
2 folds, <font color="red">BTN raises to $0.85</font>, Hero calls $0.75, BB folds

Flop: ($1.95) T/images/graemlins/heart.gif 7/images/graemlins/club.gif 7/images/graemlins/spade.gif (2 Players)
<font color="red">Hero bets $1.50</font>, BTN folds
Uncalled bet of $1.50 returned to Hero

Pot Size: $1.95 ($0.05 Rake)

[Sweir]

Why are you donking the flop?

[bozzer]

[ QUOTE ]
When is it best to 3-bet suited connectors preflop?

[/ QUOTE ]
in position against someone who has a wide opening range.

[ QUOTE ]

In late position after an early position raise?

[/ QUOTE ]
This can be suprisingly effective as long as they are not of the 10% pfr type.

[ QUOTE ]

What about a spot like this? Is a 3-bet &gt; call in this situation?

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I pretty much never call in this situation. If I think they are likely to be making a positional raise I will 3bet fairly often, otherwise fold.

[monkover]

i don´t like 3b here pre. i wouldn´t want to bloat the pot oop with a mediocre hand. unless you flop the flush it will be pretty hard to play. playing draws oop imo really sucks.

[Vyse]

I don't 3bet facing unknowns. Simple.

3bet light, that is.

[+EV]

[ QUOTE ]
Why are you calling with a suited connector out of position preflop?

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[calmB4storm]

[ QUOTE ]
Why are you donking the flop?

[/ QUOTE ]
I don't really know what to do here, which is what prompted this post.
I guess the bet is to see where I'm at, plus a value bet versus lower pocket pairs.

[ QUOTE ]
I don't 3bet facing unknowns. Simple.

3bet light, that is.

[/ QUOTE ]
Then what are you doing against unknowns in hands like the OP and this one? Are the implied odds large enough that we can just call?

Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Hold'em Cash Game
$0.10/$0.25 Blinds
5 Players - (LegoPoker HH Converter (http://www.legopoker.com/hh))

SB: $37.05
BB: $10.00
UTG: $21.60
CO: $4.90
Hero (BTN): $24.75

Preflop: Hero is dealt 9/images/graemlins/heart.gif 8/images/graemlins/heart.gif (5 Players)
<font color="red">UTG raises to $0.85</font>, 2 folds, SB calls $0.75, BB calls $0.60

[Vyse]

I snap fold the OP PF.

Nothing wrong with cold calling the 98s hand.

[greggg230]

Definitely call there

[relativity_x]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't 3bet facing unknowns. Simple.

3bet light, that is.

[/ QUOTE ]

[calmB4storm]

lol isuckaments

[Fiksdal]

3bet or fold preflop (dependent on opponent)

check/evaluate the flop.

[We Major]

[ QUOTE ]
Why are you donking the flop?

[/ QUOTE ]

What's wrong with donking the flop?

He's got top pair, horrible kicker and he wants to try to take the hand down now since any overcard is a scare card. Also, you may be able to get value out of a lower PP.

[black666]

Against unknowns -&gt; fold

If it's the usual &gt;30% VP$IP player or button-raiser a 3-bet can be pretty effective, as you punish him for playing too many hands / raising the button too often. Most villains fold to the heat either PF or to the c-bet on the flop.

[monkover]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Why are you donking the flop?

[/ QUOTE ]

What's wrong with donking the flop?

He's got top pair, horrible kicker and he wants to try to take the hand down now since any overcard is a scare card. Also, you may be able to get value out of a lower PP.

[/ QUOTE ]

what about c/r? imo way better than donking the flop. for a couple of abvious reasons

[Vyse]

Donking the flop is more valid than people give it credit for.

[monkover]

[ QUOTE ]
Donking the flop is more valid than people give it credit for.

[/ QUOTE ]
can you elaborate please? i can see more reasons for c/r than donking.

[Vyse]

I meant more in general than this specific situation, but it has validity here, too. A CR is never going to fold a PP, and while donking isn't either, a CR just further bloats the pot OOP. I don't think there's anythign wrong with a b/f line on the flop here, since a raise, for the most part, lets you play perfectly, and a call means we can significantly shorten his range to something we're comfortably ahead of.

[Jamougha]

cr is bloody awful, you're not folding better hands or getting calls from worse ones = wtf

[Sweir]

Villain should be cbetting this flop a lot so c/c seems pretty standard here, donking loses a bet from hands that would have cbet.

[monkover]

[ QUOTE ]
cr is bloody awful, you're not folding better hands or getting calls from worse ones = wtf

[/ QUOTE ]
sorry messed up was talking about c/c. wouldn´t want to turn our hand into a bluff either.

[corsakh]

Check/call the flop. You dont have a hand to go broke over.

[ActionStan]

I don't mind a 3-bet once in a while, but for sure don't just call.

The preferred environment for the hand you have is in position ideally in a multiway limped pot. When stacks are deep enough or the table is fairly passive, the hand will play well in position in a raised pot with a couple of opponents. This hand plays poorly out of position in a raised pot. Don't let that happen. Fold or raise to take down the pot before the flop.

Most of the time, that hand is going to mature into a hand that will win a lot of money on the turn or river. Playing it out of position in a raised pot means that you won't be able to control the pot in the way you'd like and run the kind of bluffs you'd like.