Best (online) players on 2+2?

[lufbradolly]

I'm pretty bored so i was wondering who people think are the best players on 2+2. I'm looking for pure speculation, just pick 3 for each category for whatever reasons you think constitute that a player is the best.
Also i'm only speculating on limit and no limit holdem because there the only forums i read much. If people wanna speculate on who's the best at Omaha or MTT's etc. then knock yourselves out.

Limit Holdem: stoxtrader, Baronzeus, bicyclekick

NL Holdem: Bruiser, El Diablo, KKF

Also i'm talking about players who post regularly and not some of the top players who just happen to be a member of 2+2.
Feel free to tell me i have no clue as well.

[Schneids]

[ QUOTE ]
Baronzeus

[/ QUOTE ]

LOL.

Sub in any of Nikla, James282, or nyplayer.

[lufbradolly]

Do you not consider yourself one of the best at LHE?

I thought about you or James282, but you guys hardly ever post hands so i wasn't sure exactly what sort of level you guys play online.

I didn't realise that nikla and nyplayer were up there.

[Schneids]

PokerMike is up there too. I think highly of myself too but do not wish to make judgments since I'm pretty biased.

[lufbradolly]

k, appreciate your opinions all the same.

[IronDragon1]

Stud: Jeffage, Andy B, Jon_Ivan
Omaha/8: J_V, Buzz

[HotPants]

[ QUOTE ]
PokerMike is up there too. I think highly of myself too but do not wish to make judgments since I'm pretty biased.

[/ QUOTE ]

Damnit, I freakin jealous of that guy. I talked to him in person when he was telling me about how he planned to take a shot at 15/30

That was like a year ago

[surfinillini]

uhhhhhhh

Colson
Sirio
ZJ

[lufbradolly]

[ QUOTE ]
uhhhhhhh

Colson
Sirio
ZJ

[/ QUOTE ]

Limit?

[surfinillini]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
uhhhhhhh

Colson
Sirio
ZJ

[/ QUOTE ]

Limit?

[/ QUOTE ]

Sirio for MTT
Colson for Omaha
ZJ for NL

I don't know [censored] about limit players so I won't pretend to...but BicycleKick sounds like an excellent choice

[ggbman]

The results of this thread will be based largely on

1.) How hot people have run over the last 12 months
2.) How forthcoming people are about thier results

[bicyclekick]

[ QUOTE ]
The results of this thread will be based largely on

1.) How hot people have run over the last 12 months
2.) How forthcoming people are about thier results

[/ QUOTE ]

[Schneids]

[ QUOTE ]
The results of this thread will be based largely on

1.) How hot people have run over the last 12 months
2.) How forthcoming people are about thier results

[/ QUOTE ]

I was trying to base my input on people I've actually played hands with on a somewhat frequent basis... Like PokerMike, for instance, I have no fkin clue how he has done, ever.

[SackUp]

Limit: oscark is my hero.

[TheWorstPlayer]

[ QUOTE ]
Stud: Jeffage, Andy B, Jon_Ivan
Omaha/8: J_V, Buzz

[/ QUOTE ]
FWIW, Buzz is a great poster, but I don't think he's really in J_V's league in terms of play. Especially short handed. Cero is pretty nasty at O8 and also at NL Holdem.

I think the old school dudes are probably some of the best players (fine, obviously this is 99% conjecture). So if I had to put together all-star teams I would take:
Holdem NL: Ray Zee, Cero_Z, GiftofGab.
Holdem limit: J.A.Sucker, Ray Zee, J_V
O8 limit: J_V, Cero_Z, Ray Zee

I don't really know other games nearly as well.

[bicyclekick]

[ QUOTE ]

Holdem limit: J.A.Sucker, Ray Zee, J_V

[/ QUOTE ]

JA sucker is nowhere near the top.

[TheWorstPlayer]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Holdem limit: J.A.Sucker, Ray Zee, J_V

[/ QUOTE ]

JA sucker is nowhere near the top.

[/ QUOTE ]
Maybe you can play him after MM. I know you don't like him. But have you ever played with him, out of curiousity? Seems like you just don't like him and don't respect his posting style.

[bicyclekick]

It's not a personal thing with sucker. I don't 'not like him' i just don't like the tone he posts with along with bad strategy advice. From what I hear he's a nice guy. I don't really know.

You're right, I've never knowingly played with him, although I'm sure we've logged a number of hands together online.

[Josh W]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Holdem limit: J.A.Sucker, Ray Zee, J_V

[/ QUOTE ]

JA sucker is nowhere near the top.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's ridiculous (please people, note the correct spelling of this word, there is no "e" in it) to just say "limit holdem", since heads up is so different than 5 handed is different than 10 handed. Moreover, I'd go so far to say that multi-tabling 6 tables is different than 1 or 2 tabling.

I firmly believe I'm the winningest (BB/100h) party 20/40 and 30/60 player on here, but I can't play more than 2 tables without a drastic decline in my winrate. Take a guy like Paluka who can 6 table at a high level, and he'll crush my $$/hr rate. Who's better? Well, he makes tons more money than I do, so he is. But put us both at the same table, and I do (I think).

Josh

(this is obviously not direct at BK, just in general)

[tom10167]

[ QUOTE ]
The results of this thread will be based largely on

1.) How hot people have run over the last 12 months
2.) How forthcoming people are about thier results

[/ QUOTE ]
For what it's worth I don't really pay attention to names on here yet but I see your avatar and you're usually saying something more intelligent than other people, so I vote you.

[TheWorstPlayer]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Holdem limit: J.A.Sucker, Ray Zee, J_V

[/ QUOTE ]

JA sucker is nowhere near the top.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's ridiculous (please people, note the correct spelling of this word, there is no "e" in it) to just say "limit holdem", since heads up is so different than 5 handed is different than 10 handed. Moreover, I'd go so far to say that multi-tabling 6 tables is different than 1 or 2 tabling.

I firmly believe I'm the winningest (BB/100h) party 20/40 and 30/60 player on here, but I can't play more than 2 tables without a drastic decline in my winrate. Take a guy like Paluka who can 6 table at a high level, and he'll crush my $$/hr rate. Who's better? Well, he makes tons more money than I do, so he is. But put us both at the same table, and I do (I think).

Josh

(this is obviously not direct at BK, just in general)

[/ QUOTE ]
This is a very fair comment. However, since I was way out on a limb on my guesses already, I think I thought it would be even more ridiculous to pretend to know about SH vs FR or whatever. However, since this thread is fun and BK's here, let's do it like that.

Holdem 7+: JASucker (sorry BK), Ray Zee, not sure on third
Holdem 5-7: Nikla, Flawless_Victory (why not?), no idea on a third
Holdem 2-4: Schneids, BK, James

OK, let's view these are discussion starters. Obviously I have no idea who is really stronger SH vs FR but these are guesses from posts.

[ggbman]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The results of this thread will be based largely on

1.) How hot people have run over the last 12 months
2.) How forthcoming people are about thier results

[/ QUOTE ]
For what it's worth I don't really pay attention to names on here yet but I see your avatar and you're usually saying something more intelligent than other people, so I vote you.

[/ QUOTE ]

Haha thank you. SEE EVERYONE I AM THE BEST!!!

Also, Josh W.'s point is very interesting. Guy's like BK get a lot of respect from me because they can attain high hourly earns playing higher stakes games or 8 tabling some of the medium stakes games. I personally am very good at the latter, but don't have a proven track record in some of the higher games, it's really 2 completley different things, so guys that can do both get my respect.

[bicyclekick]

nikla is better than me at all #'s of people.

[NLSoldier]

nikla, nikla, nikla, and nikla

/images/graemlins/heart.gif

[TheWorstPlayer]

[ QUOTE ]
nikla is better than me at all #'s of people.

[/ QUOTE ]
Good to know. Wish he posted more.

[AceHigh]

I would add skp to the limit list.

[TheWorstPlayer]

[ QUOTE ]
nikla, nikla, nikla, and nikla

/images/graemlins/heart.gif

[/ QUOTE ]
The funniest thing about this guy, and when I first noticed who he was, was when someone said they thought he was a fish or something and then someone else linked to the thread where he said he was up 115K that month. LOL.

[mmbt0ne]

[ QUOTE ]
nikla, nikla, nikla, and nikla

/images/graemlins/heart.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Little known fact, nikla is the offspring of Ray Zee and Norse goddess Freya (warrior goddess of love, and beauty)

[El Diablo]

OP,

I will crush anyone listed in this thread in any game except Stud.

[tom10167]

You play on UB? Feel like playing some HU .01 .02 NL?

[J_V]

I appreciate the mention.

I think a lot of the younger guys that play high limits changed these forums dramatically. James282, the Canterbury crew, DCIFRTHS, a bunch of others that i can't think of, but their are tons of limit holdem guys that think at the very top levels here. The gap at the top is very small and picking the best is hard. Probably the ones that tilt the least and play their best when losing.

[TheWorstPlayer]

You're welcome. I always enjoy your posts in all the forums. You mentioned your view on the Holdem guys. What to you think about Omaha?

[slickpoppa]

NL: barryg1
Limit: Jen Harman

[El Diablo]

TWP,

JV is just one of the many Omaha players I've sent packing.

[ggbman]

[ QUOTE ]
OP,

I will crush anyone listed in this thread in any game except Stud.

[/ QUOTE ]

Hi Diablo,

I don't know if you are serious, but if so i call BS. If you are serious, i am curious as to why you feel you could crush players who are proven winners at 300/600 LHE, and if you can beat them, why not play that game?

[Ray Zee]

j.a. sucker is clearly one of the best posters for limit holdem especially counting both online and live play. he has my respect in both and if he would write a limit holdem book with me i would do it. so there.

[J_V]

Thank you, I enjoy your posts as well.

I think the omaha forum gives the worst, most weak tight advice. They don't put enough action in on any street. CeroZ is a great poster and gergery posts well too. But overall, I feel like I'm fighting a current trying to convince people to put money in the pot over there.

If I get any good ideas, I hope to post some soon on both holdem and omaha. The stuff I think about now is more psychological though - trying to work on ways to play well when running bad for short and long periods.

[mmbt0ne]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
OP,

I will crush anyone listed in this thread in any game except Stud.

[/ QUOTE ]

Hi Diablo,

I don't know if you are serious, but if so i call BS. If you are serious, i am curious as to why you feel you could crush players who are proven winners at 300/600 LHE, and if you can beat them, why not play that game?

[/ QUOTE ]

You must not realize that ED has about $317 million and plays poker strictly for sport when he's not carousing with models in NY.

[highlife]

i have seen Ray Zee's name in this thread a number of times, however this was titled "Best (ONLINE) players...". i would like to contend that he doesn't know how to turn on a computer, nor do they even have the internet in Montana.

[Ansky]

Amongst "regular" posters in MTT:

MLG, Sirio11, they both participate regularly.

For those who aren't regular anymore, but still post occasionally, Strassa, ZJ, Colson10, iMsoLucky0, Shaniac.

I definitely forgot at least 1 person. If you are reading this, I'm sorry.

[r3vbr]

Is that 317M figure based on something or pure speculation?

I've heard he was pretty wealthy but not that much. Imagined more like a 50M net worth...


Oh..
the best from what ive heard (never seen more than a few hands of them playing) for NL cash games are:

Diablo, GoG, mahatma, I_Knockout_U
KKF and brusier

ZJ also had some nice results at SNG/MTTs.. not nearly as good as the rest at cash games though

am i right?

[El Diablo]

gg,

Yeah, I'm pretty much serious. I mean, there are many smart, skilled players out there who I'm sure would be challenging opponents. But come on, man, it's just poker.

As for why I don't concentrate more of my efforts on beating the highest limit poker games around, I hope you get a chance someday to find out that there is much more to life than poker. And, in the grand scheme of things, poker is pretty boring.

[NLSoldier]

lol, im pretty sure diablo would be the first to say hes worth no where close to 50 million.

[El Diablo]

rvr,

I am not even in that ballpark, but if I get there someday, it's definitely not going to be from poker. Overall, though, I have far less money than I might now, because I never really have focused much on making as much money as possible. I have enough such that I can eat, drink, and live well. I don't even have enough to buy a house I really like, though, so I'm going to have to work for a while longer.

[NLSoldier]

[ QUOTE ]
j.a. sucker is clearly one of the best posters for limit holdem especially counting both online and live play. he has my respect in both and if he would write a limit holdem book with me i would do it. so there.

[/ QUOTE ]

wow, i respect JA alot, but i think there are better LHE players on the forums, esp. short handed. i think he would be an idiot not to take you up on this book offer though!

[El Diablo]

NL,

I think I'm now two companies away from 50M! Though I really should have over 50M now, but that's a whole other story that we don't like to talk about! /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[NLSoldier]

diablo,

me too!

[El Diablo]

NL,

Those pesky bubbles....

[Clayton]

NL cashgame - Raymer
NL tourney - Raymer
SNGs - Raymer
Stud - Raymer
Omaha - Raymer
Hi/Lo games - Raymer
Drinking protein shakes - ZeeJustin
BBV - baronzeus
Downing fire sauce - bad beetz
getting phone numbers - sup bro
Sunday tournaments - JJProdigy

[Vavavoom]

Clayton,

Jeez - The last 10 posts that I have read by you have been quality ..... Keep it up man !!

**Edited**

Not your last 10...the last 10 I have read.....My favourite being the JJProdigy vs Dikshit HU Picture...

[El Diablo]

Clayton,

You have been en fuego lately.

[Clayton]

thanks.

[NLSoldier]

[ QUOTE ]
NL cashgame - Raymer
NL tourney - Raymer
SNGs - Raymer
Stud - Raymer
Omaha - Raymer
Hi/Lo games - Raymer
Drinking protein shakes - ZeeJustin
BBV - baronzeus
Downing fire sauce - bad beetz
getting phone numbers - sup bro
Sunday tournaments - JJProdigy's Grandma

[/ QUOTE ]

[Clayton]

unfortunately NL his grandma doesn't post on 2+2, otherwise I would have included her in my list. I'm genuinely interested in what kinda stuff she could bring to the MTT forum.

[Sponger.]

[ QUOTE ]
Though I really should have over 50M now, but that's a whole other story that we don't like to talk about! /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/9717/stocks6nz.gif

[Scotty.]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Though I really should have over 50M now, but that's a whole other story that we don't like to talk about! /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/9717/stocks6nz.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Skins split?

[El Diablo]

Sponger,

That is scarily accurate.

[NLfool]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Though I really should have over 50M now, but that's a whole other story that we don't like to talk about! /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/9717/stocks6nz.gif

[/ QUOTE ]


Hey I literally have that chart. March-April of 2000. Remember walking out of classes into the computer labs to check my stocks and then wanting to cry everyday that spring quarter.

[ggbman]

[ QUOTE ]
gg,

Yeah, I'm pretty much serious. I mean, there are many smart, skilled players out there who I'm sure would be challenging opponents. But come on, man, it's just poker.

As for why I don't concentrate more of my efforts on beating the highest limit poker games around, I hope you get a chance someday to find out that there is much more to life than poker. And, in the grand scheme of things, poker is pretty boring.

[/ QUOTE ]

Your point about poker not being too important in the grand scheme of things is very true. I lose perspective on that sometimes.

On the other hand, realize that i am humbly going to disagree with you. Guys liek schneids probably spend less time playing or thinking about poker than you do, it's certainly not his life. And i would tend to think guys like him and Nikla would have an edge over you in LHE, though my only rational is that they are able to play some of the highest games sucessfully without dedicating their lives to poker. This does not mean you are not that man /images/graemlins/wink.gif

And it's also just some 18 year olds opinion, so i know your not gonna lose a wink of sleep over it.

[NLSoldier]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
gg,

Yeah, I'm pretty much serious. I mean, there are many smart, skilled players out there who I'm sure would be challenging opponents. But come on, man, it's just poker.

As for why I don't concentrate more of my efforts on beating the highest limit poker games around, I hope you get a chance someday to find out that there is much more to life than poker. And, in the grand scheme of things, poker is pretty boring.

[/ QUOTE ]

Your point about poker not being too important in the grand scheme of things is very true. I lose perspective on that sometimes.

On the other hand, realize that i am humbly going to disagree with you. Guys liek schneids probably spend less time playing or thinking about poker than you do, it's certainly not his life. And i would tend to think guys like him and Nikla would have an edge over you in LHE, though my only rational is that they are able to play some of the highest games sucessfully without dedicating their lives to poker. This does not mean you are not that man /images/graemlins/wink.gif

And it's also just some 18 year olds opinion, so i know your not gonna lose a wink of sleep over it.

[/ QUOTE ]

schneids never playes poker anymore cuz he is "otherwise occupied" so my money is on el d in that match, but if you match them up in a game of peachy-trivia ill put my whole BR and as much money as i can borrow on mike!

[Clayton]

I'm gonna take a stab and guess that the best in the game don't know anything other than poker. When they figure it out, they are no longer the best. Those who can exist among the highest echelon and maintain something like a "normal life" are few and far between.

[NLSoldier]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm gonna take a stab and guess that the best in the game don't know anything other than poker. When they figure it out, they are no longer the best. Those who can exist among the highest echelon and maintain something like a "normal life" are few and far between.

[/ QUOTE ]

im not sure if you are defending schneids or ripping on him, i sure hope the latter!

[Clayton]

nah, not about schneids at all.

[NLSoldier]

[ QUOTE ]
nah, not about schneids at all.

[/ QUOTE ]

lol ok my bad. can you rip on him anyways, just for me?

[ipp147]

[ QUOTE ]
unfortunately NL his grandma doesn't post on 2+2, otherwise I would have included her in my list. I'm genuinely interested in what kinda stuff she could bring to the MTT forum.

[/ QUOTE ]

Grandma (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=0&Board=tourn&Number=4731290&Sear chpage=1&Main=4731290&Words=+Grandma&topic=&Search =true#Post4731290)

[El Diablo]

gg,

Schneids spends a lot more time thinking about and playing poker than I do. And I would still crush him in LHE or any other game with my eyes closed. I taught that boy 99% of what he knows about LHE, and that was only 1% of what I know.

[PokerBob]

i am the best.

[El Diablo]

PB,

HU FREEZEOUT FOR YOUR LIFE!?!?!!???!

[NLSoldier]

[ QUOTE ]
PB,

HU FREEZEOUT FOR YOUR LIFE!?!?!!???!

[/ QUOTE ]

are u gonna put up like 50 cents er...?

[tom10167]

[ QUOTE ]
PB,

HU FREEZEOUT FOR YOUR LIFE!?!?!!???!

[/ QUOTE ]

I will back you twenty dollars.

[Schneids]

Hello Diablo my friend,

Please remember that time we played HU on Stars and I was beating/outplaying you the whole match then you got a 2 cent lead on me through luckboxing and quit the game because you were outclassed so the best you could muster was being satisfied with a .5BB win?

[ggbman]

[ QUOTE ]
gg,

Schneids spends a lot more time thinking about and playing poker than I do. And I would still crush him in LHE or any other game with my eyes closed. I taught that boy 99% of what he knows about LHE, and that was only 1% of what I know.

[/ QUOTE ]

El D,

If this is true, then you probably have a substantial edge in some of the 3/6 games that run online with poker expertise that you have. Why not play those games sometimes for the extra hourly if it doesnt require any sacrifice on your part.

P.S. i know it looks like i'm being a pain in the ass, but i'm genuinly curious if you feel this is true.

Gabe

[NLSoldier]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
gg,

Schneids spends a lot more time thinking about and playing poker than I do. And I would still crush him in LHE or any other game with my eyes closed. I taught that boy 99% of what he knows about LHE, and that was only 1% of what I know.

[/ QUOTE ]

El D,

If this is true, then you probably have a substantial edge in some of the 3/6 games that run online with poker expertise that you have. Why not play those games sometimes for the extra hourly if it doesnt require any sacrifice on your part.

P.S. i know it looks like i'm being a pain in the ass, but i'm genuinly curious if you feel this is true.

Gabe

[/ QUOTE ]

dude,

why waste time with poker when you are a company or two away from 50M!

[Sponger.]

even though your post was a joke, ElD has 17,000+ posts, I'm pretty sure he rules at wasting time.

[PokerBob]

[ QUOTE ]
PB,

HU FREEZEOUT FOR YOUR LIFE!?!?!!???!

[/ QUOTE ]

why would you want to play for $50?

[PokerPrince]

I'de like to fight you.

[El Diablo]

PP: How big are you? Are you trained in fighting?

gg: Because I would have to scout the games, learn the players, really focus and concentrate on the games - basically, spend a lot of mental energy focusing on poker. That's not currently a priority in my life. My general opinion is that poker is just poker, no matter the game or limit. Take any of a number of top players here (say, JV, flawless, Nikla, or me just to pick a few names) and have them spend some time focusing on any particular game and I don't think it'll be too long before their games are at a level such that variance vastly overshadows any skill advantage they have over each other or vs the top players in those games. It's just poker, after all.

[El Diablo]

schneids:

I don't recall the details exactly. I just remember HU CHALLENGE = DIABLO WINNAAAAAAARRRRRRRRR.

[PokerPrince]

Not very big, no fight training. Just a lot of hatred and rage pent up in my heart and soul. Not necessarily towards you but life in general. I do however think that you LOVE to feel like the alpha male and come on here cause you get respect from dweebs and it makes you feel good. It's human nature with nothing really wrong with it, who doesn't want to feel good about themselves? But I think a good strong beating would take your ego down a notch or two and I'de like to be the one to deliver said beating. Even a knife fight would work.

[El Diablo]

Prince,

Cool, I can dig it. Let me know when you want to do it. I haven't been in a real fight in over 10 years, but I have been doing some MMA training, so I'm feeling pretty good right now. Also, my buddy Randle from OOT has my back just in case things get out of control.

[phish]

[ QUOTE ]
The gap at the top is very small and picking the best is hard. Probably the ones that tilt the least and play their best when losing.

[/ QUOTE ]

Amen

[PokerPrince]

No need to bring your moronic buddies into things. I wouldn't kill you, just choke you out to unconsiousness. Then I would bend down next to your exhausted body and taste your sweet tears. Maybe even fart right in your face with my pants down to degrade you.

[TFlo]

Whoa what happened to this thread??

[tomdemaine]

[ QUOTE ]
No need to bring your moronic buddies into things. I wouldn't kill you, just choke you out to unconsiousness. Then I would bend down next to your exhausted body and taste your sweet tears. Maybe even fart right in your face with my pants down to degrade you.

[/ QUOTE ]

I've lost count, what level of sarcasm are we up to?

[KaneKungFu123]

Diablo,

I cant believe you didn't get out earlier! I was in the 5th grade destroyed the class stock market competition when I shorted AMZN.

[Paluka]

There is no way that JASucker is one of the best limit holdem players on 2+2, I don't care what Ray Zee says.

[Kneel B4 Zod]

[ QUOTE ]
Whoa what happened to this thread??

[/ QUOTE ]

Ron Burgundy: Boy, that escalated quickly... I mean, that really got out of hand fast!
Champ Kind: It jumped up a notch!
Ron Burgundy: It did, didn't it?
Brick Tamland: Yeah, I stabbed a man in the heart!
Ron Burgundy: I saw that! Brick killed a guy! Did you throw a trident?
Brick Tamland: Yeah, there were horses, and a man on fire, and I killed a guy with a trident!
Ron Burgundy: Brick, I've been meaning to talk to you about that. You should find yourself a safehouse or a relative close by. Lay low for a while, because you're probably wanted for murder.

[TheWorstPlayer]

[ QUOTE ]
There is no way that JASucker is one of the best limit holdem players on 2+2, I don't care what Ray Zee says.

[/ QUOTE ]
I'm guessing RZ has played with him. Have you?

[Paluka]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
There is no way that JASucker is one of the best limit holdem players on 2+2, I don't care what Ray Zee says.

[/ QUOTE ]
I'm guessing RZ has played with him. Have you?

[/ QUOTE ]

Nope. How does that matter? Unless Ray Zee has played with every player on 2+2 who I think is better than JA Sucker, we are in the same boat.

[TheWorstPlayer]

I was just curious, because it was quite possible that you had and I would have been interested to know that your opinion of his play was first hand, as opposed to BK who commented on his play earlier, but not from first hand experience.

[sublime]

a year ago astro would have cleaned up in the limit category.

funny how the 2+2 media can change that /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[CCass]

Tommy (I folded AA preflop) Angelo??
Matt Flynn??

[TheWorstPlayer]

One more point on this topic which has piqued my curiosity. There are a few guys who play very high but don't post very often. Wondering if people had opinions on some of their play. I'm thinking specifically of guys like jkinetic and jkrantz. I'm guessing they are quite good, but was curious if anyone had any thoughts (or conjecture - this is NVG after all).

[J.A.Sucker]

I don't know nor do I really care too much about these kind of dick-measuring contests. If you want to beat up on me, go ahead - I can take it. Remember that I have been winning for a long time in some pretty big games, so I must be doing something right.

There are several players that I would let play my money anytime in poker games, though. Most of them have been named in this thread, so I will not bother. They are all the big winners in some tough games.

FWIW, I do play a lot of online poker these days, and have been for several months. In fact, I haven't been to Bay 101 in about a month. I haven't played any games with more than 6 players in them during that time, all at stakes 100-200 and above, and I'm far from starving. Most games have 3 or 4 players. I have played a bit with everyone being mentioned and can make a good evaluation of their play. I do not care to have my screennames or results being made public, nor do I care to let people know where I'm playing, though I'm sure the astute reader can figure these things out. There are only a few posters who know my online handles, and I would appreciate them remaining private.

Thanks for the kind words Ray.

[J.A.Sucker]

I respect your opinion, BK. I am actually a pretty nice guy. We have played a bit together, BTW, and I think you are a formidable opponent and it's clear that you think a great deal about poker.

[HotPants]

[ QUOTE ]
One more point on this topic which has piqued my curiosity. There are a few guys who play very high but don't post very often. Wondering if people had opinions on some of their play. I'm thinking specifically of guys like jkinetic and jkrantz. I'm guessing they are quite good, but was curious if anyone had any thoughts (or conjecture - this is NVG after all).

[/ QUOTE ]

As has been mentioned, PokerMike. On top of going from like .15/.30 to 300/600 in like year and half, he's a nice guy and seems modest. And he doesn't seem to post much

[astroglide]

[ QUOTE ]
a year ago astro would have cleaned up in the limit category

[/ QUOTE ]

thanks, i think. no longer posting/reading in the strat forums doesn't help in the PR dept!

honestly i have given up all contention for this sort of contest by 8-tabling the 30/60 instead of playing in high limit online games. i am still employed, and i like that for the sake of balance. i don't have the freedom to scout for fish 24/7 on different poker sites, and i think that makes playing in those games a worse proposition. certainly i would get handed my head if i sat down in a shorthanded game with any of these guys, but i wouldn't do that.

[MattSuspect]

[ QUOTE ]
No need to bring your moronic buddies into things. I wouldn't kill you, just choke you out to unconsiousness. Then I would bend down next to your exhausted body and taste your sweet tears. Maybe even fart right in your face with my pants down to degrade you.

[/ QUOTE ]

hahahaha

[mikech]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
No need to bring your moronic buddies into things. I wouldn't kill you, just choke you out to unconsiousness. Then I would bend down next to your exhausted body and taste your sweet tears. Maybe even fart right in your face with my pants down to degrade you.

[/ QUOTE ]

hahahaha

[/ QUOTE ]
this is a truly top-notch post.

[TheWorstPlayer]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
No need to bring your moronic buddies into things. I wouldn't kill you, just choke you out to unconsiousness. Then I would bend down next to your exhausted body and taste your sweet tears. Maybe even fart right in your face with my pants down to degrade you.

[/ QUOTE ]

hahahaha

[/ QUOTE ]
this is a truly top-notch post.

[/ QUOTE ]
oh stop being such a nit and dish some dirt. I know you've played with some of these NL guys.

[sublime]

thanks, i think.

yeah, it was definitely a compliment. so much of this 'who is best' is based on perception and hearsay.

how come no one has mentioned johnnyboomboom?

[Sponger.]

[ QUOTE ]
honestly i have given up all contention for this sort of contest by 8-tabling the 30/60 instead of playing in high limit online games. i am still employed, and i like that for the sake of balance. i don't have the freedom to scout for fish 24/7 on different poker sites, and i think that makes playing in those games a worse proposition. certainly i would get handed my head if i sat down in a shorthanded game with any of these guys, but i wouldn't do that.

[/ QUOTE ]

http://www.biology.clc.uc.edu/graphics/taxonomy/animals/aves/Domestic%20Chicken/JSC%200105%20Chicken%2001.JPG

[mikech]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
No need to bring your moronic buddies into things. I wouldn't kill you, just choke you out to unconsiousness. Then I would bend down next to your exhausted body and taste your sweet tears. Maybe even fart right in your face with my pants down to degrade you.

[/ QUOTE ]

hahahaha

[/ QUOTE ]
this is a truly top-notch post.

[/ QUOTE ]
oh stop being such a nit and dish some dirt. I know you've played with some of these NL guys.

[/ QUOTE ]
dude, i am well aware that i'm a little leaguer compared to the heavy hitters here, so i have nothing substantive to add to the thread. however, i'm more than glad to fan the flames of a semi-serious post challenging diablo to a fist-fight!

[TheWorstPlayer]

NIT! Dish dirt! It doesn't have to be true!

[sublime]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
honestly i have given up all contention for this sort of contest by 8-tabling the 30/60 instead of playing in high limit online games. i am still employed, and i like that for the sake of balance. i don't have the freedom to scout for fish 24/7 on different poker sites, and i think that makes playing in those games a worse proposition. certainly i would get handed my head if i sat down in a shorthanded game with any of these guys, but i wouldn't do that.

[/ QUOTE ]

http://www.biology.clc.uc.edu/graphics/taxonomy/animals/aves/Domestic%20Chicken/JSC%200105%20Chicken%2001.JPG

[/ QUOTE ]

dude, keep it up and you will be OPEN CHALLENGED!@!!z

[MattSuspect]

[ QUOTE ]
thanks, i think.

yeah, it was definitely a compliment. so much of this 'who is best' is based on perception and hearsay.

how come no one has mentioned johnnyboomboom?

[/ QUOTE ]

Good point Sublime! A little birdie told me there was a bottles sighting in the upper limits of party this weekend.


P.S. Didn't we all decide a long time ago that Nate was the best?

[El Diablo]

PokerPrince,

I will be bringing my OOT friend Randle as backup to this fight, but he is gay, so I doubt you'll be worried at all.

I'll PM you when I go to either Vegas or Whistler and we can meet up for a fight there.

[J.A.Sucker]

Somebody better get a noogie, a tittie twister, a purple nurple, an atomic wedgie, or just plain served out of all of this. I don't care who it is, but I want pics.

[baronzeus]

Yeah, there's no way I should be listed in the top 3. Maybe top 10 or top 20, but I'm still fairly new to LHE and have been working on my game day in and day out to keep moving up. On the other hand, I think I have improved fairly quickly and adapted to new games better than most people would be able to, and it has been very helpful to my success.

If I had to pick a list of best players it would be somtehing like this.

1-5: stoxtrader, bk, pokermike, j_v, nikla
6-10: james, some other people, maybe me?
...
...
...
...
...
1million+: Schneids.

[Schneids]

Everyone has totally forgot about Steve G, he should be on some lists.

[baronzeus]

[ QUOTE ]
Everyone has totally forgot about Steve G, he should be on some lists.

[/ QUOTE ]


Yes, SteveG is definitely top 10 IMO.

[PokerPrince]

I don't remember actually offering up a challenge, just stating I'de like to fight you. I'll probably see you wsop time or something hanging around and I'm sure we'll meet. You'de probably be a lot cooler in person, but if you were a dick I'de definately imbed your teeth in my knuckles....or maybe a Paul Orndorf piledriver onto a craps table or something. Ya ya ya, you've got money(yippy), uh huh you are great at the game(blah blah blah), yes your IQ is higher than most(yadayada). Tell us all again so we remember and the masses of sheep on here can flock to their master and suck on his balls with envy. I dunno maybe you weren't cool/popular in highschool and want to make up for it now on here or something. Anyways like I said I'm sure we'll eventually meet up and then I can access whether you're worth jail time or not.

[Losing all]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't remember actually offering up a challenge, just stating I'de like to fight you. I'll probably see you wsop time or something hanging around and I'm sure we'll meet. You'de probably be a lot cooler in person, but if you were a dick I'de definately imbed your teeth in my knuckles....or maybe a Paul Orndorf piledriver onto a craps table or something. Ya ya ya, you've got money(yippy), uh huh you are great at the game(blah blah blah), yes your IQ is higher than most(yadayada). Tell us all again so we remember and the masses of sheep on here can flock to their master and suck on his balls with envy. I dunno maybe you weren't cool/popular in highschool and want to make up for it now on here or something. Anyways like I said I'm sure we'll eventually meet up and then I can access whether you're worth jail time or not.

[/ QUOTE ]


I thought you guys were just fuggin around, yikes.

[sng-sam]

ummm. Why hasn't anyone mentioned Gigabet?

Straight Flushes,

SAM

[El Diablo]

LA, Sucker, et al:

I am not worried, since I will have a big gay guy working security for me. I'm sure Prince probably doesn't like gays and will try to kick Randle's ass before mine.

[BluffTHIS!]

El D,

I'm sure either of your buddies ZJ or KKF will have your back. That should be reassuring.

[Caldarooni]

El D,

Is the Prince stuff out of left field, or did you see this coming?

[KDawg]

[ QUOTE ]
El D,

I'm sure either of your buddies ZJ or KKF will have your back. That should be reassuring.

[/ QUOTE ]


wouldn't ZJ just be staring into a mirror in amazement at how good he looks naked?

[El Diablo]

Cald: Prince has never been a big fan

K: Zee doesn't need to fight. He looks so hard nobody would ever f with him.

Bluff: I dunno about KKF or ZJ, but that flawless kid seems pretty crazy from what I hear.

[mikech]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm sure we'll eventually meet up and then I can access whether you're worth jail time or not.

[/ QUOTE ]
diablo, you gotta admit this is pretty funny.

[flawless_victory]

NIGGA, I GOT THIS.

[daryn]

[ QUOTE ]

6-10: james, some other people, maybe me?


[/ QUOTE ]


no.

this is not a rip on you by the way, but facts is facts

[PartyGirlUK]

I can answer who posts the most intelligent advice, which should have a correlation with your question:

Josh W posts excellent limit advice and clearly has a lucid understanding of the game. Likewise Entity and Jason_T for lower limits.

ML4L writes outstanding analysis in the High Stakes NL forum. I will not be buying the DS & EM NL book, but I would buy a book by ML4L in an instant. Cero_Z is not quite as good, but still an excellent poster.

The best overall poker poster by far is flawless_victory. His advance on both limit and NL offering a wide range of stakes is always absolutely excellent. He is able to spot the intracies in a hand, and doesn't just push out standard twoplustwo dictum. I believe he also posts some superb advice in the omaha forum, but I might be imaging that.

Dean

[J_V]

People have forgotten about a lot of people. Hiatus_Over, Nomar, Steve G etc. All great limit holdem players.

The only difference is that the don't post threads with high limit trip reports and such. I'm sure there are many more like them that no one knows about.

[J_V]

I'm not sure if you've played with him or not or how you know this, but in the times that I've played high limit holdem with him, he has played very well. There are a lot of good posters on this forum and ranking them is lame, but he's in the top category from what I have seen in real play.

[flawless_victory]

thx for the praise dude.
i dont post often in the omaha forum because mopst of the regs there play in games i know litle about and dont find interesting... if ppl posted some middle/higher limit non-nutpeddling PLO i would certainly like to discuss... mb i should post some hands, but last time i got v little discussion.

[TheWorstPlayer]

post hands. or at least IM them to me. I love that game.

[DcifrThs]

these rankings are funny. its trying to estimate an ordinal ranking system from an insanely truncated data set.

english: we dont observe a vast majority of the total number of observations of the variable of interest (imagine a huge library of all 2p2's total cummulative PT records). further, those instances that we do observe 1 person's complete stats, there is obviously a massive amount of sample selection bias going on.

before i met people like JV, i didn't know how good he was. before i talked to schneids and crew, i had no clue who nikla was. both of those have to be somewhere near the top for most limit catagories.

anyways, i think in terms of people ive played with, against and talked in depth with. for that, i owe people and they are who i thank and think of when this kind of thread pops up...clearly that serves no purpose to rank them objectively but its just what comes to mind.

oh yea...and to add another obviously minor problem with the observations we do see, apparantly there may be some variance associated those results...so variance may be a teensy tinsy determinant here.

Barron

[PokerBob]

[ QUOTE ]
its trying to estimate an ordinal ranking system from an insanely truncated data set.


[/ QUOTE ]

nerd-speak always cracks me up. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[jhall23]

[ QUOTE ]
thx for the praise dude.
i dont post often in the omaha forum because mopst of the regs there play in games i know litle about and dont find interesting... if ppl posted some middle/higher limit non-nutpeddling PLO i would certainly like to discuss... mb i should post some hands, but last time i got v little discussion.

[/ QUOTE ]

I would love it if you posted some PLO hands. Unfortunately since there is very little game selection in mid limits that board kinda sucks cause it goes from us posting .5/1 or 1/2 hands to the next regular action being at 10/20 more or less. I went through the archives once and for a time it was a little better with Pete Fabrizo (?sp) Big Dave and a few others posting.

Also BluffThis! is possibly paranoid and will never post hands for fear of giving away info to his opponents.

[Rduke55]

[ QUOTE ]
It's ridiculous (please people, note the correct spelling of this word, there is no "e" in it)

[/ QUOTE ]

I was just going to make a post in OOT on this exact word. I can't take it anymore. We have guys with an IQ of a billion playing for assloads of money that can't spell common words.

[Josh W]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
It's ridiculous (please people, note the correct spelling of this word, there is no "e" in it)

[/ QUOTE ]

I was just going to make a post in OOT on this exact word. I can't take it anymore. We have guys with an IQ of a billion playing for assloads of money that can't spell common words.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yep. The two that get me the most or r"e"diculous and defin"a"te (people...it has the same root as infinite...It's not infinate!!). And if people learn how to properly use apostrophes in "it's"/"its", I'll start to weep tears of joy.

[4_2_it]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
It's ridiculous (please people, note the correct spelling of this word, there is no "e" in it)

[/ QUOTE ]

I was just going to make a post in OOT on this exact word. I can't take it anymore. We have guys with an IQ of a billion playing for assloads of money that can't spell common words.

[/ QUOTE ]

Hey morans, you would get pwned hard if you posted that in OOT.

[TheWorstPlayer]

Why don't you nits go nuts about 'seperate'?

[Rduke55]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
It's ridiculous (please people, note the correct spelling of this word, there is no "e" in it)

[/ QUOTE ]

I was just going to make a post in OOT on this exact word. I can't take it anymore. We have guys with an IQ of a billion playing for assloads of money that can't spell common words.

[/ QUOTE ]

Hey morans, you would get pwned hard if you posted that in OOT.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not talking 2+2speak or obvious typos.

[PTjvs]

Constructed (Type 2): Paluka
Limited (Both draft and sealed) ZeeJustin

[baronzeus]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm not sure if you've played with him or not or how you know this, but in the times that I've played high limit holdem with him, he has played very well. There are a lot of good posters on this forum and ranking them is lame, but he's in the top category from what I have seen in real play.

[/ QUOTE ]


Thanks for the praise J_V, I've said the same about you. In fact I'm shocked daryn made a judgment about me without ever playing with me (with that 50/100 game 2 months ago aside).

[Josh W]

[ QUOTE ]
Why don't you nits go nuts about 'seperate'?

[/ QUOTE ]

Don't certain things bother you more than other things?

[4_2_it]

Rduke,

For many, rediculous falls into this category. Also, remember that English is not the first language of some posters, so you can't hammer someone too hard for phonetic errors just because they are from Portugal.

Regards,

4_2

[Josh W]

[ QUOTE ]
Rduke,

For many, rediculous falls into this category. Also, remember that English is not the first language of some posters, so you can't hammer someone too hard for phonetic errors just because they are from Portugal.

Regards,

4_2

[/ QUOTE ]

The last I'll say on this because this hijack has gone on waaaay too long. I took care to point this out in response to NOBODY. I'm not pointing out anybody's error. I'm just pointing out common errors.

Josh

[Dids]

baron,

I think one of the reasons that your rep isn't fantastic is that (and I say this without malice) a lot of us remember slightly less than awesome posts you made that made you go "'wow, this guy's reasoning is BAD".

To your credit, all reports from people I know and trust and have watched you say that you have improved a ton. I think it's just that somebody who has run as well/improved as much as you have in a short time is going to leave some people less that convinced.

Mostly though, caring what people think is lame. Just make money and stuff.

[grahamb]

Love the MTG reference /images/graemlins/smile.gif I know Gary Wise is kicking about here somewhere, he could be a limited contender if he still played. He still doesn't have a card made with his picture on it though.

[adi]

best nl player is bLDrwTRs (or whatever the [censored] his name is...). he table captain's every 2k 6max table on party.

[hellbender]

[ QUOTE ]
...I think it's just that somebody who has run as well as you...

[/ QUOTE ]

Would people STFU about this? Yes, God has not historically despised baron, but he also plays better than 99% of 2+2'ers. And it's not close.

[palman]

I'm sure this may be a relatively common name..... But there was a guy I used to play Red Alert with all the time, and at the upper levels it was quite the strategy game, so it wouldn't surprise me in the least if it happenned to be the same guy. All I can remember is that he was European and pretty much considered the best all time at the game, anyone who knows him know if this sounds familiar or could ask him?

[Dids]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
...I think it's just that somebody who has run as well as you...

[/ QUOTE ]

Would people STFU about this? Yes, God has not historically despised baron, but he also plays better than 99% of 2+2'ers. And it's not close.

[/ QUOTE ]

There's a lot of people who would disagree with the statement you just made.

Moreover, ever if he's that good, he's still for the most part ran better than his theoretical expectation.

[baronzeus]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
...I think it's just that somebody who has run as well as you...

[/ QUOTE ]

Would people STFU about this? Yes, God has not historically despised baron, but he also plays better than 99% of 2+2'ers. And it's not close.

[/ QUOTE ]

There's a lot of people who would disagree with the statement you just made.

Moreover, ever if he's that good, he's still for the most part ran better than his theoretical expectation.

[/ QUOTE ]


There's really no point in debating it. It's impossible to say exactly how good a player is without playing with him for an extended period of time. And it always looks like a player is better when he is running good than when he is running bad.

[Jihad]

I am the best 2/4 6m player alive.

[PartyGirlUK]

Adanthar's excellent showing in the PS million guaranteed reminded me of this thread. I wanted to see if I had mentioned his name, but I failed miserably. He has been for a long time the best poster in the STT forum, and it is no surprise to see him doing so well. FWIW I am pretty sure I have mentioned how awesome a poster he is before, and have certainly PMed him about it.

While we are talking about tournament players, 'Lloyd' deserves special mention. His analysis is also outstanding, and it is clear that he and Adanthar both think about poker very brilliantly.

[nation]

If Diablo and PP throw down, I'd like a PM from someone about the location and fight details..

Pictures of both would help also.

[El Diablo]

nation,

PP and I have discussed offline and have decided that instead of battling each other, we will concentrate our efforts on meeting in Vegas and destroying hookers, coke, blackjack, and craps.

[SackUp]

[ QUOTE ]
nation,

PP and I have discussed offline and have decided that instead of battling each other, we will concentrate our efforts on meeting in Vegas and destroying hookers, coke, blackjack, and craps.

[/ QUOTE ]

not a bad alternative

[+(ll.ll)+]

best tourney player - ZJProdigy

[neverforgetlol]

i'd play diablo in O8, i don't think he has any idea how to play that game shorthanded.

[BeerMoney]

Stud: Carlos Chadha, Jeffage, Dave Bartholow.

[BeerMoney]

[ QUOTE ]
Not very big, no fight training. Just a lot of hatred and rage pent up in my heart and soul. Not necessarily towards you but life in general. I do however think that you LOVE to feel like the alpha male and come on here cause you get respect from dweebs and it makes you feel good. It's human nature with nothing really wrong with it, who doesn't want to feel good about themselves? But I think a good strong beating would take your ego down a notch or two and I'de like to be the one to deliver said beating. Even a knife fight would work.

[/ QUOTE ]

PokerPrince, I've always liked you. Especially when you stole that $30 from that old man and bought a large steak and cheese sub with it.

[Schneids]

For LHE, Turning Stone Pro

[nath]

[ QUOTE ]
nation,

PP and I have discussed offline and have decided that instead of battling each other, we will concentrate our efforts on meeting in Vegas and destroying hookers, coke, blackjack, and craps.

[/ QUOTE ]

By destroying do you mean "conquering" or "eliminating from the land"?

[maurile]

[ QUOTE ]
j.a. sucker is clearly one of the best posters for limit holdem especially counting both online and live play. he has my respect in both and if he would write a limit holdem book with me i would do it. so there.

[/ QUOTE ]
Bump (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=5600048&an=0&page=0#Post 5600048)

[anduril]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
uhhhhhhh

Colson
Sirio
ZJ

[/ QUOTE ]

Limit?

[/ QUOTE ]

Sirio for MTT
Colson for Omaha
ZJ for NL

I don't know [censored] about limit players so I won't pretend to...but BicycleKick sounds like an excellent choice

[/ QUOTE ]

yes, I agree Colson is the best Omaha player. He has played 1 tournament and took 2nd in it so he has never not gotten to the final table of an Omaha tourney. Clearly the best.

[RubbleRobble]

thank you el diablo, you are prolly the only reason i've laughed readin a 2p2 post since ive got here.

you are a scholar and a gentleman.