a pretty decent year

[BalugaWhale]

This was supposed to get posted yesterday, but I am lazy.

A year ago, on May 29th, 2006, I deposited 100 dollars on party. Prior to then, I had been an unsuccessful micro limit LHE player, and then went busto as an unsuccessful micro NLHE player. There is a great old post of a guy named viper090 or something berating me for being terrible and offering advice.

Anyways, today I am a regular in the 5/10 and 10/20 games on Full Tilt. I buy cool shtt sometimes, or sometimes I travel, or I help my friends when they need it. It is nice.

So, the purpose of this post is to let you guys know, as the uNL grinders, that it is definitely possible, and it doesn't even take that long.

I'm going to open this to questions, although I will be dropping in and out because I am traveling shortly and don't have infinite time.

I imagine that a question might be "how can I do this?", and the answer is that you need to be dedicated to learning the game. I decided a while ago that I'm not necessarily playing for hourly wage right now, but rather that I am playing to become the best I can. Sometimes I spew horribly because of this, but it helps me learn a lot.

Since learning is the most important thing, take advantage of 2p2, cause its basically a poker school taught by actual winners. Differentiating between the winners and the losers advice is a skill taht is necessary in real life as well.
A quick word on coaching: my poker success has gotten me a great job coaching poker for 3-bet.net, and it has helped me understand coaching a lot better. Here is how I feel--a coach is not necessary at all. I didn't have one. However, they can be a great tool to help you get out of a rut, fix some recurring mental mistakes, and add new thought processes to your game. It's kinda like a personal trainer in sports; you don't need one to get strong or fast, but a good one can really help.

off of coaching and back to this year. I've ran well and bad, I've had huge downswings and massive upswings. The point, though, is that I am still trying to get better. So, when you go on 2p2, or when you look at PT, or when you play a session... what are you doing?

Sorry of this is a brag post, I just like to throw a little inspiration to my homies still livin in the struggle.

PS: i am not a winner yet at 10/20, but I am working on it.

ask any question you want, if you want

gl to everyone for this year, what i'm calling year #2

booya

PPS stay in school

[jafeather]

Did you make most of your $$$ on Party, or FT, or elsewhere? Today do you play exclusively at FT, or do you play at multiple sites?

[ShipitFMA]

How bad is it playing 38/26/1.75 6max 25nl at party? (presuming you're a decent post flop player, running the table and can make decent reads/laydowns)

[Atlanta Andrew]

What was your process for taking shots as you moved up the ladder, in relation to bankroll?

How many hands did you play per month over the past year?

Thanks,
Andrew

[duke186]

how many hands did it take? how many tables, how many hours? is there anyway you go post your pt stats through the levels?

[Quester]

Thanks for doing this. My questions are:

1. What are the biggest differences in your opponents style as you move up in limits (e.g. difference between 50NL and 100NL, difference between 100NL and 200NL, etc.)?

2. Related to #1, what were the biggest changes you have had to make to your game in order to adapt to each higher limit?

[Gelford]

Name the top 3 most important things that made you what you are .. (Reviewing, pokerstoving, some posters posts, errr ... )

[Bonesy]

Did you have poker acquaintances or friends that you would discuss hands regularly with? Was the 2+2 forum enough to make the jumps you made?

[creamfillin]

How do you typically play a medium pair readless when a single overcard flops? How do you decide whether to go into "bluff catcher mode" or whether to rep the overcard. What is the best way to extract value in these situations. Thanks

[kazana]

Thanks for doing this. I love well style threads.

You said that one day you decided to become a dedicated student of the game. Could you please name us a few examples of what behaviors/approaches you have changed from before that particular day?

[Chomp]

Baluga,

Grats on success - genuinely an inspiration to medicore grinders like me.


1. How good is your math and how important is it as you move up? Do any of your good reg 2+2 opponants have bad math?

2. How often in a day do you get all your money in the middle excluding the times you do it for value (ie looking for FE/pure bluff etc.)? Is this a more important skill the higher you play?

3. How far can ~20/18 take a player?

4. What is the best method you've found for leak-hunting? (Coaching? Something with PT? Other?)


I could ask 100 questions, but I'll leave it there to allow others the chance. I'll definitely have more questions if this thread is long though!

Oh, and MS/HS players contributions down here in the dungeon are always very much appreciated even if it's not explicitly stated when you post here.


Cheers.

[munkey]

Thanks for doing this Whale.

I know this is a good opportunity but can't think of what to ask :sigh: . My confidence is a little shaky at the mo having not played for a while and recently got burnt on my return despite running good lst month.

How do you deal with keeping your confidence?

[BalugaWhale]

jafeather: most came from FT post legislation

shipitfma: pretty bad imo, a totally unnecessary variance rollercoaster

atlantaandrew: tight name first off. I made a post about this; check out the sticky. I play about 40k hands per month usually; although less being in Morocco.

duke: im not going to post all of my stats (although 3bet may be selling my 400nl database soon), but i usually played 6-8 tables. I played pretty sparingly, actually, because i like to have a life.

quester: ok, so in micros, everyone is an idiot so you dont try tricky things... you cr all in on the turn with monsters, you vbet and avoid bluffing. easy enough, those are the fundamentals. However, after people learn the fundamentals (100nl imo) you learn to manipulate their ideas... i.e. he always assumes a turn cr is a huge hand (cause it is at smaller stakes) so we cr draws and stuff. 600nl is where it really gets hard to win i think

gelford: three things
1) not having expenses ie being in college. I was able to devote pretty much all my cash to my br, that helped me move up fast
2) 2p2
3) being pissed about losing like 500 dollars to douchebags when I was in hs, haha

bonesy: 2p2 helps a lot... i am friends in rl with yvesaint and moonshine, and they are both good... mostly just myself thinking about the game though

cream filling: i think about the equity of my hand. 66 on a 52A 2tone board has a lot less equity than QQ on that board, so I am more tempted to turn my 66 hand into a bluff. and its pretty hard always to get value there by betting, so its either bluff catching or bluffing.

[ADK]

best advice from moving up from NL100>NL200>NL400 ? How did your play change when moving up each stake?

I'm going to move up to NL200 soon, and eager to grind out NL400 as soon as I can ( a while yet).. so im just curious.

[BalugaWhale]

kazana: its really just about reflection... how you think instead of what you think. Sometimes I will think about a hand after a session and say, holy shtt yeah, i always call there, i need to be always folding there. A great example is facing river bets when you have a weak hand, like A2s on a AJ845 board... i bet flop, he called OOP, we both checked turn, then he fired river... i used to just call there always until I was like, what is he betting? Then I realized hes almost always Vbetting there (at higher limits)

chomp: my math is average, and i dont think its vital... understanding what the math means is vital, but the real EV calcs all depend on what you feel his range is. If you think his range is sets and missed draws, but you think he has sets 90 percent of the time, your personal EV 'feel' will be way diff than poker stove.

I get my money all in a lot.

20/18 can make you broke if you dont know how to think, or it can make you rich if you do. Many consider FSUplayer to be one of the best online pros, and he plays a tag game if i remember correctly.

thinking about my sessions is the best way to find leaks... maybe I will try something like calling with speculative hands and c/r flops, and thatll work great for a while until everyone catches on, and then I need to not do that anymore... PT cant really tell me that players X and Y know that I am cr light now.

munkey: the best way to fix confidence is to make a commitment to confidence. it means that you play in games where you know its +EV, and if you dont know, you dont play.

[BalugaWhale]

ADK: just try thinking about how your opponents are thinking. what lines represent strength to them? which ones represent weakness? usually, 200nl players have a pretty rigid idea of what means strong and what means weak, and we can take advantage of that

[yellowbluebus]

How do you personally deal with downswings and what keeps you motivated to keep playing during those times as per you BBV 10/20 experience thread?

What was your bankroll management approach as it relates to moving up the stakes when you first started?

[shyturtle27]

What steps did you take when moving up? Did you just add in a single table of the new level at a time or did you just leap up and multitable the next level as much as the last level?

[Worm75]

How much does game selection play a part in your ability to win at any level??

[fees]

What was ur BI for moving up? I'm having insane trouble making the switch from .5/1 to 1/2 .. like I cant beat it despite horrific player, over pretty massive sample

How many tables did you play coming up? did you play like 8 50NL tables but when you got to 2/4 you went down to 4? how closely do you focus on you're opponents?

[Gelford]

A new quick question ... how do you run (ignoring that it might be situational)

Snaredrum tight tag .. or as lag as the table will allow you ?

[sebbb]

Baluga, I'd like to thank you for the inspiration... I plan to follow your steps and hopefully move up at the same pace as you have. Right now I'm confident in beating 25NL and 50NL and I'm trying to move up to 100NL
Love your post on moving up and confidence btw.

Question:

1) Do you recommend choosing a few good posters and read all their posts in the last 6 months? Who would you recommend that posts regularly in SSNL/uNL?

2) You talked about the necessary confidence and skill to move up in stakes. What would be the necessary confidence and skill to go pro?
I want to take a break from the job scene and it would be cool if I could make some money during that time (say at least $5000/per month). But I'm gonna wait until I'm skilled and confident. So what would I need for that? 50k hands at 400NL with a 4PTBB/100 rate?

Thanks

[S.Clause]

Did you apply any table-leaving rules like "quitting after dubble/tripple up" or "quitting after 2 hours without significant profit" etc. ?

[BalugaWhale]

yellow bus: I drink heavily and think about how sweet the return to the mean will be. Sometimes I have taken breaks, some time off, but I don't play that much as it is, so its no big deal.

as for all the bankroll questions, I was reasonably aggressive, but tried not to play with less than 20 buyins at any given limit.

as for multitabling: i think it is totally vital. I played as many tables (if not more) as I went up... as you get past 400nl, you have to play a mix of 10/20, 5/10, and 3/6, just because there usually aren't enough games. So, I play usually 6-8 tables of mixed action.

worm75: game selection is crucial at high limits where most players are good but not as important imo at smaller stakes where most players are terrible. At any given time, 95% of uNL tables are great to make a good profit imo.

fees: I focus on my opponents some, but more importantly i focus on the interactions between myself and my opponents. Maybe I have 3bet a guy 4 hands in 2 orbits... I know now that he is going to have to play back at me soon, and that changes his hand ranges. Or, maybe I haven't played a pot with a guy for an hour, and now he raises big on the flop. These dynamics change the way I place their hand ranges and thus the comparative strength of my hand.

gelford: I can control my table image when I play, so when everyone thinks I am playing LAG i play TAG and when everyone thinks I am tight as a rock I open it up. This is really important for manipulating opponents.

sebbb: I think the Grunch is a good poster, AJmargarine is a good poster, jamougha... but a lot of the good posters from my time have already moved up so it is tough. Just be inquisitive and create your own good posters. I think Jay Riall might be good too, but id unno.

As for going pro, go when you have a comfortable income and can afford to lose money. Don't ever play with money you can't afford to lose. I am "pro" because I have no expenses... we'll see what happens when I graduate in 2 years.

S. Clause: no

[ama0330]

Jay riall is a sick baller, UK style pimp.

BW, what do you think is better - 6 tables of 50nl, or 3 tables of 100nl? Assuming that you can beat 50nl for 5-6/100, and have 2k br.

[BalugaWhale]

ama-
depends what you want. If you want to make a little money now, then 6 tables of 50nl. If you want to make a shttload of money in a few months, 3 tables of 100nl.

[ssdex]

balugawhale,

with regards of moving up/moving down, early in my poker career I was bad but ran really hot and made it all the way (properly rolled) to 5/10 at pokerroom..... then the running hot ended and I had a 35 buyin downswing at 2/4.... i quit cash for awhile and went back to my bread and butter, mtts. Then aug last year i gave cash a shot again, focusing a lot on hu..... i ran up real good, especially at ub. then in january (like the 4th) i unloaded my ub into neteller with plans of spreading it across sites and it got locked. i was left with 1/17th of my bankroll all at stars. Since then I have made a crazy run... i move between 50nl-200nl but I just kill 50nl--- like 7ptbb and I dont do nearly as well at 100nl-200nl. Anyways i move up and down a lot b/c i swing a lot..... ive had 3 20 buyin downswings or more in the last 3 months but ive also had 2 70+ buyin upswings.... when do you decide to move down? when im in my downswings I try to stay where I am b/c i feel like im just running bad, but maybe not? When neteller unlocks im going to be moving way up..... what advice do you have for moving up and down between 200nl and 1000nl

[EMc]

Can I have 1000 dollars?

[BalugaWhale]

ssdex--

70 buyin downswings are a little much. There are probably some serious leaks in your game.
My advice is to move down when you're not rolled, and to move up when the games look good. Don't just take a shot because you want to, take a shot because the games are good and you are confident its +EV. If you want to take a shot at 25/50 and you see a table with CTS, Dustin Dirksen, Luc Longley, and Durr, you don't sit. If you see a table with Matusow, maybe you do /images/graemlins/wink.gif

Ed: if you could find a way to turn that 1000 into 10,000 in a year, and gave me the 9,000 profit, then yes, you can have 1000 dollars

[bozzer]

Baluga,

Congrats on the year. I read your 'analysis of a downswing' post again recently and couldn't believe you were busto at $25nl a year ago. Very inspirational.

I read somewhere that you got tighter as you moved up the limits. Can you fill in a bit more detail about how your VPIP/PFR numbers have changed?

I'm interested because I run a bit looser than most of the posters here (although not 38/26 lol). I think it's pretty easy to play 26/21 or whatever at uNL because people don't seem to play back much. If I don't start thinking a lot more about how people are adjusting to me, am I likely to be spewing vs decent TAGs at higher stakes than $50?


Thanks for doing this (and thanks for the other times you've popped down with cryptic advice: it's really appreciated).

[AZplaya]

BW,
I remember folding QQ to your 4 bet all in pre flop at NL$50 on party. You showed 99. That was last June. A good year indeed. VNH sir!

[Bowlboy]

Baluga nice post and congrats on all your success. Sorry to echo but it is an inspiration.

What advice can you offer for uNL players who are playing 9 tables such as myself at 25NL who are planning on going full time? Bankroll management is pretty simple but when you have to come up with a certain amount of winnings each week/month to pay the bills. I'm sure you've got tons of experience with this sort of thing.

[Ikaika]

Baluga, thanks for doing this, I really like your posts.

I'd like to hear your thoughts on what you feel improved your hand reading the most. I hear a lot of people say that its just a "feel" thing or that it comes from experience, but obviously in just a year you've gotten exceptionally good at it.

[EMc]

[ QUOTE ]
BW,
I remember folding QQ to your 4 bet all in pre flop at NL$50 on party. You showed 99. That was last June. A good year indeed. VNH sir!

[/ QUOTE ]

I remember us both playing 100 and 200nl in July. I have a lot of Whale memories

[ssdex]

whale, those were 70 buyin upswings or heaters------ just a few 20 buyin downswings along the way

[ettorek]

First of all thanks for doing this.
What kept you up in the dark days when you wasn't able to beat the game? And when you've understood that you were at the turning point?
Is it deleterious to mix up cash with SNG/MTT ?
To improve it's better to play one hour every day or 4 hours a couple of days?
Thanks!

[rakes.a.beach]

Should I get tinker to coach me? I'm struggling to beat 100NL right now. I broke even in May after 20k hands. I feel like I ran pretty bad, and I'd be able to beat it. Should I get a coach right now or see if I can beat it in June first?

[BalugaWhale]

bozzer: as for stats, I moved from a 24/20 to a 19/16 and then back towards 24/20... I am pretty sure that 19/16 can be pretty damn close to optimal. Obviously these things change depending on a lot of stuff, but it is hard to go wrong by playing tight.

AZplaya: haha yeah we both played that hand so badly. booya

bowlboy: i actually dont have a ton of experience with that, as I am a college student with basically no expenses except pizza. but, I think if you can successfully 9table 50nl, you can definitely be thinking about moving up to 100 and 200nl asap.

ikaika: its not a feel thing, its a thinking thing. how much information are you using? Hand reading is more than just "what is the board, and did it hit him?"... if we're putting together hand ranges, we have to realize that those ranges change based on table dynamics, past history, positions, the types of players at a table... if monkey idiot limps, then I raise, then good player reraises from the SB... hes probably got a good hand, because he'd rather play a pot with the monkey idiot than isolate OOP vs me. unless I am the monkey idiot, which happens.

Ed: your a baller, you should win some money and then move up.

ettorek: i never played SNG or MTT (although I may start playing the Sunday ones on stars, i'm not sure). I play, in terms of hours, however many I feel like when I feel like it. What kept me up in the dark times when it feels hopeless? I hate losing. Turning points happen all the time, like when I realized when cts sits down I should just leave. That was a turning point.

rakes.a.beach: i wont judge tinkner or anyone else for coaching. as i said before, coaching isn't necessary but it can be good.
there are plenty of good coaches at 3-bet.net though /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[tiger_hall]

how long and how many days in a row would you say is optimal to play until you start tilting??

[bozzer]

BW:

thanks for the answer.

how come you're in morocco?

[BalugaWhale]

tiger_hall: it shouldn't matter how long you play...?

bozzer: i study arabic.. plus its tight as hell. I am stranded in barca now though... soo if anyone wants to party in barca tonight PM me

[barryc83]

BW,

did you ever do that bet vs. the collegiate pitcher? if you did, howd it turn out?

[bozzer]

Having moved through the levels in the past year I'm I'm interested where you think most uNL posters/players will end up.

If we take 100 posters who are evenly spread across the uNL stakes and all have >100 posts, in 6 months what percentage will end up:

quit for non poker reasons
busto and quit
still in uNL
in SSNL
in MSNL

?

What odds would you give me or Barryc83 (to pick two random $50 players) reaching 10-20 in a year from now?

[Voy Por Ustedes]

I'll lay £500 pounds at odds of your choice. /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[BalugaWhale]

barryc- not yet. I want to. He was conference player of the year for his division. I am so fckked.

bozzer- i think probably 60% will quit for either busto or nonpoker reasons. I think about 30% will be in uNL, about 8% in SSNL, and about 2% in MSNL.

[chris216]

How many tables would you recommend playing for learning and moving up quickly? I 6-table NL25 and I plan to play only 4 tables for a while whenever I move up. My goal is to beat NL200 as soon as possible.