50NL: Family pot with lots of ???'s

[SirFelixCat]

Good calls vs 39/14 153 and 68/4/1.0 over 75...? The BB is the 39/14...but I figured that if he has an overpair (KK or AA), I'm getting the implied odds to call on the flop (4:1 pot odds immediately). Preflop, on the button, and with all the calls, I figured it was a standard call. The turn, well again, if he's on an overpair, I now have a gutter and a flush draw, figuring he has at most 1 spade. His turn bet is soooo weak....

Thoughts on all streets appreciated.

Full Tilt Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.25/$0.50 Blinds - 6 Players - (LegoPoker HH Converter (http://www.legopoker.com/hh/))

<u>Hero (SB): $53.20</u>
<u>BB: $70.40</u>
UTG: $28.50
<u>MP: $13.80</u>
CO: $28.75
BTN: $47.25

<font color="black">Preflop:</font> Hero is dealt 7/images/graemlins/spade.gif 5/images/graemlins/spade.gif (6 Players)
UTG folds, MP calls $0.50, CO calls $0.50, BTN folds, Hero calls $0.25, <font color="red">BB raises to $2.50</font>, MP calls $2, CO calls $2, Hero calls $2

<font color="black">Flop:</font> ($10) 3/images/graemlins/diamond.gif 9/images/graemlins/club.gif 4/images/graemlins/spade.gif (4 Players)
Hero checks, <font color="red">BB bets $5</font>, MP calls $5, CO folds, Hero calls $5

<font color="black">Turn:</font> ($25) T/images/graemlins/spade.gif (3 Players)
Hero checks, <font color="red">BB bets $7</font>, MP calls all-in for $6.30, Hero calls $7

[CaptUnlucky]

Hmmm... I think PF is ok after MP and CO both call.
On flop with gutter and running flush I would be looking for more than 4:1 immediate odds, and implied odds aren't looking great because, as you said, BB's betting looks really weak and you're OOP... I just don't like the flop call.

As played, I guess call the turn with the odds you're getting...

[jmgambler]

Am I missing something here?...... I dont get what we are even doing here, no offense..... OOP,low suited one gapper? even with MP &amp; CO along for the ride its not worth it IMHO.

The Flop.... I still dont get what we are doing here..

The turn...... well you have spewed so much money at this point, that the turn is an easy call.

Players like you I either love or hate... dependent if your being lucky or not ...lol

[AnyMouse]

implied odds for a running flush are always good because it's uncommon, so can be a very nice addition to other draws/med strong made hand.

i'm not sure you can really call the flop bet without expecting to be getting all in if you hit. reading the bettor as weak does not facilitate this sort of outcome, so it's probably not a great call.

if you knew he was overaggressive or liked to bluff/shove rivers for thin value it would be much better. as it is, i don't like it.

once you get to turn, all your outs should be good (unless someone has a freak AsKs) so call. put in a healthy bet if you hit on the river, since villain almost definitely tries to check down (esp with one player AI).

[poon]

meh i wouldnt call pf unless i had bb coverd. If MP wasnt all in i'd say raise up the turn. IMO calling the flop is spewage unless ur floating him and have him coverd.

[0evg0]

lol at folding preflop, that's so ridiculously terrible

like as terrible as your flop call. wtf WE HAVE A GUTSHOT

[NL Newbie]

Fold pre, OMGOSH 25:1 im like always stacking someone if i flop my flush or straight SERIOUSSLLYYYY.

Fold flop too, barely getting 10:1 and praying he pays you off, seriously your being to optimistic with these implied odds.

Turn is fine, but you wasted tonnes of cash getting here.

[0evg0]

dude, folding preflop is absolutely retarded

[jotta]

Easy call preflop.
Fold flop.

As played, call the turn.

[AnyMouse]

excellent analysis.

you monkey.

[jmgambler]

[ QUOTE ]
dude, folding preflop is absolutely retarded

[/ QUOTE ]

Maybe, but even 4-1, what flop are we looking for here?

save for (775...odds 1087-1) our 118-1 flopped flush is gonna leave us vunerable to another /images/graemlins/spade.gif, and even flopping a flush draw is 8-1, hitting a ragged 2pr is 49-1, trips is 73-1, ....... so forgive me for folding this PF

[SirFelixCat]

I think jmgambler realized that, after his post, that I was on the button. Personally, I like calling in this spot...family pot and in position? More often than not, my postflop game is far superior to most villians, that I can usually get away if I think I'm beaten...

That said, I was wondering what y'all thought, mostly on the flop call. Thin at best, possibly spewage I thought at the time, but thought of this as a sanity check.

That said, this is NOT a 'normal/standard' hand, hence the post. I appreciate the feedback and cooments, on both sides of the fence.

And jm...trust me, I don't think you want me at your table...luck is the least of your concerns there /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[SirFelixCat]

And, just for completion sake:

Full Tilt Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.25/$0.50 Blinds - 6 Players - (LegoPoker HH Converter (http://www.legopoker.com/hh/))

<u>Hero (SB): $53.20</u>
<u>BB: $70.40</u>
UTG: $28.50
<u>MP: $13.80</u>
CO: $28.75
BTN: $47.25

<font color="black">Preflop:</font> Hero is dealt 7/images/graemlins/spade.gif 5/images/graemlins/spade.gif (6 Players)
UTG folds, MP calls $0.50, CO calls $0.50, BTN folds, Hero calls $0.25, <font color="red">BB raises to $2.50</font>, MP calls $2, CO calls $2, Hero calls $2

<font color="black">Flop:</font> ($10) 3/images/graemlins/diamond.gif 9/images/graemlins/club.gif 4/images/graemlins/spade.gif (4 Players)
Hero checks, <font color="red">BB bets $5</font>, MP calls $5, CO folds, Hero calls $5

<font color="black">Turn:</font> ($25) T/images/graemlins/spade.gif (3 Players)
Hero checks, <font color="red">BB bets $7</font>, MP calls all-in for $6.30, Hero calls $7

<font color="black">River:</font> ($45.30) 3/images/graemlins/spade.gif (3 Players - 1 All-In)
<font color="red">Hero bets all-in for $38.70</font>, BB calls $38.70

Pot Size: $122.70 ($3 Rake)

MP had 7/images/graemlins/heart.gif Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (a pair of Threes) and LOST (-$13.80)
BB had A/images/graemlins/heart.gif A/images/graemlins/spade.gif (two pair, Aces and Threes) and LOST (-$53.20)
Hero had 7/images/graemlins/spade.gif 5/images/graemlins/spade.gif (a flush, Ten high) and WON (+$66.50)

[jmgambler]

[ QUOTE ]
I think jmgambler realized that, after his post, that I was on the button. Personally, I like calling in this spot...family pot and in position? More often than not, my postflop game is far superior to most villians, that I can usually get away if I think I'm beaten...

That said, I was wondering what y'all thought, mostly on the flop call. Thin at best, possibly spewage I thought at the time, but thought of this as a sanity check.

That said, this is NOT a 'normal/standard' hand, hence the post. I appreciate the feedback and cooments, on both sides of the fence.

And jm...trust me, I don't think you want me at your table...luck is the least of your concerns there /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

You may well be right about you being at my table...... /images/graemlins/smile.gif , my point was that even on the button and I know everyone disagrees with me... but as I posted afterwards, here about the odds of hitting a good flop for our hand.. to repeat even a 2/images/graemlins/spade.gif flop is 8-1 I just think the times we have to fold the flop vs decent flops is not enough to justify calling here........

[SirFelixCat]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I think jmgambler realized that, after his post, that I was on the button. Personally, I like calling in this spot...family pot and in position? More often than not, my postflop game is far superior to most villians, that I can usually get away if I think I'm beaten...

That said, I was wondering what y'all thought, mostly on the flop call. Thin at best, possibly spewage I thought at the time, but thought of this as a sanity check.

That said, this is NOT a 'normal/standard' hand, hence the post. I appreciate the feedback and cooments, on both sides of the fence.

And jm...trust me, I don't think you want me at your table...luck is the least of your concerns there /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

You may well be right about you being at my table...... /images/graemlins/smile.gif , my point was that even on the button and I know everyone disagrees with me... but as I posted afterwards, here about the odds of hitting a good flop for our hand.. to repeat even a 2/images/graemlins/spade.gif flop is 8-1 I just think the times we have to fold the flop vs decent flops is not enough to justify calling here........

[/ QUOTE ]

I hear what you're saying. I don't think that folding is as horrible as some others are saying. Personally, I think it depends on your playing style. This suits my game, therefore I see it as a +EV spot, both for hitting our hands and outplaying various villains, having position here.
But there are some that prefer a much more....variance-free/tricky situation adverse style and there is nothing wrong with that, imo. Just a difference in style. /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[jmgambler]

hahahahah....... NH, I said call the turn.... the 26-1 runner runner /images/graemlins/spade.gif classic.........

NB.... having said that...BB play bought this on himself

[SirFelixCat]

Yeah, ummm...BB definitely plays goot :giggle: /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[matrix]

preflop is meh.

I call after it's family-o-rama but I don't like it much as my position here absolutely blows and if I don't hit the flop HARD I am done here.

as played fold flop - it's not close. you are getting 4:1

and your equity looks like...

Hand 0: 22.119% 21.82% 00.30% 5851146 80901.00 { 7s5s }
Hand 1: 63.613% 63.57% 00.05% 17047602 12930.00 { TT+ }
Hand 2: 14.268% 13.92% 00.35% 3732690 93831.00 { random }

you have a runner runner flush draw and a gutshot - not even 5 outs.

[0evg0]

[ QUOTE ]
I think jmgambler realized that, after his post, that I was on the button. Personally, I like calling in this spot...family pot and in position? More often than not, my postflop game is far superior to most villians, that I can usually get away if I think I'm beaten...

That said, I was wondering what y'all thought, mostly on the flop call. Thin at best, possibly spewage I thought at the time, but thought of this as a sanity check.

That said, this is NOT a 'normal/standard' hand, hence the post. I appreciate the feedback and cooments, on both sides of the fence.

And jm...trust me, I don't think you want me at your table...luck is the least of your concerns there /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

wtf

if you're button, this is a raise preflop (but you're not, so i odnt get what youre saying)

and i want you at my tables if you keep calling 1/2 psb's on the flop OOP multiway WITH A GUTSHOT

[SirFelixCat]

OK, nm...apparently aliens invaded my body and took over. For the life of me, I thought I was on the button in this hand.

I have no idea what I was thinking here, in hindsight.

Nothing to see here...move on, heh.