Just another tax scared 2+2 member.....

[ongo30]

Well this was my first year with gambling winnings(online). I offset this with gambling losses in Vegas, and varies casino boats. I guess you would say I just about broke even.

I had to do a rough estimate when filing(wasn't sure of the exact numbers). It crossed my mind not to claim any of it, since it balanced out to nil anyway. After reading posts I figured I should report it.

My question is this, has anyone really been audited, or had dealings with the IRS for issues involving around 10k in gambling winnings, or is most of this just talks on legality, and doing the right thing? If anyone has really had an IRS scare please post in this forum.

Thanks

[TrainHardDieHard]

bump, i want to know more info. on this too..

[plasphemy]

I've read about a few strange cases but for the average 10k in winnings player, there is unlikely to be any problems especially if you have a normal job and file recreationally.

If the unlikely event of being audited does actually happen, they won't want to see "rough estimates." Make sure you build a log that looks legit that covers your casino visits with win/loss records.

[Emperor]

[ QUOTE ]
I've read about a few strange cases but for the average 10k in winnings player, there is unlikely to be any problems especially if you have a normal job and file recreationally.

If the unlikely event of being audited does actually happen, they won't want to see "rough estimates." Make sure you build a log that looks legit that covers your casino visits with win/loss records.

[/ QUOTE ]

Do I really give a rats ass what the IRS wants to see? Dont they have to make thier case, with thier own numbers that they acquire from wherever they acquire them from?

not flaming, just wondering how the process works? Surely it is not my job to provide the IRS with evidence of my wrongdoing. :P

[Rainbow Warrior]

[ QUOTE ]
Do I really give a rats ass what the IRS wants to see? Dont they have to make thier case, with thier own numbers that they acquire from wherever they acquire them from?
Surely it is not my job to provide the IRS with evidence of my wrongdoing.

[/ QUOTE ]

lolol
Good one!!!
Post of the year!!!!

[Billman]

[ QUOTE ]

Do I really give a rats ass what the IRS wants to see? Dont they have to make thier case, with thier own numbers that they acquire from wherever they acquire them from?

not flaming, just wondering how the process works? Surely it is not my job to provide the IRS with evidence of my wrongdoing. :P

[/ QUOTE ]

Dude, the whole innocent until proven guilty doesn't apply to the IRS. You are guilty until the IRS says otherwise. The IRS could simply think that your house is too nice for what you make and crawl up your butt with a microscope. They'll put the entire burden of proof on you to prove otherwise.

Oh, and if you get pissy with them, expect them to seize your bank accounts and garnish your wages so you have zero assets while the IRS has unlimited resources to fight you with.

Personally, I would rather be falsely accused of murder than for some IRS auditor to think that I was evading taxes. At least as a criminal suspect you have something resembling a fighting chance.

[Emperor]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Do I really give a rats ass what the IRS wants to see? Dont they have to make thier case, with thier own numbers that they acquire from wherever they acquire them from?

not flaming, just wondering how the process works? Surely it is not my job to provide the IRS with evidence of my wrongdoing. :P

[/ QUOTE ]

Dude, the whole innocent until proven guilty doesn't apply to the IRS. You are guilty until the IRS says otherwise. The IRS could simply think that your house is too nice for what you make and crawl up your butt with a microscope. They'll put the entire burden of proof on you to prove otherwise.

Oh, and if you get pissy with them, expect them to seize your bank accounts and garnish your wages so you have zero assets while the IRS has unlimited resources to fight you with.

Personally, I would rather be falsely accused of murder than for some IRS auditor to think that I was evading taxes. At least as a criminal suspect you have something resembling a fighting chance.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks I had no idea. Not like they teach this kind of thing in Public Schools.

One more reason to abolish the IRS and enact a federal sales tax.

[Better Than U]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Do I really give a rats ass what the IRS wants to see? Dont they have to make thier case, with thier own numbers that they acquire from wherever they acquire them from?

not flaming, just wondering how the process works? Surely it is not my job to provide the IRS with evidence of my wrongdoing. :P

[/ QUOTE ]

Dude, the whole innocent until proven guilty doesn't apply to the IRS. You are guilty until the IRS says otherwise. The IRS could simply think that your house is too nice for what you make and crawl up your butt with a microscope. They'll put the entire burden of proof on you to prove otherwise.

Oh, and if you get pissy with them, expect them to seize your bank accounts and garnish your wages so you have zero assets while the IRS has unlimited resources to fight you with.

Personally, I would rather be falsely accused of murder than for some IRS auditor to think that I was evading taxes. At least as a criminal suspect you have something resembling a fighting chance.

[/ QUOTE ]i think somebody just go PWNED!

nh emperor

[Skallagrim]

If the IRS accuses you of tax crime, they have the burden of proof and you are still innocent until proven guilty. Tax crime generally involves LYING about something.

HOWEVER, when/if the IRS audits you, it demands to see (have you produce) records of your claimed deductions. If you dont have these records (or dont have them in the form the IRS demands) the IRS will strike or lower the deductions thus increasing the amount of tax you must pay.

But it can only accuse you of a crime if it can prove you knowingly lied about those deductions. It is not a crime to keep bad records, but it costs you money if you are audited.

Skallagrim

[RoundGuy]

[ QUOTE ]
It is not a crime to keep bad records, but it costs you money if you are audited.

[/ QUOTE ]
Must you always be so reasonable, Skallagrim? It's far more enjoyable to tell these folks, "ZOMG!, you're going to pound-me-in-the-ass prison!" At least I find it so.

[Rainbow Warrior]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
It is not a crime to keep bad records, but it costs you money if you are audited.

[/ QUOTE ]
Must you always be so reasonable, Skallagrim? It's far more enjoyable to tell these folks, "ZOMG!, you're going to pound-me-in-the-ass prison!" At least I find it so.

[/ QUOTE ]

Me too.

The (young?) American confusion and paranoia over the IRS and taxes is both sad and entertaining.

There's no doubt that the IRS can be tough to deal with and that the gambling tax laws need major reforming.

Still, the concept that anybody's few thousand in undeclared winnings has the potential to merit federal prosecution and incarceration is laughable.

Yeah, there's big +EV in spending 100K to throw your pimply card-playing ass behind bars for a year...it's what they live for.


Rainbow...

[Skallagrim]

OK, OK ... I plead guilty to being "reasonable" in these situations, maybe if I were not people would actually look up the information rather than post requests for it ...

But I really cant help it, its in my nature ... I also brake for small animals and help old ladies cross the road.

[RoundGuy]

[ QUOTE ]
and help old ladies cross the road, explaining in intricate detail the inherrant dangers of female seniors attempting such an excursion without appropriate help.

[/ QUOTE ]
FYP. /images/graemlins/cool.gif

[Poker CPA]

The IRS knows gamblers lie and cheat, so they made the laws so unfair that they only give one option to average "every day" gamblers who want to be fair. And that is; "lie and cheat". Your basic "Catch 22".

And an experienced CPA can get around this "Catch 22" with a proper presentation of your affairs, without setting off the "alarm" in the IRS computers.

Actually the jails for tax cheats are quite nice, golf courses and the like. And God forbid, "Poker Games". Golf, Poker and free food. Where do we sign up?

US online poker rooms will change the tax rules; every one will be taxed on net only. These rooms will withhold 20% on all cash distributions that represent winnings. Good news, Bad news.

[RoundGuy]

[ QUOTE ]
Actually the jails for tax cheats are quite nice, golf courses and the like. And God forbid, "Poker Games". Golf, Poker and free food. Where do we sign up?

[/ QUOTE ]
I know you're just being facetious, but in reality there are no federal prisons in which the inmates may golf. If I recall, there is one where inmates work on a golf course, but never play. That must be how the rumour got started. In addition, gambling is strictly forbidden in federal prison. This will get you 30 days in the hole (county jail) if caught.

It is true, however, that the food is free.

[Poker CPA]

BullChit. Plenty with nine hole golf courses.

[RoundGuy]

[ QUOTE ]
BullChit. Plenty with nine hole golf courses.

[/ QUOTE ]
Really? I have been misinformed (or things have changed in the last 10 years or so). I'd feel better though, if you could name a couple of these prisons for me.

[Poker CPA]

I feel better too. Congrats

[Poker CPA]

File your return with a cover sheet that says "I CHEATED BIG-TIME ON THIS RETURN". The golf course information will be part of the "Indictment vacation package".

[RoundGuy]

[ QUOTE ]
File your return with a cover sheet that says "I CHEATED BIG-TIME ON THIS RETURN". The golf course information will be part of the "Indictment vacation package".

[/ QUOTE ]
Hitting the bottle early today, eh CPA? /images/graemlins/cool.gif

[Poker CPA]

Midnight April 17th, after I finsh the guards tax returns. The "good behavior" crap means something around here. At least I hope.

[ongo30]

Thanks for some of the replies. I'm not worried about going to prison, I'm just wondering say that I didn't declare anything would they even care. I hear these horror stories about what could happen, but I'm yet to hear of anyone actually getting audited. I don't think there are any small stakes players winning 10k and under who have much to worry about.

My only concern would be Neteller turning over their records, and the IRS just hitting everybody on the list with a letter saying you owe money.

By the way Skull you do have the best responses!!

[Poker CPA]

If neteller turns over the records, the IRS will not send a letter demanding back taxes. They will send a letter asking to review your tax return, as filed, and give you a chance to make any necessary changes based on the knowledge that they have Neteller information. They will give you a free pass to "come clean" via an amended return. This will be the procedure for the 10K to 100K taxpayers.

For the 100K (or more) taxpayers, Heaven Help them.