Wrongly playing AK?

[techballer]

Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.05/$0.10
9 players
Converter (http://www.neildewhurst.com/hand-converter)
<font color="blue"> Help on all streets if you see something wrong please.
</font> Stack sizes:
UTG: $3.90
UTG+1: $3.50
MP1: $7.05
MP2: $7.60
MP3: $3.40
CO: $7.80
Button: $9.70
SB: $10.40
Hero: $9.85

Pre-flop: (9 players) Hero is BB with A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif
3 folds, <font color="#cc0000">MP2 raises to $1.2</font>, 4 folds, Hero calls.
<font color="blue"> Should I raise here? </font>
Flop: 6/images/graemlins/spade.gif 6/images/graemlins/club.gif 3/images/graemlins/spade.gif ($2.45, 2 players)
<font color="#cc0000">Hero bets $1</font>, <font color="#cc0000">MP2 raises to $2</font>, Hero calls.
<font color="blue"> I believe i have to bet out here to find out where i am in the hand. </font>

Turn: T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif ($6.45, 2 players)
Hero checks, <font color="#cc0000">MP2 bets $1.7</font>, Hero folds.
Uncalled bets: $1.7 returned to MP2.

Results:
Final pot: $6.45

[LOwrestling2001]

fold when raised on the flop, you have nothing and not much room to improve. this is usually a RR preflop, but this is full ring, im not sure.

[Triggerle]

Pre-flop:
Raise. You take the initiative or make villian fold.

Flop:
Don't donk-bet into the initial raiser. You can raise his cbet if you suspect he didn't hit. If you do want to donk make it proper ($2 or so). Fold to the raise on the flop.

[ciki57]

This is pretty big PF raise. Is this standard from this villain?
If he makes raises like this every hand i would reraise. Otherwise i would fold.

If you just call, youre OOP after the flop and pretty much have to c/f if you don't improve. And even if you get A or K you can lose to AA/KK (at least that's what he's representing)

[kayfish77]

lol check fold flop. raises this size at these stakes are usually QQ+. leading flop is horrible basically you're burning 1/10 of a buyin. he minraises you still have no idea where you are in the hand. what are you hoping for? for him to fold for a 1/2 psb or for him to shove on top? as played instafold turn. preflop is fine bc if u reraise him to 3.30 i can guarantee u hes shoving and then you have to fold /images/graemlins/frown.gif.

[Mal_Pais]

This is often a scared pocket pair, 99-QQ. I like the preflop call. You're OOP, and he's definitely calling a reraise. Besides, his initial raise is so big, you'll have a big chunk of your stack in the pot, he's probably going to push, and you have to hit to continue if he calls.

As played, I check-fold this flop. But if I hit this flop, I'd play for stacks.

[bsheck]

Preflop is fine since your position will be poor after the flop. I hate the flop bet, what information did you end up receiving? Just check it and see what he does.

[Machavelli]

Pop him to 3.75 pre-flop.

If you're going to bet this flop pot it. If he raises at that point probably fold.

Turn, check/fold.

[thegoose420]

[ QUOTE ]
preflop is fine bc if u reraise him to 3.30 i can guarantee u hes shoving and then you have to fold /images/graemlins/frown.gif.

[/ QUOTE ]

What kind of player is villian? If he is real tight preflop, I might consider folding, as a preflop raise that large at this level generally means JJ+. If hes loose, you have to reraise. If he calls, c-bet at least 3/4 of the pot. If he goes all in on the flop I see no problem stacking your chips against a LAG with a monster hand like AKs.

[goat_beard]

i fold this pf and say o well

[Machavelli]

am I missing something? Why are so many people advocating folding a top tier hand pre-flop to a single bet? Villain could be doing this with a very wide range of hands.

Without reads I'm assuming villain is a donk betting TT+, AK, AQ, maybe even AJs.

[Jigsaws]

First time I see this huge raise I just fold. If I have any sort of indication that he's bad, I just shove preflop and make him decide whether he wants to gamble with his pocket pair.

[crushednuts]

Cause he raises 1/10th of our stack and we have no pair and have to play OOP. Do you think we are stacking him if the flop is A82r and he has QQ? Do you think we can fold if the flop is AQ2 and he has QQ? I still don't think i'm folding but I will probably just RR/stack off here and try and out run his QQ.. AA or KK wouldn't raise this big IMO.

[crushednuts]

oh yeah.. and this is FR..

[thegoose420]

[ QUOTE ]
First time I see this huge raise I just fold. If I have any sort of indication that he's bad, I just shove preflop and make him decide whether he wants to gamble with his pocket pair.

[/ QUOTE ]

I posted a reply to this a while ago but think about it again, and just finishing a session where I doubled up with AK about three times, I think there is no way you can not reraise here or just push all in. I spent the last two years playing limit poker (I was decent but on average won only about 2bb/100 playing 1-2 and 2-4) I took about 4 months off from poker and just started again in Feb playing NL. after 7,000 I'm averaging 11.25ptbb/100 and the second best thing I love about NL is being able to go all in with big hands preflop when I feel I have an edge (the first being able to set my opponents odds) With AKs against any pp besides AA or KK, its pretty much a coin flip.

[Gustav]

What the hell?

Push preflop.

[thegoose420]

[ QUOTE ]
What the hell?

Push preflop.

[/ QUOTE ]

Just noticed we registered the same day...

[Spanky1974]

Hard hand to play OOP w/o read on villain. If this is a standard raise from villain, I am just pushing PF. As played you can safely check-fold flop as you might not even be drawing to the best hand. You bet the flop "to find out where i am in the hand" and were raised. I wouldn't even call the raise on flop.

[55555]

I always see players turn over small/mid pocket pair when they do this. I push, you're only behind AA/KK (I think he never has AA/KK there).

[swearengen13]

call the raise preflop cause you dont have position.
On the flop you DONT bet to see where you stand. Its easy! you stand nowhere.

[kabouter]

I would just call/fold.

But I practically never seen a raise as big as this one preflop. That is a $12 raise out of nowhere at 100nl /images/graemlins/smile.gif.

[Lordy]

[ QUOTE ]
I always see players turn over small/mid pocket pair when they do this. I push, you're only behind AA/KK (I think he never has AA/KK there).

[/ QUOTE ]

Uh that's wrong. If villain always has a pocket pair, and always calls a shove pre-flop, shoving AK is a mistake. You ARE behind ALL pocket pairs. You'd need some dead money from limpers to make it correct.

If villain folds some % of his pocket pairs, shoving is correct though.

[chanchuan]

[ QUOTE ]
If hes loose, you have to reraise. If he calls, c-bet at least 3/4 of the pot. If he goes all in on the flop I see no problem stacking your chips against a LAG with a monster hand like AKs.

[/ QUOTE ]
But our hand is just overcards on this flop and its suitedness is no more worth anything and it's so likely that we're against a pp, why on earth would you stack your chips against a LAG on such a flop?

[techballer]

Thanks to everyone for your posts, I realize that betting out after the flop was definately an idiot move. Sorry for not saying explaining earlier that he is a LAG, but this was the largest preflop bet i had seen out of him, he was normaly around 5-8x bb.