TP2K in RIO hell (25NL)

[Montezuma21]

UTG is a 51/22/2.2 over 150 hands v aggressive LAG both pre and post flop. CO is a 14/10/4.4. over 500 hands seems fairly TAG from the little i've seen of him. i've seens him b-3bAI with TPTK on an J98ss board (villain had K9ss), which might be pretty standard. i don't really know what to think of his small flop raise. i think both pre-flop and post-flop plays are very debatable FWIW, so comments appreciated on both.

Full Tilt Poker
$0.10/$0.25 No Limit Hold'em Ring Game
6 Players
LegoPoker Hand Converter (http://www.legopoker.com/hh)

<font color="black">Stack Sizes</font>
BTN: $21.10
Hero (SB): $42.55
BB: $8.9
UTG: $54.35
MP: $20.55
CO: $53.20

<font color="black">Preflop:</font> K/images/graemlins/heart.gif Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif ($0.35, 6 players)
<font color="red">UTG raises to $0.85</font>, MP folds, CO calls $0.85, BTN folds, Hero (???)calls $0.75, BB folds

<font color="black">Flop:</font> J/images/graemlins/diamond.gif 8/images/graemlins/spade.gif K/images/graemlins/spade.gif ($2.8, 3 players)
<font color="red">Hero bets(???) $2.50</font>, UTG folds, <font color="red">CO raises to $6</font>, [i]Hero???

[21SuicideKing21]

PF I'd say since your out of position I don't mind the call, you can argue for a reraise but I don't mind the call. On the flop since you showed your weak so far in the hand, just check to him and see the bet he makes, because I think with this coordinated board you really want to keep this pot small since your out of position with second best kicker. So I think a check call is good here and see what he does on turn. If he bets again on turn then I think you might have to fold depending on bet size, but if he checks then you have best hand.

[CaptUnlucky]

Fold this PF.

Fold to flop raise.

[good_gamble]

[ QUOTE ]
Fold this PF.

Fold to flop raise.

[/ QUOTE ]

Especially to UTG raise

[Sigurd]

UTG is raising 22% of his hands, why on earth would we want to fold to that?

[crushednuts]

KQo + sb + PF UTG raise = Trap unless flop is JT9 rainbow

[svidrigailov]

[ QUOTE ]
UTG is raising 22% of his hands, why on earth would we want to fold to that?

[/ QUOTE ]

OOP, marginal hand. Better to 3-bet if anything I think, but prob not vs. UTG if villain is decent.

[DannyOcean_]

Its marginal bc we are oop, but i think a call is ok pf, given your read that he raises a lot.

I would check/call the turn, you arent the aggressor here, so you want to be able to catch a c-bet, not prvent one. As played, fold to the nit raise.

[Sigurd]

Villain is not decent he is 51/22/2.2, chances that he is a good lag are very, very slim. Also, I seriously doubt that he is positionally aware, and he certainly isn't to an extent, where he makes big adjustments to his preflop raising range.

[jonyy6788]

I fold this preflop in a heartbeat.

The flop: being first to act IS an advantage when you've got an aggro in the middle and a TAG last to act. By checking, you in fact ensure that you will get to see their actions first. Let the aggro idiot make his c-bet, the TAG will then raise or fold most likely. If he folds, you can call aggro's bet. If CO raises, well then it's pretty easy to fold and you've invested nothing on the flop.

[crushednuts]

I don't think KQo is the kind of hand you like to take against a LAG. If he happens to have a better king you can never get away from it. Small pocket pairs are MUCH better. I would def let this go PF because we are OOP. if we were in position against a lag I would probably 3-bet or smooth call depending on who was behind me..

[Jouster777]

Well 22% total is probably about 10% UTG which means we are well behind to start with a hand that plays poorly OOP.

Text results appended to pokerstove.txt

Top 10% villain range:
equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 60.990% 56.40% 04.59% 1216747488 99103698.00 { 88+, A9s+, KTs+, QTs+, AJo+, KQo }
Hand 1: 39.010% 34.42% 04.59% 742548156 99103698.00 { KQo }

When the flop comes down like this we aren't that far ahead of his entire range and the part of the range he RR's us crushes us:
Board: Jd 8s Ks
equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 41.725% 37.87% 03.85% 278578 28341.50 { 88+, A9s+, KTs+, QTs+, AJo+, KQo }
Hand 1: 58.275% 54.42% 03.85% 400309 28341.50 { KQo }


Even if we use the top 22% of hands we are behind to start:
equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 51.348% 48.91% 02.44% 2502185916 124946142.00 { 66+, A3s+, K7s+, Q9s+, J9s+, T9s, A8o+, KTo+, QTo+, JTo }
Hand 1: 48.652% 46.21% 02.44% 2364286152 124946142.00 { KQo }

[Sigurd]

This has actually made me wonder how the maniac loose players play UTG. I just took a look at my Pokertracker.

I haven't had a torough look yes, but so far I'll have to disagree about LAGs raising less from UTG than their mean PFR..

I have found 4 players with an AF of more than 20% and 600-900 hands. All 4 of them them seems to be raising the same as their PFR stat indicates from UTG or MORE. One of them seems to be positionally aware, but his low PFR numbers form the blinds are the reason, that his UTG PRF is still the same as him mean PFR.


btw. I still tend to think that we should play KQo here.

[Vyse]

Definitely fold PF. I am super tight in the SB just because of stuff like this.

Fold to the flop raise, that one should be easy.