50nl TT 3bet awkward flop spot

[Big Poppa Smurf]

Villain is unknown, note the awkward stack sizes here

Full Tilt Poker
$0.25/$0.50 No Limit Hold'em Ring Game
6 Players
LegoPoker Hand Converter (http://www.legopoker.com/hh)

<font color="black">Stack Sizes</font>
UTG: $70.15
MP: $21.90
CO: $59
BTN: $22
SB: $155.6
Hero (BB): $49.5

<font color="black">Preflop:</font> T/images/graemlins/heart.gif T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif ($0.75, 6 players)
UTG folds, <font color="red">MP raises to $1.50</font>, CO folds, BTN folds, SB folds, <font color="red">Hero raises to $5</font>, MP calls $3.50

<font color="black">Flop:</font> J/images/graemlins/spade.gif K/images/graemlins/club.gif Q/images/graemlins/club.gif ($10.25, 2 players)
<font color="red">Hero ?

edit to cut out flop action

[noob_sauce]

check and pray for a micro bet/free card? I think I tend to fire off 3/4 pot here, but looking at it objectively that can't be correct... I don't know... I will be checking for others responses... f'ing ugly spot whether in or out of position

[cb4mvp]

If my math is correct, pot is $10.25 with villain having $17 in his stack. If we bet 3/4 pot (making the pot roughly the size of his stack), how do we proceed when he comes back over the top with his final $10? Seems like we're compelled to call when he pushes $10 more into what has become a $40 pot, right?

I believe checking to see his reaction and hoping to get a free card is fine, but what I would rather do here is probably push. Rather than pricing ourselves into making this call, let's put the decision on him. Even if he calls, we have still have 8 outs. Feedback plz, as I'm new to 2p2 and just trying out this hand analysis thing /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Xanta]

check/fold has got to be right here. He has a lower pp some of the time but the rest of his range has you killed and he's not folding anything that beats you for the pot sized bet left in his stack.

Push here is pretty bad in my experience as shorties tend to call light rather than fold big hands. You're never folding a king here and probably not a queen either. You're correct about having 8-10 outs here but pushing still is no good since we have very little fold equity.

[Rollos]

This is absolutely a check/fold.
If his stack had been around $40-50 then I could see a c-bet being profitable.

[cb4mvp]

Question:

With a hand like TT against a shortstack, is it ever appropriate to just call his raise preflop and then see what develops on the flop? Since when we reraise preflop, we put ourselves in an uncomfortable situation when the flop comes with overs like this, it seems like just calling and keeping the pot small may be the best way to proceed? Just a thought.

After rereading my post and those following me, I have to admit my analysis was pretty poor. I prefer to put pressure on my opponents whenever possible, but you guys are right, this isn't a very good spot for it.

[Big Poppa Smurf]

cb,

many times we won't have 8 outs since he will have ak, or a set if he calls. so if he has ak, we only have 7 against redraws, and if he has a set he has redraws if we hit. so we're never drawing as live as we think we are.

I thought about just calling preflop but OOP I would rather 3-bet here especially since I don't mind calling an ai here against an unknown shortstacker. I'll admit that I can't play so well postflop if it is something like K52 so I take the easier position preflop and mix in the other one sometime to challenge myself and learn. Usually if I'm running well.

Anyways the issue here is that I don't want to fold my draw, but if I bet or check, either way I think I need to fold.

[Genz]

I think a cbet is a waste of money. I check and look how much he bets. Playing such a draw from oop is extremely awkward, because you either put a lot of money in the middle against a better hand or you have to show a ton of weakness on the turn when you check after you are called on the flop. And it's not unlikely that he pushes when you bet. OTOH he probably would have pushed preflop with KK,AA, AK. So you actually might be ahead of a smaller PP here. So you have him either crushed or you are drawing to like 6 or 7 outs (with the latter being more likely). I check and call a moderate bet.

[21SuicideKing21]

Well he probably would have pushed with AK, QQ, JJ, AA, and KK, so he might have something like KQ, KJ, or even maybe a smaller pp. Also his line would be helpful to making a play here. For the flop, I think you're going for stacks here, because hes got 15 left and you have 5 invested in, so I would say you bet around 3/4 of the pot to either pick it up or then your forced into a call for a open ended straight draw.

[Unknown Soldier]

horrible board to cbet on c/f nearly every time regardless of stacks