NL10-AJs in BB. linecheck *cashgamenoob*

[diditmyway]

Im new on the table so no reads except that i reraised villian 5BB from BB last round when he limped into me from Sb (He folded)

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (5 handed) Hand History Converter Tool (http://poker-tools.flopturnriver.com/Hand-Converter.php) from FlopTurnRiver.com (http://www.flopturnriver.com) (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Button ($13.90)
SB ($5.45)
Hero ($10.05)
UTG ($9.75)
MP ($2.30)

Preflop: Hero is BB with J/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
<font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">SB raises to $0.2</font>, Hero calls $0.10.

Flop: ($0.40) J/images/graemlins/club.gif, 9/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 8/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets $0.5</font>, Hero calls $0.50.

Turn: ($1.40) 6/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets $1.3</font>, Hero calls $1.30.

River: ($4) 8/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets $1.2</font>, Hero calls $1.20.

Final Pot: $6.40

Since i didnt know where i was in the hand i just decided to check/call it out. Looking at it now folding pf or reraisning pf makes more sense. any thoughts?

[Sean Fraley]

If it is folded to the SB and he makes a minraise, I'm 3-betting 45o. AJs is a definite 3-bet against what could be a poorly executed steal attempt.

Calling the flop isn't going to help you find out where you are. You have TPTK so raise him here. If you get raised, fold. If you get called, start thinking about controlling the size of the pot. I should point out that his flop overbet looks kind of fishy, so this might easily be jack-rag, someone who paired an eight or nine, or a straight draw.

[diditmyway]

what is this 3 betting and 4 betting? does that mean betting 3 times his raise (20*3=60 cents) and 4 times his raise?

[allaboutmyfetti]

other than not 3-bin pf, I htink you played it fine.

[98Suited]

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what is this 3 betting and 4 betting? does that mean betting 3 times his raise (20*3=60 cents) and 4 times his raise?

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It's from limit. one guy raises(puts in second bet/2-bets) and now you can but in the third bet (3-bet) and so on.

So what they're saying is re-raise pf

[Check_The_Nuts]

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Calling the flop isn't going to help you find out where you are. You have TPTK so raise him here. If you get raised, fold. If you get called, start thinking about controlling the size of the pot. I should point out that his flop overbet looks kind of fishy, so this might easily be jack-rag, someone who paired an eight or nine, or a straight draw.

[/ QUOTE ]

your reasoning is flawed man. Bla bla bla raise flop for information bla bla. This sucks, calling down is fine. Hopefully he picked up a draw on the turn or something and decided to 3barrell. The drawiness of the board probably makes him want to bet lighter, but I dunno...

plus, TPTK in blind battle is the nuts.

edit: lol draw got there. Yeah river is close cuz of that.

[allaboutmyfetti]

jeebus, can't there be a sticky or somethin that says "RAISING TO FIND OUT WHERE YOU ARE IS TEH SUCK" ?

[Sean Fraley]

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jeebus, can't there be a sticky or somethin that says "PLAYING LIKE A CALLING STATION BECAUSE THE BOARD IS SCARY IS TEH SUCK" ?

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FYP.

No, seriously. You really need to start seeing if you should get away from this hand as early as possible. Raising to $1.50 on the flop and folding to a reraise is cheaper than what Hero paid by showdown.

[Thremp]

Sean Fraley,

You know it makes AA really easy to just open push preflop.

[Sean Fraley]

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Sean Fraley,

You know it makes AA really easy to just open push preflop.

[/ QUOTE ]

Because we all know how similar these two situations are. Wait, no they're not.

Open pushing AA preflop wouldn't count as a mistake, just a move that loses value from almost anyone but maniacs. Calling it down to showdown with TPTK if you are behind is a mistake. Villain is acting as if he wants money in the pot, and Hero's play is basically saying "OK, here is some money". In addition to this, every card that hits makes this board look even worse. When you get down to it, NL is a game about decisions, and to make decisions you need information. All we know in this hand is that our hand is mediocre, and villain looks intent on getting money in the pot. If you guys want to play it this way fine, but I think that constantly doing this in these situations will get OP cornholed over the long term.

[allaboutmyfetti]

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jeebus, can't there be a sticky or somethin that says "PLAYING LIKE A CALLING STATION BECAUSE THE BOARD IS SCARY IS TEH SUCK" ?

[/ QUOTE ]

FYP.

No, seriously. You really need to start seeing if you should get away from this hand as early as possible. Raising to $1.50 on the flop and folding to a reraise is cheaper than what Hero paid by showdown.

[/ QUOTE ]

I can think of a number of places where "playing like a calling station" is ++EV, but not any where raising soley for information is. Raising for value / to protect / semibluff are the usual reasons I raise.

Also, in this hand, there are a ton of draws / combo draws that are going to 3bai in the flop forcing us to fold when we could have 50% or more pot equity (which is what makes pushing these draws, from villian's perspective, so profitable). Also, if villian flat calls our flop raise, we have not really gained any new "information" about the hand, other than that we had villian crushed (in which case we're forcing him to do the right thing by folding).

If i'm going to put in another $1.50 I would rather it go in on a safe-ish turn when our equity against villian's range goes up.

[Thremp]

Sean Fraley,

You lack an understanding of EV. I suggest brushing up on that, and trying again.

[crushednuts]

Normally your raise will never be solely for information.

Here he has TPTK. Raising will not only gain him some value, but will give him a clue as to where he stands in the hand. Another jack will probably just call and a set will open push plus he might get called by some drawing hands. I don't think a raise on the flop here is -EV at these stakes. I think the villain will call very often with a second best hand. A raise on the turn, as played, definitely would gain value from worse hands AND give you information AND make it more expensive for a draw (his bet may very well be a blocker). I think my favorite line here is call the flop and raise a blank turn. If the villain pushes i will rely on my reads to tell me something. I wouldn't just let a river card peel off that can put me to a tough decision for most of my monies w/ just TPTK

[Vyse]

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I think my favorite line here is call the flop and raise a blank turn. If the villain pushes i will rely on my reads to tell me something. I wouldn't just let a river card peel off that can put me to a tough decision for most of my monies w/ just TPTK

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I like this line a lot

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Calling the flop isn't going to help you find out where you are. You have TPTK so raise him here. If you get raised, fold. If you get called, start thinking about controlling the size of the pot. I should point out that his flop overbet looks kind of fishy, so this might easily be jack-rag, someone who paired an eight or nine, or a straight draw.

[/ QUOTE ]

your reasoning is flawed man. Bla bla bla raise flop for information bla bla. This sucks, calling down is fine. Hopefully he picked up a draw on the turn or something and decided to 3barrell. The drawiness of the board probably makes him want to bet lighter, but I dunno...

plus, TPTK in blind battle is the nuts.

edit: lol draw got there. Yeah river is close cuz of that.

[/ QUOTE ]

This guy also has to be the best poster in this forum, him and Matrix. plz listen to him

[Sean Fraley]

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This guy also has to be the best poster in this forum, him and Matrix. plz listen to him

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Vyse, that is hands down the best compliment I have gotten all year. Thank you.

[Vyse]

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This guy also has to be the best poster in this forum, him and Matrix. plz listen to him

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Vyse, that is hands down the best compliment I have gotten all year. Thank you.

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I was referring to Check the Nuts. I have no idea who you are -- no offense.

[Sean Fraley]

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This guy also has to be the best poster in this forum, him and Matrix. plz listen to him

[/ QUOTE ]

Vyse, that is hands down the best compliment I have gotten all year. Thank you.

[/ QUOTE ]

I was referring to Check the Nuts. I have no idea who you are -- no offense.

[/ QUOTE ]

*ssssssssssssssss*

(That was the sound of my ego deflating).