Pokertracker W$SD 48.5% and winning

I have played 32k hands at 10NL and 10k hands at 25NL on Stars with a 48.5% W$ at showdown. I`m probably calling down to many hands. I wondered if there are other players who have sub 50% won at showdown and are winning players ?

Comments appreciated

[Entropy4]

I think this is possible at $10NL. I started at $10NL and was 48-50% at showdown and a consistent winner from the get-go over about 15k hands. Since I've moved up to $25NL, I quickly learned to make more laydowns before becoming profitable at that level. I didn't become profitable at $25NL until I got to 52-53%, and I know for a fact I still make bad calls on the river.

But theoretically, it depends on the pots you're showing down on. If you're losing the small ones and winning the big ones, then a percentage below 50% could be profitable in the long run. My intuition tells me that this doesn't happen much in practice. I'd be curious to see what the showdown percentage of much better players are.

When I`m winning I usualy play long sessions 3 to 8 hrs and building huge stacks. So I think most profit comes from winning Big stacks.

[Entropy4]

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When I`m winning I usualy play long sessions 3 to 8 hrs and building huge stacks. So I think most profit comes from winning Big stacks.

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That would definitely explain your profitability then. I also think that 10NL players don't push their good hands nearly far enough. A lot of them will do stupid stuff like min bet with the nuts, so you can get away with showing down for only a dime.

[Entropy4]

Just happened upon this in another thread.

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I just heard a player on a 5 buy in heater ,at FT 25NL explain the simplicity of being a micro stakes pro. I looked him up - (50/2/.8) - Win % @showdown 90%.

Now if I can only get my showdown win % off of this stupid 58%.

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A pro at 90% at 25NL a guy complaining about 58%. Looks like we're a couple of calling stations cleaner! /images/graemlins/smile.gif

yeah, lol. well my winrate at 10NL was acceptable 6.5bb/100 pt. But at 25NL over 10K hands it`s very low 2bb/100. I have to work on that as well as leaking from the blinds.

90% won at showdown is a leak IMO. probably giving up to easy, and that should be exploitable.

[Hank Scorpio]

Cleaner, sorry but can't relate to your specific question...but, I have a question for you. Do you know of any good guides to what constitutes "good" stats in poker tracker. I know this forum has a nice thread by Poker, but it sorta only talks about PF / position raising...?

I think Pokey`s post is very good regarding analizing Pokertracker. I don`t know any other more in deep guide. I`m pretty lazy too, I know some of my leaks and haven`t worked to fix them as I should. I know I should analize my game more and work on the leaks one at a time to become a better player.

[chuckleslovakian]

I'm at 49.52 W$SD and 10BB/100

[kabouter]

Don't have my old database, but my last 4k hands I've been in the 50%-60% range. This is at 25nl and 50nl, but like said before, if people are minbetting with the nuts, it's easier to see the showdown.

[corsakh]

I would only probably see half the number of showdowns I currently see if people bet a little more.

[LegallyBlind]

most winning players have a w$sd of right around 50%. and many slightly below 50%. if your W$SD is more than 55% your def. folding too much

[bozzer]

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I would only probably see half the number of showdowns I currently see if people bet a little more.

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Yeah. I often wonder if my low W$DS% at 5nl is due to the cheap SDs I see all the time after I cbet and check it down or something. On the other hand I am a complete station with top 2 pair +.

Check out Pokey's voluntary stats survey post (pinned in SSNL) for ranges of winning players.

[Phytopath]

At NL50 over about 50k hands my W$SD is 50.07, and I am a significant winner.

You make profits when you do win by winning bigger pots. I call alot of small river bets. If you are calling big bets on the river and only winning 50% of SDs then you do have a problem. Otherwise don't stress it. The other thing is you are probably taking down alot of pots on earlier streets, which leads to ----> lower W$SD.

[KurtSF]

If W$SD is between 40 and 60 its fine. Different styles will vary within that range. LAGs lower (they make a lot of money without showing down), Rocks higher (fold without the nuts), and TAGs in the middle. A certain number (be it 47% or 50% or 58%) doesn't necessarily indicate a problem. You need to take it in context with you other stats, style, and hand reading and decision-making abilities.