Taking down the pot

[SCBielski]

After grinding out this table for about an hour, it became clear that these guys were regular donks and had a tendency to get a little bit out of line on the flop. Our villain had now raised about five or six c-bets on the flop after calling a preflop raise in position. I began to think that perhaps he was simply calling in position with the intentions of raising any c-bet, so I decided to make a stand here. Our villain is running 42/11/2.15 over 100 hands, any thoughts?

Ultimate Bet No-Limit Hold'em, $.10 BB (5 handed) Hand History Converter Tool (http://poker-tools.flopturnriver.com/Hand-Converter.php) from FlopTurnRiver.com (http://www.flopturnriver.com) (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Villain (Button) $18.57.
SB $30.02.
BB $10.18.
UTG $6.28.
MP $19.01.
Hero (CO) $13.39.

Hero has A/images/graemlins/club.gif5/images/graemlins/diamond.gif

Preflop:

UTG folds. MP folds. Hero raises to $.35. Villain calls. SB folds. BB folds.

Flop: ($0.15) A/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 6/images/graemlins/heart.gif, J/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>

Hero bets $.65. Villain raises to $2. Hero re-raises to $6.65. Villain folds. Hero is returned $4.65 (uncalled).

Final Pot: $4.61

[RollTide77]

Am I the only one folding this PF?

[Triggerle]

Nah, it's fine to raise this from the CO if the Button and Blinds are not calling stations. This is dependend on table dynamics, though, and I wouldn't do it before I have a feel for what I can get away with.

I personally don't like the flop line because you have to be successful very often to make up for losing the $7 if he pushes. However, against the right opponent you can do this.

If your A is a /images/graemlins/heart.gif you have to be prepared to call an AI raise.

Edit: I just noticed that this is impossible. Disregard my last sentence.

[RickA]

I wouldn't be raising A5o here if I new for certain I was getting called as you seem to be. Isn't part of the value of that kind of hand the fold equity.

[Triggerle]

I missed that OP expected to be called. If this is the case then fold PF.

[SCBielski]

I wouldn't say I was expecting a call, just that this guy knew what he was doing from the button. Also, I'm pretty calculated in these kinds of PFRs, so I checked out SB fold %, BB fold % ect. I thought this was a great play at the time, but afterwards felt that was a results oriented view. I'm not so sure about it anymore because of the liklihood of a shove. Any more comments?

[Sean Fraley]

[ QUOTE ]
Am I the only one folding this PF?

[/ QUOTE ]

With villain's VP$IP of 42%, I'm folding this too. Open-raising ace-rag in the cutoff only makes sense as a steal attempt, and a villain playing that many hands is cold-calling enough to make stealing not worth the risk with this hand.
With the read, flop is fine. When people start repeatedly playing back at c-bets, you need to start thinking harder at what constitutes "being ahead", and be willing to push smaller edges. Top pair is probably good here, though I might wait for a dryer board before making a stand.

[KurtSF]

*grunch*

Fold preflop.

Next time you decide to take a stand, make sure you have a hand.

Only part of this hand that was OK was the lead on the flop. Every other decision, before and after, should have been a fold.

$0.02

[Unknown Soldier]

ditto

[bmk67]

I'm folding this preflop. I'll raise with a lot of hands out of the CO, but an unsuited ace rag is not one of them. Fold preflop, please.

As played, meh. I avoid these kind of situations when I can. I'd lead here but RRAI is really a bluff. I'd probably b/f and look for a better spot.

[SCBielski]

[ QUOTE ]
*grunch*

Fold preflop.

Next time you decide to take a stand, make sure you have a hand.

Only part of this hand that was OK was the lead on the flop. Every other decision, before and after, should have been a fold.

$0.02

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm getting mixed comments. Are you saying to not take a stand without a monster? I feel that if I play like this I'm just setting myself up to fold out after most PFRs and ultimately play a nitty -EV game. After that raise I established a pretty good metagame and really didn't see much resistance from our villain.

[bmk67]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm getting mixed comments. Are you saying to not take a stand without a monster?

[/ QUOTE ]

I wouldn't say that, and I don't think anyone else has said that either. With reads, making a stand without a monster is OK. However, A5o is a crappy, easily dominated hand and putting your stack on the line with TPNK on a 3-flush board is maniacal.

[AKQJ10]

[ QUOTE ]
Isn't part of the value of that kind of hand the fold equity.

[/ QUOTE ]

Part, yes, but part is the fact that it stands to be near the top among four random hands.

I wouldn't want to take A5 to a four-handed flop, even with 3rd-best absolute position, but if you knew one CS in particular would call with much any face card it's probably fine to raise. If he'll fold unless he flops a pair or two overcards, even better. If he'll call with any pair but give you free cards to pair your ace, that's fine too.

You have to be pretty confident in your postflop abilities, though. Then your raise is for value, not as a steal.