NL10- Combo draw on paired board

[youthies]

Readless, is this standard?

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (4 handed) Hand History Converter Tool (http://poker-tools.flopturnriver.com/Hand-Converter.php) from FlopTurnRiver.com (http://www.flopturnriver.com) (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Hero ($9.90)
BB ($2.75)
UTG ($6)
Button ($12.10)

Preflop: Hero is SB with 9/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, J/images/graemlins/diamond.gif. UTG posts a blind of $0.10.
UTG (poster) checks, Button calls $0.10, Hero completes, BB checks.

Flop: ($0.40) Q/images/graemlins/club.gif, Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 8/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $0.4</font>, BB folds, UTG calls $0.40, <font color="#CC3333">Button raises to $0.8</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $2.75</font>, UTG folds, <font color="#CC3333">Button raises to $4.7</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $12.15</font>, Button calls $5.10.

Final Pot: $22.75

[Acein8ter]

Standard??? Your on a FD with a J high... The texture of the board is not that good for you with 2 Q's. Button must have a Qx.
IMO, it's better to call the 3bet instead of 4 betting. Your dead without a diamond or your inside str8 T.

[Esmerelda]

This is not my favorite spot to make this move but it is not a bad play at theses stakes just high variance.

You need fold equity to make the pushetting +ev play and if he has the queen he isn't folding and you are a solid dog (not a big one but definitely behind)

When Button raises me I figure either he has the queen or he thinks I am trying to buy the pot. The first raise is a good move but you could call if you are confident he will pay off on the turn.

I call when he 4bets because I am hoping he puts me on a weaker Q and pays off the when FD hits. Villains wont put you on FD here very often.

[youthies]

Okay, so it would be better to play these draws more passively (check/calling) at these stakes?

[Unknown Soldier]

definitely

[Esmerelda]

I wouldn't generalize that way. You should expect fewer people to fold so push does not have as much FE.

This is a particularly bad flop for it. You don't have any overcards, your only on a gutshot/SD and your villain looks trippy.

[Numfar]

[ QUOTE ]
Okay, so it would be better to play these draws more passively (check/calling) at these stakes?

[/ QUOTE ]
On a paired board you could already be dead. Sure it's unlikely but possible. After that, the card that gives you a flush or straight could also cost you your stack.

The min raise from the villain means he's got a Q a lot. Therefore, you have no fold equity (which makes these plays profitable) and should just call.

This play without a paired board is often fine. BTW, once you 4-bet and get 5-betted (?), your push is probably correct - just needed to be more cautious up until then.

[bozzer]

Might think about a steal PF, but probably wouldn't without specific read on the UTG limper.

Leading for pot here is ok, but as it's a paired board I prefer a check-raise, repping the Q more strongly (to your typical player at this level). Obviously we can call the minraise, and I don't mind a raise either since his minraise might be 'have you really got a Q buddy?'. What concerns me is your next raise. Now he has a Q nearly everytime. He's not folding, and we are well (31%-68%) behind.

Pot odds? My rough calculation puts it at 2/11 = 18%, so it might just be worth calling to see the turn then reassess when he bets (most likely a fold). But be aware that a button limper is looking to pair his kicker for the nuts, and a T might well be what he's looking for, and one of your flush outs (but you don't know which) is also not an out. So there's quite a see-sawing of implied odds versus RIO going on, but I reckon you should probably fold this.

Combo draws are nice when you're facing top pair, cos you have a coinflip+FE. Here, you have neither.

Simulation from ProPokerTools: http://www.propokertools.com/simulator/s...amp;h4=&amp;h5= (http://www.propokertools.com/simulator/simulate.jsp?g=he&amp;b=QcQd8d&amp;h1=Jd9d&amp;h2=Q*&amp;h3=&amp;h4=&amp;h 5=)