50NL 6max: TPGK OOP. How did I play this one?

[OtZman]

No reads. Am I playing this too weak? I'm trying to keep the pot small with a weak hand. At the same time I feel it's better to let villain keep on betting with worse hands than betting myself and making all his worse hands fold. Please comment on all streets.



Prima Poker skin
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.25/$0.50
6 players
Converter (http://www.neildewhurst.com/hand-converter)

Stack sizes:
UTG: $56.67
UTG+1: $32.60
CO: $51.75
Button: $35.75
SB: $55.62
Hero: $49.55

Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is BB with Q/images/graemlins/club.gif K/images/graemlins/club.gif
3 folds, <font color="#cc0000">Button raises to $2</font>, SB folds, Hero calls.

Flop: 6/images/graemlins/heart.gif 7/images/graemlins/diamond.gif K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif ($4.25, 2 players)
Hero checks, <font color="#cc0000">Button bets $2.12</font>, Hero calls.

Turn: 3/images/graemlins/club.gif ($8.49, 2 players)
Hero checks, <font color="#cc0000">Button bets $4.24</font>, Hero calls.

River: 3/images/graemlins/diamond.gif ($16.97, 2 players)
Hero checks, Button checks.

Results:
Final pot: $16.97

[Unknown Soldier]

i think you played it fine

[OtZman]

Ok, thanks, good to know. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

As I played a while back I probably would've lead out on the flop, most likely resulting in either a fold from all villains worse hands and me winning a small pot, or a call/raise from villain with better hands and me losing a big pot having a hard time laying down TPGK.

[ QUOTE ]
i think you played it fine

[/ QUOTE ]
Do others agree?

[Rollos]

Looks good. This line will lose the minimum against hands that have you outkicked and win the maximum from lesser kings and mid pocket pairs.

[sanfranfreako]

What? You dont get long run value from leading the flop? What about the draws?

[Dans Full]

[ QUOTE ]
i think you played it fine

[/ QUOTE ]

[Panthro]

[ QUOTE ]
What? You dont get long run value from leading the flop? What about the draws?

[/ QUOTE ]

So you lead the flop and get raised, are we folding? And if we lead and he folds, then I guess we lost value from a weaker hand/air. And we can't exactly price him out from drawing with a flop bet...

nh OP.

[flair1239]

I think that is a fine way to play the hand.

Sometimes I will lead out the turn though, for a couple reasons. I don't really want to have to call a pot sized bet, and leading out lets me "name my price" so to speak. Also in the event he is on a draw, it does not let him check behind. Also it gives you another way to play top pair, and in a long session sometimes helps open up other options on your bigger hands.

[KEW]

[ QUOTE ]
No reads. Am I playing this too weak? I'm trying to keep the pot small with a weak hand. At the same time I feel it's better to let villain keep on betting with worse hands than betting myself and making all his worse hands fold. Please comment on all streets.



Prima Poker skin
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.25/$0.50
6 players
Converter (http://www.neildewhurst.com/hand-converter)

Stack sizes:
UTG: $56.67
UTG+1: $32.60
CO: $51.75
Button: $35.75
SB: $55.62
Hero: $49.55

Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is BB with Q/images/graemlins/club.gif K/images/graemlins/club.gif
3 folds, <font color="#cc0000">Button raises to $2</font>, SB folds, Hero calls.

Flop: 6/images/graemlins/heart.gif 7/images/graemlins/diamond.gif K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif ($4.25, 2 players)
Hero checks, <font color="#cc0000">Button bets $2.12</font>, Hero calls.

Turn: 3/images/graemlins/club.gif ($8.49, 2 players)
Hero checks, <font color="#cc0000">Button bets $4.24</font>, Hero calls.

River: 3/images/graemlins/diamond.gif ($16.97, 2 players)
Hero checks, Button checks.

Results:
Final pot: $16.97

[/ QUOTE ]

Against all but the tightest raisers I will 3 bet KQs vs a button open raise..KQs is well ahead of a buttons open raising hand range..

As played lead the river for 1/2 PSB fold if raised..Villains flop and turn bets are so weak I would like to get some added value..Your play will look suspicious enough(betting a missed draw) to get paid off by many smaller pairs and all weaker kings..By leading river with a "blocker/value" bet you avoid a tough decision should villain make a PSB..Most villains would only raise your river bet with there strongest hands like sets..Should you be raised you can fold with complete confidence..

[OtZman]

[ QUOTE ]
Also it gives you another way to play top pair, and in a long session sometimes helps open up other options on your bigger hands.

[/ QUOTE ]
Another way to play top pair, do you mean as opposed to just checking? Would you also please explain a bit further the other options this play would help open up for bigger hands, I don't quite understand. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Also, what should I do on the river if my turn bet is called? What if it's raised?

[ QUOTE ]
Against all but the tightest raisers I will 3 bet KQs vs a button open raise..KQs is well ahead of a buttons open raising hand range..

[/ QUOTE ]
I feel quite uncomfortable 3-betting OOP. If I do 3-bet, how should I then proceed with the hand? In the same way as I did without the 3-bet, c/c and perhaps putting in ~1/2 pot sized bets on turn and/or river?

[ QUOTE ]
As played lead the river for 1/2 PSB fold if raised..Villains flop and turn bets are so weak I would like to get some added value..Your play will look suspicious enough(betting a missed draw) to get paid off by many smaller pairs and all weaker kings..By leading river with a "blocker/value" bet you avoid a tough decision should villain make a PSB..Most villains would only raise your river bet with there strongest hands like sets..Should you be raised you can fold with complete confidence..

[/ QUOTE ]
This makes sense, especially considering villain made quite weak 1/2 pot sized bets on both flop and turn.

[KEW]

3 betting this PF will help prevent you from laying the best hand down on the flop when you both miss..It will also let you get away cheaper most often when you are dominated..You will more time then not take the pot down PF..3 betting will also make the table think twice before trying to steal or raise your blind allowing you to see more flops and win that monster pot with the famous BB special..

As for playing the hand post flop when you hit I will generally but not always check..In RR pot I am checking a greater then usual % of the time..But will C-bet more often when I miss as long as no Ace flops..There is no shame in C/F when you miss this flop..

[OtZman]

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3 betting this PF will help prevent you from laying the best hand down on the flop when you both miss..

[/ QUOTE ]
I'm sorry, but I don't quite understand this one. Is it because villain almost never will bet on the flop, if he misses, when/if I check?

Also, how much should I 3 bet here? Would ~$7 be good?

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As for playing the hand post flop when you hit I will generally but not always check..In RR pot I am checking a greater then usual % of the time..But will C-bet more often when I miss as long as no Ace flops..There is no shame in C/F when you miss this flop..

[/ QUOTE ]
What if I hit the flop (after 3 betting), like I did in this hand, check and then villain bet, say a PSB. Is it just a call?

[Sir Winalot]

I guess calling preflop is fine readless, but usually I'd 3-bet a button raiser with the slightest read and sometimes without one too. I think c/c flop is good, but I'll usually lead a safe turn for ~3/4-pot.

[ QUOTE ]
What? You dont get long run value from leading the flop? What about the draws?

[/ QUOTE ]
By checking the flop we get value from villains continuation-bets. Also, if we lead the flop into the preflop raiser we're letting him play the flop more or less perfectly: he'll fold his missed hands, doesn't lose money by c-betting and call or raise us with his made hands, most of which are better than ours.

[lacrymosa]

looks good. if you lost, then you lost the absolute minimum and saw a showdown.

[kitchma]

[ QUOTE ]
I guess calling preflop is fine readless, but usually I'd 3-bet a button raiser with the slightest read and sometimes without one too. I think c/c flop is good, but I'll usually lead a safe turn for ~3/4-pot.

[ QUOTE ]
What? You dont get long run value from leading the flop? What about the draws?

[/ QUOTE ]
By checking the flop we get value from villains continuation-bets. Also, if we lead the flop into the preflop raiser we're letting him play the flop more or less perfectly: he'll fold his missed hands, doesn't lose money by c-betting and call or raise us with his made hands, most of which are better than ours.

[/ QUOTE ]

what's our play if he calls our turn bet? Do we lead on the river and fold to a raise or just check/call?

[OtZman]

[ QUOTE ]
what's our play if he calls our turn bet? Do we lead on the river and fold to a raise or just check/call?

[/ QUOTE ]
Good question.

[Low_Card2]

i like.