QQ, drawy board, turn bet sizes etc.

[AdamL]

BB is LP.

I know my hand isn't that strong here, but I'm not sure what else to do given their range and what they might call with.

Party Poker
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.10/$0.25
5 players
Converter (http://www.neildewhurst.com/hand-converter)

Pre-flop: (5 players) Hero is UTG with Q/images/graemlins/heart.gif Q/images/graemlins/spade.gif
<font color="#cc0000">Hero raises to $1</font>, CO calls, 2 folds, BB calls.

Flop: 7/images/graemlins/diamond.gif 9/images/graemlins/spade.gif J/images/graemlins/diamond.gif ($3.1, 3 players)
BB checks, <font color="#cc0000">Hero bets $2.5</font>, <font color="#cc0000">CO raises to $5</font>, BB calls, Hero calls.

Turn: 4/images/graemlins/club.gif ($18.1, 3 players)
BB checks, Hero checks, <font color="#cc0000">CO bets $5</font>, BB calls, <font color="#cc0000">Hero raises all-in $19.35</font>

[Genz]

BB looks like he is chasing something. CO makes a VERY small bet on the turn on this draw-heavy board after his minraise gets called on the flop in 2 spots and a blank hits on the turn. I think you have a good chance here that both opponents are drawing. To increase fold equity, I'd open push, though.

[AdamL]

Do we know enough to open push before seeing that puny bet and the call?

[Genz]

Hm. Good question. Probably not. So my thinking is probably biased. The problem that I see is, that after the bet and the call the pot is $28 big. BB seems to be willing to call big bets to draw (he calls a bet and a raise on the flop). So if he has a big hand, he won't fold anyway (like a flopped straight or a stupid set). If he has a draw, he will probably still call, considering his actions on the flop. So either way, I don't think you have enough fold equity against BOTH opponent to reraise all-in here. I just call and hope for a blank on the river. I then might block or check and hope, BB doesn't wake up with a flopped monster and pushes me off my hand.

[Jouster777]

[ QUOTE ]
Hm. Good question. Probably not. So my thinking is probably biased. The problem that I see is, that after the bet and the call the pot is $28 big. BB seems to be willing to call big bets to draw (he calls a bet and a raise on the flop). So if he has a big hand, he won't fold anyway (like a flopped straight or a stupid set). If he has a draw, he will probably still call, considering his actions on the flop. So either way, I don't think you have enough fold equity against BOTH opponent to reraise all-in here. I just call and hope for a blank on the river. I then might block or check and hope, BB doesn't wake up with a flopped monster and pushes me off my hand.

[/ QUOTE ]I can see donking the turn here but not pushing. We aren't interested in FE as any FE only comes from worse hands. I agree with Genz that at least one villain drawing here but I'm not sure why we would consider having a draw call as a bad thing here...the small turn bet makes for a nice CRAI situation. I can't fold given the action so pushing is an obvious action as played.

[HitNRunPoster]

if you're just getting into NL for the first time, probably best to play tight and stick to the full ring tables.

most people disagree, though.

[HitNRunPoster]

the guy that you should be worried about in this hand is the CO, at least until the small turn bet.

someone said open push to get FE -- that's crap. If you open push you want calls from hands that you would normally have FE against when you open push.

I'd open push for value and to prevent free cards, with the assumption that villain has a small range of hands but one that creates enough value to do this.

pushing the flop is really bad because it allows draws to come along profitably.

[HitNRunPoster]

[ QUOTE ]
Do we know enough to open push before seeing that puny bet and the call?

[/ QUOTE ]

if you're not going to open push the turn you'd be best to fold the flop

edit: at least I think so... tough to say if you should peel getting 6:1 just to draw to favourable turn action. The problem is that we don't know how villain will play the turn, he may see this as a green light for AJ to push, in which case calling the flop is a disaster. I think it's probably best to muck this on the flop if you're checking the turn...